To ban her DD?

[LauraJenson]

I have 3DD, 17, 15, 12 and a DS, 5 with ASD.

We have an above ground pool in the garden that my teens and their friends have been using on a daily basis for the past 2 weeks and even though it was cloudy today, I had teens going in and out of the garden all day.

They were using the gate, so unless I entered the kitchen or looked out of the upper level windows, I couldn't see who was there or what was going on.

We have rules in place, e.g not to use the pool until it's 11 in the morning, 3 friends max each at one time and no more etc and my DDs have rarely broken them as it would mean they just can't use it any more.

Took DS out for the day, came home absolutely exhausted this evening to have a woman I'd never seen waiting for me.

She was one of the mother's of a girl that DD3 (12 year old) had brought home.

The Mum was pretty furious as she didn't know where her DD (also 12) had been all day, did I not watch over my kids?

Surely if a strange child was in my home I should have asked if their parents knew they were here?

Their were also 2 boys in the pool (12 and 15) and she went on about how inappropriate it was for them to be swimming alone with a group of girls.

I was too shocked and too tired to really say anything back, I said I knew the boys and didn't have a problem with them, apologied as I just assumed teens would ask their parent before going to a strangers house and it wouldn't happen again as I'd keep an eye out for her DD and send her straight back if I saw her again.

She seemed surprised and her DD got really upset but I just said goodbye and went inside.

I doubt her DD will ever return but if she does would it BU to just send her home and tell DD3 not to bring her around.

Backforgood: Pretty Much

Chillyegg : it looks like one of these (Pic Attached

I don't think it's much to worry about but I am aware that people can drown in very little water.

The whole supervision thing is beside the point.

But, wasn't there a 17 year old there too?

Rose, yeah their was a 17 year old and 2 15 year olds, which I think is sufficient

Regardless of criminal or tortious liability, if a tragedy was to happen, would you really want this on your conscience? On your child's conscience? I can't imagine leaving the house for an entire day, knowing that anyone could be at my home, in my pool, and that anything could happen. I can't imagine giving my 17 year old, however many of them there were, the responsibility for looking after an unknown number and identity of 12 year olds. Yes, you may not have a responsibility in law, but if the unthinkable was to happen, could you live with yourself? With what that would do to a 17 year old?

That's a bloody paddling pool!

I still think you are slightly unreasonable, but admittedly less than I did when I thought you meant you had a real swimming pool.

Saucy, I did say above ground. What does that mean other than over sized paddling pool?

We have an indoor pool and I would NEVER have allowed my children (let alone their friends) to be in it without adult supervision. The door was locked to the pool when we weren't home. YABU.

YANBU. I would be livid with my much younger dd if she went into a friends house without letting me know and I couldn't find her. And if I thought that is something she would do I wouldn't let her out! What a bad message for that mum to be sending her dd that it is other people's responsibility to let her mum know where she is!

My DD is 12 and her friend also 12 has two older sisters. I'm aware that the Mother leaves them unsupervised for long periods of time whilst she works...which is fine...sort of...but I don't allow my DD to go there all day....as I know the older girls have boys visiting.

It's up to the parent to know where a child of 12 is. Not you OP.

Thank you for starting this thread, OP. My 11yo dd is just starting to have some freedom to do stuff with her friends, and it's helpful to be reminded that what seems like common sense to some parents - like supervising kids in a swimming pool - may not seem necessary to other parents. It's a good reminder that I shouldn't make any assumptions or take anything for granted.

Obviously, the other mother was being absurdly unreasonable. It wasn't your job to know where her dd was, and she shouldn't have been so rude. Personally, I think that you might need to re-think your policy on supervising the pool, but that's irrelevant actually. The parent should have been responsible for the safety of her own child.

How do you keep it clean, with all those tweenies using it? ignores point of thread

I can't believe people actually need to have a picture of the pool to realise that it is actually a giant paddling pool. The OP made it very clear in her first post!

PovertyP, we have a filter and not to worry, 50% have ignored the point as well.

"Saucy, I did say above ground. What does that mean other than over sized paddling pool?"

It's my mistake. I've only just realised from Google that above ground pool is a specific name for a big paddling pool.

I dunno what I thought you meant.
I guess a swimming pool with raised sides.

I think she was very unreasonable, I have had similar with my DD but not quite the same she had a friend to sleepover aged 14 they went out in the evening , her parents found out and went spare. 1) they never called me or gave a number 2) my DD is allowed out in the evening (not late) 3) How am I meant to know your DD isn't if you don't contact me! If my DD is somewhere I check with parents and give my number. Her DD should have let her know but I'm not sure id ban her but ask DD not to have her over again when your absent and when your there insist she texts her mum!

I totally agree with TheBriscoesLady and Brokenbiscuit.

LauraJenson re "50% have ignored the point as well."

I rather think it is you who is ignoring the point, sadly. Of course this other woman was wrong to blame you that she did not know where her daughter was BUT you are wrong to allow a group of teens and pre-teens access to your home and pool, of whatever sort.

If there were to be a terrible incident or accident I feel fairly sure you may well be prosecuted by a heartbroken parent, and even if this prosecution were unsuccessful you would have to live with the sadness of this for your life.

Seventeen your olds are not adults, are they really 'in-charge' or the 15 year olds? Don't they get bored, or too hot in the sunshine and go in the house to play on the X box. How would they feel if something terrible happened.

I think this unknown parent has done you a service, she has brought to your attention (all be it in a very rude way, and I totally agree you are not responsible for her knowing where her dd is), perhaps through this thread, that there is an issue with the use of this pool unsupervised.

Children have drowned in ponds, the size of the pool is not really relevant.

I hope you will re-think this policy.

I really do not say this to be harsh or cruel, I am well aware that in many other countries very young children cook meals and go out to work, maybe we are over-protective in the UK (although I do not thin we are!). The UK is where I live (I assume that is where you are too) and I hope this thread will give you some thoughts on this issue.

The mother was wrong to have a go at you because she didn't know where her daughter was. I think my parents stopped asking my friends "Do your parents know you're here?" when I was probably 8.

I grew up with a pool, albeit an in-ground pool (20' x 40' with an 8 ft deep end) and we were not allowed to bring friends over without an adult in the house until we were 15 AND had satisfied my uncle (Red Cross swim instructor) that we could pull someone else out. Even then, the rule was that we could have only one friend at a time unless one of our parents was there.

I realize that your pool is nothing like that, but kids will be kids and accidents do happen. Your kids may be very 'water safe' but you can't guarantee that their friends are or that one of them might not do something foolish.

The other mother was being ridiculous in blaming you for her daughter's whereabouts.

I would, however, in future only let your own DCs use the pool. If they want friends over to use it simply say only when you're at home. Then if a stranger's DC turns up your DCs should tell them to come back when you're home.

It's not worth the stress!

I am assuming your older DDs were there. Going out and leaving a 12 year old in there care while using the pool isn't negligent IMO. I wouldn't ask all my DCs friends if they had permission. I would assume they wouldn't be there if they didn't. YANBU.

kids will be kids and accidents do happen. Your kids may be very 'water safe' but you can't guarantee that their friends are or that one of them might not do something foolish.

I agree. We were at a pool party recently - an in-ground cement/tile/whatever proper pool but not very big or very deep. Kids were mainly 13/14 with a few younger siblings, parents were present. Some of the things the kids tried to do were scary - diving, throwing each other in from the side by one grabbing arms, the other grabbing legs and swinging them - head injury waiting to happen. Home owner stopped them and explained the pool rules, but without adult supervision people could have got hurt - these were nice sensible kids but just overexcited and a silly group mentality. I would not let my child go to that house again to swim without knowing there was adult supervision - not that the homeowner would allow it as she was very safety aware.

There is no way I would let my 12 year old child go somewhere without my prior permission. If ever he goes to a friend's house, we parents communicate together about the time of arrival, food, pick up time etc.

I suppose it might be a different situation for me as my son's best friend is Muslim and so there are certain things I cannot give him to eat. Sometimes, I have to check with his parents or older sisters whether something is appropriate. For example. I was going to take them for tea to a local KFB thinking it was halal as we live in a multicultural area, only to find out that it wasn't and that the chips were fried in the same fat as the chicken

My daugher's best friend is African and, again, I always contact her parents when they meet up to check that certain things are ok. They do the same with me. It's just mutual respect about boundaries, and for us, religious beliefs.

Even at 12, it is unthinkable to just have friends round without prior parental consent. I think you need to rethink your whole pool rules, OP

Lady I think that your situation is unusual though. Most 12 year olds can visit their friends without the parents speaking to one another.

All my 12 year old needs to do is to let me know so I can tell her if it's ok...and to arrange a time for her to return.

I wouldn't really call it "neglect", but it's maybe not the safest thing in the world to leave 12 year old's unsupervised all day in a pool, but then again if there is a 17 year old there I think that's reasonable enough. I think the mother was being a bit out of order, almost having a go at you like you had been trusted to look after her child all day or something, but you hadn't, so how could you of known!

If you think about it, most leisure centers employ life guards from 16 years old, of which although life guards, they are still strangers. But so then really in your case, it's "safer", as it's your own child/their older sibling or their friends older sibling (to your siblings friends), who knows them, in a much smaller pool then a leisure center one, and who is 17 years old (old enough to have sex, drive, join the army, etc), and right out in/by the pool with them.

Although this could now spoil your/their day, to avoid future problems like this, you may have to just say only let your siblings friends in to the pool when you or another adult is present.

Myoption re "but then again if there is a 17 year old there I think that's reasonable enough. I think the mother was being a bit out of order, almost having a go at you like you had been trusted to look after her child all day or something, but you hadn't, so how could you of known!

If you think about it, most leisure centers employ life guards from 16 years old, of which although life guards, they are still strangers...."

But young people employed to work as life guards are (I would hope)
-trained
-qualified
-doing a job that requires them to scan the pool area for trouble (my friend's son is a life guard)

The idea that a 17 year old would stay outside in the hot sun or the cold breeze all day to watch a bunch of 12 years olds seems to me unlikely. So the supervision may be that they are there but in the house, watching TV, on the phone.... etc etc. Yes, they could call an ambulance if needed, but then so could a 12 year old.

And does the 17 year old want to spend a whole day 'supervising' their younger sibs, I doubt it, especially if they also have their 17 year old friends present.

The woman sounds like a loon. I'd ignore her. I suspect she was mad at the situation ie that her DC had been swimming without any supervision and was looking for someone to blame.

We have always had pools until recently and I wouldn't dream of leaving 12 year olds unsupervised in a pool even if it's small. I don't know anyone who would. My DC are strong swimmers but I still wouldn't risk it. I think it's irresponsible to let your 12 year old bring unknown kids to use the pool. You might trust you own kids but you have no idea whether the other kids are trustworthy.

I would have a lock on the gate too.

BTW I don't think you need to be out there watching their every move but you should be about. I don't think it's fair or sensible to expect the older kids to act as lifeguards.