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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To not go back to this playgroup...

207 replies

Biscuitbrixit · 20/07/2016 20:29

...after seeing a parent smack their 3yr old?

He was throwiing toys, she told him not to, he threw them again, she told him again, he threw them again, blah blah blah, went on for ages just remove him from situation ffs
She got all shouty & eventually, after about half an hour of him throwing toys and hurting kids she went over, picked him up by the arm, smacked his bum, yelled at him and sat him on a chair, then walked away, back to her friends. She's with a group of parents who tend to all sit together in a corner and let their kids roam free, no one really paying attention until someone gets hurt.

I was kind of sitting with my friend, thinking wtf!

OP posts:
SatsukiKusakabe · 21/07/2016 23:10

Yes I'm smug because I don't hit my children and don't think it's a good thing to do. I'll take it. But it's not smug to say my children are not better children than the ones who get smacked. The ones who get smacked don't need it or deserve it any more than mine do. But they don't get a choice.

And actually it's also pretty arrogant to try and make a case for hitting a child in order to justify it, rather than admit it's not really the right thing to do and there are better ways to teach a child how to behave than giving them a pretty stellar example of how not to.

SoEverybodyDance · 22/07/2016 00:13

Salmotrutta people who are exposed to violence from a young age are often more sensitive to incidents like this - they can be very scary and upsetting.

and Dutch the only point in intervening is if you think it's going to have a positive effect. Challenging this angry, aggressive woman in front of her child and everyone else, including lots of other children, would have made this situation far worse. I did not stand by to say nothing and judge, rather I am still wondering how best to approach a very difficult issue in a way that works.

And there is nothing wrong with saying you find certain kinds of behaviour uncomfortable to witness. It is not judgemental.

If you witnessed such behaviour and concluded: "It is because she is a young mother," or "it is because they went to public school where they do ritualised beatings" or "it is because they come from a rough council estate", then that would be judgemental.

ItsABanana · 22/07/2016 00:41

NRTFT, but Oh, good grief. Why would what is presumably a great playschool (as you like going there usually) be suddenly off limits as you didn't agree with one of the other parent's method of discipline?! Confused
Complete and utter over reaction.
Don't smack myself, but OMG, get a grip. Seriously. Not everyone is going to agree with you!
Should I decide to boycott playgroups if they have a "crunchy" or freestyle type as demonstrated on This Morning this week so called parent in there?!
No. Enjoy the playschool for what it is. Somewhere for all children to play, explore and have fun.

Salmotrutta · 22/07/2016 00:43

SoEveryBodyDance - well, thank you for the interpretation of the OP's reaction. Obviously I feel suitably patronised.

I didn't read it as the OP finding it "scary and upsetting" - more something she was judgemental about.

That's my interpretation.

Original poster
Biscuitbrixit · 22/07/2016 07:45

I just found it very uncomfortable

OP posts:
Dutchcourage · 22/07/2016 07:52

soevery - yep that's a cop out. Your still thinking about what to do....

You didn't intervene because you didn't think it was bad enough to intervene. You didn't report it to the tutors because you didn't think it was bad enough. You didn't like to look at that style of parenting - which is fair enough - but not enough to approach the parents later on, talk to tutor ect.. Don't be disingenuous.

I don't smack my dds but not because I've made a superior choice not too - it's just something I've managed to avoid. I'm not perfect either, I've made some epic parenting fails while out in public and behind closed doors. There is no perfect parent. I have got a store ID card where the photo I had taken in store still causes Dh and I to crease up laughing because I was raging with dd, I'd ended up storming around the shop, shouting at her, marching her back to the queue. Then the bloody photographer took my pic in that second. That's the only time over been like that in that shop - I'm generally never like that but in those few mins I suppose lots of people judged me for losing it and behaving like a utter crank.

I also taught swimming for over a decade and did many many CP courses and seen many ways of disciplining children. I'm more likely to judge over a parenting giving a 18 month old a bottle of lucazade to guzzle on to keep them quiet.

We all judge - it's natural. You just have to get a grip on yourself and not think you are superior.

WhatTheActualFugg · 22/07/2016 08:33

Banana I suspect the issue here for the OP is not that there is a parent with an alternative parenting style she disagrees with with. The issue is that in a parent-led play group one of the parents (and perhaps her cluck of friends who seemingly didn't bat an eyelid) thought it appropriate to yell across the room at her young child then subject that child to the humiliation and pain of a public display of physical violence then leave that said child to sit alone whilst her and her friends carried on chatting.

This doesn't appear to be a regretted momentary lapse of judgement.

As I said before, this is not an environment I would like my child to spend time in and I can well appreciate the OPs dilemma.

OP, can you get in contact with the other shocked mum you were talking with at the time? Perhaps see if she wants to try some other groups with you?

Original poster
Biscuitbrixit · 22/07/2016 08:43

What a strange comment dutch to insinuate that people make a superior choice not to smack their child. It's not superior in the slightest. It's intuitive, respectful, kind.

OP posts:
Original poster
Biscuitbrixit · 22/07/2016 08:45

That's exactly it wahtthe that was the situation

OP posts:
Ragwort · 22/07/2016 08:49

It wouldn't put me off at all, I find it far more off putting to deal with the number of lazy, lax parents who don't discipline their child or who believe in 'gentle' parenting Hmm ..... I see far more of those than parents giving the odd smack.

Dutchcourage · 22/07/2016 08:51

Why is it a strange comment biscuit? A poster upthread said her parenting was superior because she didn't smack her children. Are you even reading your own thread? Maybe you should start delivering patenting classes at the group..

And of course you will agree with whatthe her lady post is basically word for word for what your wrote in your op....

SoEverybodyDance · 22/07/2016 09:54

Salmotrutta the OP has said she was upset by the situation in subsequent postings.

You didn't intervene because you didn't think it was bad enough to intervene. You didn't report it to the tutors because you didn't think it was bad enough. You didn't like to look at that style of parenting - which is fair enough - but not enough to approach the parents later on, talk to tutor ect.. Don't be disingenuous.

Dutch please don't tell me what I saw, what I thought or what I did because you weren't there and you're just making it up.

The problem about a lot behaviour like this is that it's very nuanced. That is the thing about violence / aggression in families, it's seldom an overt, black and white situation. Instead it's more likely to be hidden and nobody talks about it and you only find out about the extent of it years after the event. This mother was not beating her child up, but she was being physical in ways that was uncontrolled and out of proportion. It was disturbing to see. Maybe he will never turn up in hospital with broken limbs, or on a social service register, but the evidence is there that these behaviours can cause long term damage. How much is too much? How to intervene effectively? This is the thing that is incredibly difficult to assess.

SatsukiKusakabe · 22/07/2016 11:34

I agree with biscuit it should be the default setting, but yes, I believe it is inferior to just about every other parenting approach that is not hitting.

I don't believe my parenting superior in any other respect and I already said as much. If I hit my child I would consider I had got things wrong. I have friends (believe or not) who take all different approaches and I do not judge differences in style, sometimes I learn from it, sometimes it reinforces what I've decided to do. I don't think hitting is a valid choice though, simply at the other end of the spectrum from gentle parenting (and it's not one thing or the other, by the way, as is often suggested)

I often get it wrong and think of ways I could have done things better. If you are dishing out 'the odd smack' as a part of how you generally deal with difficult situations, you are making a shitty choice and you could do better. I wouldn't choose a childminder who smacked as part of their discipline. I doubt you'd find one that said on their cv that they take "the smacking approach" to discipline. There's a reason for that, right?

People often say it was more common in the past - my father is 75, and comes from a very poor working class background in a deprived area. He was never smacked and it was generally frowned on then in his community.

There are some things there should be no wishy washy moral relativism about, as if everything is a valid 'choice'. Some things are plain wrong. It is not ok to hit an adult. It is not ok to hit an elderly person. It is not ok to hit a child. I don't mind saying that.

WhatTheActualFugg · 22/07/2016 13:52

Dutch I'm not quite sure what you're trying to insinuate with your .... And also because I have no idea WTF a lady post is. Confused

MrsHathaway · 22/07/2016 14:51

"Lady" is a typical autocorrect for "last".

SatsukiKusakabe · 22/07/2016 15:15

To clarify further, I also said I do not judge someone who has a one off moment and loss of control, as no one is immune to that, which is also what you are saying dutch. I do judge someone who uses it regularly and is prepared to defend it as just another way to parent, justifies it using the child's behaviour as a 'cause', and doesn't attempt to do better than that.

Original poster
Biscuitbrixit · 22/07/2016 17:19

What's your problem dutch?

OP posts:
NatureCreatesFreaks · 22/07/2016 17:21

Right at the bottom of your post you told me to get a grip on myself and stop thinking I'm superior. Hmm

BlurryFace · 22/07/2016 17:22

I saw my neighbour smack her toddler's hand and am now in the process of moving house.

Original poster
Biscuitbrixit · 22/07/2016 17:23

Whatever blurry

OP posts:
Dutchcourage · 22/07/2016 17:42

soevery - it still stands. You didn't intervene because you didn't think it was bad enough otherwise you would have.

biscuit nothing's my problem Confused I'm just replying to a thread you started. Have I now got a problem because I don't agree with you? 😂😂

Dutchcourage · 22/07/2016 17:43

blurry Grin

Original poster
Biscuitbrixit · 22/07/2016 18:59

No dutch bit you're relentless

OP posts:
Dutchcourage · 22/07/2016 19:32

I'm just replying to you that's all. Are you like this in the play group ?

Original poster
Biscuitbrixit · 23/07/2016 00:57

Like what in the playgroup?

OP posts:
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