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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

'Ladies first'

214 replies

AddToBasket · 20/05/2016 22:13

A male colleague said this to a female colleague today and I instinctively bristled.

FC: On you go
MC: No, no, you go. Ladies first. [stands back, FC passes]

Me (internal monologue) - errrr, aaaahhhhhh.

MC is generally lovely, FC was oblivious and thinking about other stuff. Neither even noticed the exchange. AIBU for being a bit bothered?

OP posts:
BeyondTellsEveryoneRealFacts · 22/05/2016 12:27

I sure am feeling invisible today! Grin

Ps, hello ego, i havent seen you for ages! Brew

Egosumquisum · 22/05/2016 12:34

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

NewLife4Me · 22/05/2016 12:36

I wouldn't be bothered tbh, you wouldn't complain if you were on a sinking ship and it was women and children go first.

NotDavidTennant · 22/05/2016 12:49

GinnyMcGinFace Oh my days. I have four sons and threads like this depress me. What does the female population want from men?

I know. It's almost like women are expecting men to treat them as individuals with their own separate ideas and opinions about polite behaviour. Silly moos.

LittleHouseOnTheShelf · 22/05/2016 12:52

He's got good manners, what's the problem?

Egosumquisum · 22/05/2016 13:54

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

OptimisticSix · 22/05/2016 14:24

steff13

I think it's polite. Plus, then I get to go first. smile

Exactly this, oh and the door handle thing, why touch them if you don't have to Wink also the word lady does not bother me in the slightest, I am better than no one and no one's better than me. Referring to me as a lady changes nothing. It's just a word.

NewLife4Me · 22/05/2016 14:25

Ego

I teach all my children this irrespective of whether they are boys or girls.
It's common courtesy and manners. Don't you? Confused

GinnyMcGinFace · 22/05/2016 14:27

NotDavid you have reinforced my point! Yes of course everyone has different ideas and that's fine but being offended when someone is simply trying to be polite is ridiculous. Their idea of polite may be different from mine or yours but this is about the professionally offended I'm afraid.

IrishDad79 · 22/05/2016 15:06

I always hold the door open for men and women and say "after you". Problem solved.

Yes, I am great.

exkiwi · 22/05/2016 21:47

But what about what else I am trying to be polite by holding a door open for a man who chooses to make an issue of this and refuses to go through it?

exkiwi · 22/05/2016 21:50

No idea hoe that "what else" crept into my message.

herecomethepotatoes · 23/05/2016 05:28

Egosumquisum
teach both my boys to be chivalrous

What do you mean by chivalry? Do you teach them to only open doors for women, only to help women out etc - or do you teach them to help anyone who might need help?

Did you deliberately disregard the rest of my post? There were only 5 sentences so I'd have expected it to be manageable!

At the same time, my 5 year old gave his seat up on the train to an old man without being asked.

Most men are stronger than most women. Therefore offering them a seat, carrying a heavy bag, opening a door is something they can do more easily. I'd open a door for an older / weaker man, offer to carry something etc.

Some posters here have made me genuinely despair. At least I never actually meet these people in real life; they seem to be confined to the internet. The comment about opening a door signaling permission for a lady to enter a building. Where the actual fuck did you read that? Mentalfeminists.com?

Toddzoid · 23/05/2016 06:21

I say it to men quite regularly. I don't need my chair pulling out for me, more than capable of opening a car door and I don't expect special treatment going through places first just because I have a vagina.

If we want equality that means preferential treatment based on sex goes out of the window. Having said that it was basic etiquette and good manners for many generations so a lot of men think they're being kind doing it. I find it patronising but there you go.

barbet · 23/05/2016 07:51

I know that thia thread is quite old now in Mumsnet terms and that at least 3/4s don't see a problem ... but that actually drives me to add a "yanbu" to the small group who disagree with the apparent majority here.

It drives me mad too (not that I'd do anything about it, like you, in real life) - I don't think it's lovely and sweet at all. It is in its most simplistic form benevolent sexism.

"If ladies (god I hate that word, sorry!) need doors opening for them by the oh so much stronger and protective sex, then what else do they need taking care of for them?" > this!

"Ladies first = Just something people say" "it's just manners/culture" > arrrggghhhh! But manners and cultures and traditions are sexist.
^
"He says he does this because he respects women and holds them in high regard"^ oh - well no need to read further after this, thank goodness a man been asked to explain eh...

barbet · 23/05/2016 07:53

(Not sure where all those > and ^s appeared from, sorry Hmm)

Egosumquisum · 23/05/2016 08:44

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

herecomethepotatoes · 23/05/2016 10:22

@Ego

What about offering to do the hard work for them because they find it easier? Doing maths for them? Changing a car tyre?

Yes. I often do the hard maths for my husband. I womansplain it to him. He's a PHd in politics but struggle to count beyond 10 without having to take his socks off! I know how to change a car tyre although if it were at home I'd be unlikely to do it. On the side of the road, I'd manage (and have). I'm not sure I've understood the point you're trying to make.

But if you think that a man should give up their seat for a woman just because she's a woman and the 'weaker sex', that's your right

But if you think that a man should give up their seat for a woman just because she's a woman and the 'weaker sex', that's your right.

I do. It's basic good manners. Benevolent sexism? Fuxache!

@Toddzoid

At the restaurant last night my husband pulled the chair out for me and then the waiter for him. Where do you stand (no pun intended!) on that?

@barbet

With the misplaced carets, I'm not sure what you're quoting or stating, but what's the issue with "ladies"? I ask specifically as my husband walked into our kitchen last night and said "Good afternoon ladies" to some friends and me. As far as I know, no one was even slightly offended and he got nothing other than "Hi Mr Potatoes...". Not even one mention of an oppressive patriarchy or the hint of an eye-roll!

JAPABimtheonewhoknocks · 23/05/2016 10:25

When I was young my mother used to tell me off for not letting females go through a door first.

Even if I was in a middle of a line of several females walking down a corridor, when we reached the door at the end the front females are to go through, I am to stop and let and females behind me to go through, and only go through myself behind them all.

She wasn't too impressed that I just walked through the door when I reached it without thinking, just as everyone else had.

I can't be bothered with such sexism personally. You'll get no door-privileges from me just because of your sex. I will of course hold doors for people when appropriate, but just not simply because of their sex.

However I wouldn't get too worked up about someone if their motives are not bad and they are just acting in accordance with the sense of politeness they have been raised with, but I don't think it's "nothing" either.

Egosumquisum · 23/05/2016 10:27

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

herecomethepotatoes · 23/05/2016 10:48

ego

Yes, I'd take it because he'd been polite enough to offer it. In your world is "fuck off you sexist pig" more appropriate?

I still don't understand the maths / changing a tyre comment you made earlier.

Egosumquisum · 23/05/2016 10:50

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

user1463231665 · 23/05/2016 11:23

There are ways to be polite about this stuff. 30 years ago when I married no way would anyone have asked anyone for permission. When my then future son in law asked me I said I would be delighted if they married if they are both happy with that, but that as I don't own my daughter and am happy they will reach the right decision. So yes I made it clear politely and without being rude that the idea permission is needed is ridiculous but I certainly wasn't nasty to anyone. It's the same with all the racist taxi drivers I seem to end up with in London in cabs. I never let their racism pass but I am never rude. I might just say something like - I don't agree with that or some people have a different view. I don't sail into - you racist pig.

On the tube when I frequently intervene to ensure people who need it have seats I tend to be offered seats as I'm not pregnant and not old. If someone offers a seat I'd only take it if I think they need it less than I do.

herecomethepotatoes · 23/05/2016 12:42

ego

Why the "...I'm perfectly capable..." as opposed to a gracious 'thank you'.

I still don't understand the maths / changing a tyre comment you made earlier.

Are you going to explain or leave me wondering?

PurpleDaisies · 23/05/2016 13:00

Why the "...I'm perfectly capable..." as opposed to a gracious 'thank you'.

Because I don't need anyone to give up their seat for me because I have ovaries. The is totally accurate and not impolite to say "no thanks, I'm happy standing".

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