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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

'Ladies first'

214 replies

AddToBasket · 20/05/2016 22:13

A male colleague said this to a female colleague today and I instinctively bristled.

FC: On you go
MC: No, no, you go. Ladies first. [stands back, FC passes]

Me (internal monologue) - errrr, aaaahhhhhh.

MC is generally lovely, FC was oblivious and thinking about other stuff. Neither even noticed the exchange. AIBU for being a bit bothered?

OP posts:
Topseyt · 20/05/2016 22:28

He sounds very nice, and is also chivalrous.

I certainly couldn't find it in me to bristle about it or otherwise get worked up.

Original poster
AddToBasket · 20/05/2016 22:29

DH and I are just having a discussion about awkward door holding and that moment when you'd say anything to just get the other person to WALK THROUGH.

OP posts:
KellyElly · 20/05/2016 22:30

'Ladies', in ladies first, is just a saying. I've never heard anyone say women first, or females first. You are looking into things too much.

KayTee87 · 20/05/2016 22:30

He was being polite, I really don't see what anyone could be offended / annoyed about. It's a commonly used phrase.

Alisvolatpropiis · 20/05/2016 22:32

It's manners based on sex, not gender.

This wouldn't bother me.

acasualobserver · 20/05/2016 22:33

You're right she should have said firmly, "No, shit before the shovel," and made him go first. Sexist pig.

Original poster
AddToBasket · 20/05/2016 22:34

OK, I accept IABU about this particular incident.

God, but I hope it's a phase that dies out fast. Yes, to whoever said opening the door to anyone is being polite. It's the gender bit that's redundant.

OP posts:
Only1scoop · 20/05/2016 22:35

Yabu

Wouldn't give it a second thought.

Alisvolatpropiis · 20/05/2016 22:36

Sex. It's based on sex not gender.

Theydontknowweknowtheyknow · 20/05/2016 22:37

I know what you mean. But it's one of those things that you wouldn't want to challenge cos they're only being nice and doing what they've been brought up to do.

But I do get embarrassed with men continually opening doors for me, especially when if I try to open a door for them there's a big standoff whilst they go "no no you first " it's all so silly - there's nothing wrong with a woman opening a door for a man FGS.

MadamDeathstare · 20/05/2016 22:38

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

ABCAlwaysBeCunting · 20/05/2016 22:39

I'm not massively bothered by 'ladies' either.

It always makes me cringe a bit when a man posts on MN asking for advice and starts by saying 'ladies' and everyone gets all up in arms about it and automatically dismisses him as unrepentant patriarchy when the guy was actually just trying to be respectful, then makes a big deal about refusing to help because sexist.

Really, fucking grow up.

MistressDeeCee · 20/05/2016 22:39

Whats wrong with being a gentleman with good manners? In all the sexist shit women have to put up with in this world, is this really worth bristling about? I hope chivalry never dies out, always makes me smile when I come across it

Original poster
AddToBasket · 20/05/2016 22:45

To be fair, I bristled instinctively because I'm particularly conscious of this stuff in the work place. I started a thread abut it because I can see there are two sides and I'm interested in MN judgement on this.

And that weird embarrassed door dance is always a bit gruesome - but at least it shows I share a building with polite people. Smile

LOL at MadamDeathstare's equality door slam.

OP posts:
exkiwi · 20/05/2016 22:47

Maybe yabu, but I react in exactly the same way when I hear this phrase. I have noticed certain male colleagues go to great pains when, for example, we are in a lift, to position themselves in such a way that it is difficult for them to leave before any women, no matter how awkward this is (eg if the lift is crowded). I find this ridiculous and patronising, and amuse myself by acting distracted and oblivious and enjoying their inner struggle as they leave before me. Childish?....me?

GraysAnalogy · 20/05/2016 22:47

I'm sure you wouldn't be arsed if it was a sinking ship you were on and people declared 'women and children first'. Wink

It's someone trying to be nice and polite. Let's stop with this nonsense.

TooOldForGlitter · 20/05/2016 22:50

It's only polite if he'd do it for the male colleagues too.

Can we have a worldwide ban on the word lady?

GraysAnalogy · 20/05/2016 22:54

Only in positions of such privilege would we complain about being put first and called a 'lady'. Meanwhile, girls not receiving an education and being forced to be brides.

Can we direct some of our attention and this bristling anger OP to people who actually need it

Theydontknowweknowtheyknow · 20/05/2016 22:55

I totally get that they are being polite but IME I've met men who complain about women wanting sexual equality but also wanting men to open doors.

Men probably think I'm one of those women because I always accept and say thank you but I'm just doing it to be polite.

It's like I'm being asked to accept a present that I don't want then being told to get grateful for that present.

And this talk of "would you rather he slammed the door in your face?". Why does it have to be one or the other? Why is the choice between benevolent sexism and hostile sexism? What's wrong with mutual respect?

TooOldForGlitter · 20/05/2016 22:55

That's a good point Grays

usual · 20/05/2016 22:58

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Bogeyface · 20/05/2016 23:00

Oddly enough DS (10) said this to DD (11) and I as we were coming out of Aldi earlier. I said he was being very gallant and then we had to have a conversation about what gallant meant! He said that he heard his grandad saying it so assumed that he should. I have no problem with that as he was just being polite as he thought he should. Its when some patronizing arsehole says it as if he is doing you some big favour that it gets on my nerves.

PurpleDaisies · 20/05/2016 23:00

Only in positions of such privilege would we complain about being put first and called a 'lady'. Meanwhile, girls not receiving an education and being forced to be brides.

People are capable of caring about more than one issue at once. I don't agree that because there are bigger fish to fry smaller everyday problems should be ignored. I'm not sure I'd be particularly bothered about the "ladies first" man but I would (and have in the past) challenge a relative telling my niece that little girls should play with dolls not cars. That's not in the same league as being forced to be a child bride but I think it is important to tackle everyday sexism when we see it.

Theknittinggorilla · 20/05/2016 23:01

Yanbu. Manners should not be based on sex. Although I would smile politely and accept to avoid long door stand offs (ladies first, no after you etc). And am 100% sure no offence met.
But this is a throwback to the past and times have changed. I have been in many meetings over the years in a male dominated industry where someone has sworn and then apologised directly to me (as the female in the room) for swearing. Either swearing is offensive or it isn't. It's not offensive based on your sex. Whilst again I am sure no offence is meant, it immediately makes me different to everyone else in the room and makes me think the conversation might be different if I wasn't there.
I get that's it's small stuff but I hope that the idea that sex is relevant when it comes to manners disappears in future generations

Bogeyface · 20/05/2016 23:01

Although reading some of the replies perhaps I should suggest to him that "After you" is better as it refers to everyone and not just women.