To ask how much childcare you expect

[Tessticklesyourfancy]

Talking with a friend yesterday who's daughter had a baby before Christmas. Apparently her daughter has asked her mum if she can drop two days at work to look after her gd when she goes back to work after maternity leave. My friend was a bit taken aback and said not really as she is on her own and the drop in income wouldeave her much worse off financially. She remembered the problems I had with
My OH daughter about childcare which caused a fall out. At the time I worked Saturday's and had either Tuesday or Wednesday off each week. While on maternity leave OH daughter applied and got a new job, three days a week and her MIL who is a good few years older than me and retired, had offered to have the baby one day a week. I was then expected to do one day as well so they only needed to pay for one day in nursery. To be honest I was [ would you ask someone who worked full time to look after your child on their day off every week?
After OH daughter divorced she met a nice bloke and they had another child. His daughter had some problems at work and applied for a different job last summer but this job though still part time, involved working every Saturday and two Sunday's a month. When I asked how she would manage with childcare, her partners job is shift work including weekends she said that she hoped me and her dad would help out. My OH said no straight off as it would have been some part of most weekends. At least one full two day weekend plus various hours depending on the shifts, if he was on nights it would be down to us and if on early or lates we would have had to cover those hours. I know she was unhappy in her job at the time but it was too bigger ask and we don't regret sayin so. Thankfully they knew deep down it wasn't viable but we were put in the spot. Having just seen another thread about someone not wanting to look after her husbands gd, it got me wondering what some parent expect to be reasonable help?

I'm really bemused that anybody would be so rude as to ask their parents for regular childcare. I ask for babysitting favours occasionally, but no way would I have the brass neck to expect my parents to be tied down to regular set hours so that I could save a few quid. Bonkers.

I take it that, Oneapecker, when the time comes, you will take care of both your grandchildren and elderly parents without complaint?

We live miles from all GPs and so don't expect regular childcare. That said both lots of GPs have come to visit during school holidays and done some childcare. But that's a nice to have and on their terms, I wouldn't expect it.

There's another thing here that should also be mentioned. How many grandchildren do you have/have many children do you have who do not yet have children? My Mum does all the childcare for DB and SIL (3 days a week plus when they have holidays without the kids). They have 3 kids so it saves them tens of thousands every year. But we get next to no help (3 days one half term last year plus a night out when we were visiting her) and I think the inbalance there is unfair, I wish my Mum had really thought it through and had charged DB and SIL for the childcare she gives them. She's always telling me how 'generous' SIL is and I do think 'hmm, well if I didn't have to pay for childcare I could get you expensive presents as well'.

Childcare is a crippling expense, and I work 4 days a week and am eternally exhausted. I'd love some help

You sound knackered so but why did you have 3 DC? (unless they are triplets of course ). I don't mean to be goady - it is a genuine question. Not only is it very hard work & expensive for you, but surely it made it much less likely that your parents would feel able to help out regularly?

Never really expected much other than occasional babysits. As it is we've been blessed that PIL and my mum (all retired but still young) have been very happy to stand in when DD has not been able to attend nursery. They love it, she loves it, and saves my precious annual leave! I would feel very uncomfortable accepting any regular arrangement even if they offered- my mum did initially, but as she didn't live close by I thought the drive would be too much, eventually she agreed, and it's definitely been the right choice.

shinynew why three indeed?

Not triplets, well planned, and we both earn well. I'm a terminal overachiever, and have always, always been able to cope.

What I didn't account for was the wearing down over years of no free time, no evenings off, no chance of hobbies. And I've tried, but God, I've just had to quit my latest attempt to do one single class a week as it pushed me over the edge and I missed a work deadline and forgot a couple of school events.

I found my limits with three. I don't expect others to pick up my slack. But I'd be so bloody grateful if they did.

I raised my child alone and paid for nursery so when it's his turn to be a parent I don't see why he and his partner can't pay for nursery.
I most certainly wont give up a day of work nor weekends.
I would babysit now and again but not regularly.
My DH on the other hand is the opposite so I can imagine there may be a battle!

Sympathies, Nightlark. Sounds as if you have been managing this all for a while so hopefully not too much longer till they are a bit more independent?

None expected, both sets of grandparents long distance away. My mum is fantastic and has helped us out for a few days at a time several times a year - for courses, inset days and at very short notice for medical emergencies. PIL have not done so much as an evening babysitting when we visit them, but that's their choice. Our kids, our responsibility, help appreciated but not expected.

The brass neck of asking someone to drop a couple of days work every week to be free childcare!

Thanks shinynew, for your kind words. It gets less difficult with every passing month in many ways. it is what it is, and I wouldn't part with any of it. They are wonderful people and I'm glad to have them in my life (exhausting though it is).

My husband and I both have siblings who take the proverbial piss when it comes to using GPs for childcare.

We'll be paying for all our childcare, and I'm going to be a complete martyr about it (privately of course).

But in all seriousness, because I see how exhausted my mother is from the minding she does, I hate to ask her to mind my DS for even a few hours! Makes me very resentful towards the sibs that take for granted

It bugs me how often people assume GPs can help out with childcare. DPs live hundreds of miles away and ILs we have no contact. My DM helped out once when I was desperate, but I was forever grateful! I don't think anyone should just expect it! We pay a lot for childcare but that is our sacrifice for deciding to have children.

I have to say that I expected, maybe that's the wrong word, hoped for? More than we get based on my own experiences of being looked after by grandparents fairly often as a child.
It is difficult as both sets of parents are still working and have their own hobbies so don't want to be tied down but it does seem a bit unfair that they got a reasonable amount of freedom in their time of being parents but don't seem to want to pass that on.

We don't expect anything, both sets of parents live too far away for regular childcare and wouldn't want that kind of commitment anyway.

But we do ask for help sometimes, which they've encouraged us to do. Mil babysits every few months, and my parents have had dd for 2 nights so I could go on a conference for work that was near where they live. Pils will have her in the summer when dh and I have a weekend away.

At the moment they love having her and we're very grateful for that! Both our mothers are very careful not to take over, but love their time with dd, so we do ask, but they can and do say no.

Sue and twixes, I completely agree. If childcare is offered by DGP's, then it should be offered among siblings fairly - obviously if this is practical in terms of distance, and taking into consideration what DGP's are happy to commit to in total. This may mean that my parents are less available to us if/when my siblings have kids, but so be it. DH and I both sometimes feel a bit put out that PIL spend so much less time with our DC than with their cousins. A colleague has a similar situation - she has to fork out for 3 days of childcare a week for her twins, while her MIL provides free childcare 3 days a week for her BIL and SIL's child.

Its humiliating for a child with parents who are able to help out to be told that golf, shopping, "me time" is more important.

I really don't understand. Why is it humiliating? I am assuming the GP weren't part of the discussions when their child decided to have DC. So why should they be expected to do any childcare? Obviously I too disagree with you OneAPecker. I think it's extreamly important that my DM and PIL should enjoy their retirement. They should have as much "me time" as they like and do all the things they couldn't really do whilst bringing us up. They should put themselves first. Any support offered should be seem as a major bonus not an entitlement.

It's not their responsibility to look after our DC, it's ours, and as children we should be grateful for childcare given.

This seems a very calm and logical thread.
I didn't expect help, have had a lot over the years. But each time it's been a free choice, there has been no sulking and guilting when the answer was no, for whatever reason.
For the one or two citing the past, in the past older members of the family moved into your home when they could no longer live independently and stayed until they died, being cared for by their families. Is that on the cards too?

I wouldn't trust my mil to care for my children at all. With my parents, I know their limits. They get exhausted because they are so unfit. I would only ever ask for minimal support and that might be eight short afternoons a year

Child care has to be offered on the GP terms really. If they are busy, unfit, unhealthy, uninterested or whatever, it all impacts the level of support

another who hasn't had any help, we've never asked and never been offered. We're the only people we know who don't receive family childcare.

Tbh I can't be arsed with most of the family so having them do childcare seems like a massive pain in the arse.

I don't expect any. In fact I rarely ask but let my parents choose to play with DSs when it suits them.

We have a slightly odd set up as my Dad is living out the back so DS often heads up in the morning for breakfast. My dad likes it.

I rarely had any help. I was a SAHM for first three because of this. Did a bit of work for my dad but was able to take 1st with me. Mum was ill. She sometimes watched number two and occasionally babysat at night when they were in bed so I could help dad. She said she would rather babysit than work in hotel. It was always very casual and I never really knew when so I couldn't plan much. I never expected it. Dad had died before baby three was born. Mum moved away 35 miles. Occasionally had them while I went shopping. We moved by number four and mum went abroad to live. In-laws were disabled. I paid for childcare if I needed it as there was no help re vouchers those days.
I am amazed by the expectations of some adults. Girl nearby expects her mum to have the children one day a week. The mum works full time and has a business that she works in at night. So granny gets no time off at all. Of course she wants to see her grandchildren but not to have them all day.
I once met a granny at the park. I watched baby in pushchair as she was in a real dilemma because two year old had run off and four year old wouldn't get off climbing frame. She didn't want to leave baby with a stranger but there was a pond nearby so she had to trust me. When we sat down and she thanked me she explained that she had the children three or four days a week. Two from one family and one from the other for the full day. Two days a week ahe had them altogether. She was in her seventies! She looked exhausted. I told her I thought it was too much to have three children unde r five.

It would be nice, but noone can make you. I only had childcare from grandparents when it was offered. I don't expect it really. Especially if they work. How is it ever going to be possible?

My mother ranted at me when I was 16 that if I got pregnant I wasn't to look at her for childcare. I was on my own. In the event, once married 10 yrs later, I struggled to conceive and had IVF in my 30's so now she rants I only gave her one GC. I'd rather move to Timbuktu than have her look after DD regularly.
Anyway in answer to the thread. I think it's sad that so many grandparents are missing out on the magic of grandchildren, whether it be doing their own thing or working out of necessity.
This is a generalisation, I know but it seems to me many more grandparents of working class children get involved with their grandkids. I can only imagine partly it's because they know their grown up kids couldn't work without their support and these grandparents live their lives according to their children's needs. Middle class people on the other hand (again I'm generalising) often have other things to do. If not working to pay for their homes and holidays, they can be busy experiencing stuff or "growing old outrageously" not gracefully ;) There's no right or wrong and I'm not judging anyone. We will be paying a mortgage into our 60's. I just know in an ideal world, my DD (who is my world) would have a fab grandma, who loved her unconditionally and looked after her regularly. This would both be to bond superbly with her and to give me a much needed break because sadly I became chronically ill almost 5 yrs ago when she was 3. I hope I shall be able to be that grandma some day.
This is a tough question. No it's not selfish to refuse.. But it should be necessary to look at the consequences of our refusal. It's easy to get upset with grown up children not behaving responsibly. However, these grandchildren are our future and we need to considers investing in them heavily especially if their parents aren't doing a very good job. Yes, we can blatantly say no it's not our responsibility. And yet if we want our grandchildren to have a great life, there is nothing better than giving them our time. Extended family is so important for the emotional well being of a child.
What I'm trying to say op is I would try to be on the outside, take a step back and decide what is best for the wellbeing if the grandchild as well as the grandparent.

My DM stated (loudly) once DS was here that she "wasn't doing anymore than 2 days a week childcare". We hadn't even asked or hinted! I was surprised but grateful. When DS was 8 months she had him for an afternoon so I could go into work for a catch up meeting. He was just crawling and tired her out! She sheepishly admitted that she thought 2 days a week was too much for her - and would one day be ok instead? We are so grateful that she can and wants to help out, any help is fantastic and she (& DF) are lovely grand parents - although I think they thought they knew it all and had forgotten a lot of the elements of bringing up small children.