Real dilemma about Christmas - WWYD

[notamum3210]

My fiancé and I have been a couple for just over 6 years and we're getting married next year.
I'm at a loss at what to do about Christmas. My family are from a religious background where we don't celebrate Christmas although we still give friends and neighbours Christmas cards.
My fiancé's family do Christmas in a BIG way. This year is set to be their biggest yet - there'll be about 10 family members there including my fiancé's sister's baby and his brother's 10 year old. It's really special to have them together as some family live abroad.
Anyway- since I've been with my fiancé I have spent Christmas Day with his family. As I never had Christmas growing up its really wonderful - very special.
A couple of years ago my parents went away on holiday and I looked after my brother for a week or so. He was 9 at the time and as it coincided with Christmas my future mother in law kindly invited him along- he LOVED it and it was very very special. They even got him some pressies and I did too just so he wouldn't feel left out when all was being opened under the tree.

Fast forward to this year and I've been invited for Christmas again and I don't know whether I should go. My brother is now 11 and I know he would be heartbroken if I got to have a Christmas and he didn't. I've asked my fiancé if he could come along (he really isn't any trouble) but he's said that it probably would be too much of a full house. I imagine my mil would say yes but I don't want to put her under more pressure as she's cooking for a lot of people and it's the biggest Christmas yet.
I know his family have bought presents for me and are assuming I'm coming. I just don't know what to do. I want to go but I hate the idea of my younger brother sitting at home with no company while I'm out enjoying myself.

Advice?

I think your fiancé is an arse actually, and I'd be seriously questioning his reaction. Being 'livid' because you hoped your own brother could be included in a day out? Sounds like a prick.

^

This

Bloody hell there are some miserable sods on here. It's one extra at Christmas.

OP, I don't think your partner was being mean spirited, it sounds like your parents were. And yes, you totally guilt-tripped him into it.

Why have you refused to answer/comment on why you think it is the responsibility of everyone but your parents to look after their son??

"Why have you refused to answer/comment on why you think it is the responsibility of everyone but your parents to look after their son??"

They are looking after him- in their own way. There is no suggestion that he is not being looked after.

It's not the issue of one extra at Christmas - there's always space for someone more: but the point is, if the MIL had wanted to invite the brother, she would have done!

She's had him before, she knows that OP's parents don't celebrate Christmas - and yet she chose not to issue the invite this year. Does that not tell everyone something? Of course she can't say no now she's been asked directly - but that doesn't mean she's pleased about it.

I think the BF made clear it wasn't an option - possibly having been party to the original discussions, or possibly having realised that if his mother wanted the brother there, she would have asked in the first place - and then felt manipulated. I suspect that's why he was bloody cross! I bet he's even crosser now he's been manipulated into putting his mother in the position where she can't say no

How do you parents feel about your brother celebrating Christmas? I am feeling it's kind of disrespectful to them to override their decision not to celebrate and to push for your brother to be included.

We only celebrate Christmas on a basic level. No tree, no Santa and no gifts from us. Our children receive their gifts on our holiday so they don't miss out. We have a Christmas lunch on Christmas Day, take part in the Christmas show, join in with secret santas, join in with work dinners etc. Regardless of whether other people agree, to us this is not "our" holiday and our children understand this and have NEVER EVER complained about it and therefore as a couple DH and I made the decision that this would be how we recognise Christmas. It's exactly the same as how we were brought up and how our siblings are bringing up their children.

I would be very hurt if someone criticised this and felt sorry for my children as per some of these posts. It shows complete disregard for understanding that it's ok to be a bit different and to not participate fully in Christmas and a lack of understanding of multi cultural Britain.

If OPs parents are of another religion and celebrate the traditions to do with that such as Hanukkah/Eid I wouldn't worry too much as your brother celebrates at another time of year.

If however they don't celebrate anything then I do feel very sorry for your DB. My DBs would always come before my ILs and in your situation would have him for Christmas Day and explain to ILs that I couldn't attend. Sounds like they have lots of people coming so will one person really be missed?

It really does depend in my opinion on whether your family celebrate any kind of festival.

"It's not the issue of one extra at Christmas - there's always space for someone more: but the point is, if the MIL had wanted to invite the brother, she would have done!"

Or she may not have thought of it? Or may have felt uncomfortable asking because she knows the boy's parents don't celebrate Christmas and didn't want to rock the boat............

I agree with the others who have said that you've made a rod for your own/MIL's back now. It was really rude to ask to bring a guest when you, yourself, are a guest and your parents will never celebrate Christmas so your brother is going to expect an invitation to your MIL's house every year. The longer it goes on, the more he'll come to expect it and the harder it will be to leave him out.

He's so young, he has years and years before he's old enough to celebrate/host Christmas himself. I think you'll have to host if you want your brother included in the celebrations in future.

I would also be pissed off if I was your DP. You've totally forced his hand, manipulating him into begging an invitation from his mum.

"It was really rude to ask to bring a guest when you, yourself, are a guest "

She's not a guest!!!

Speak to your MIL. Her house may be busy but Christmas is for children and if you were to explain how much your DB enjoyed himself last year, I'm sure she would be delighted to have him! But as others have suggested, perhaps do a few extra bits and bobs to try and make things easier for your MIL

I think your df knew that his mother would feel forced to say yes when she only invited him the other year due to the fact you where watching him.

I wouldn't be happy with being forced to ask someone who invited me and dh somewhere and we accepted if sil could come otherwise dh wouldn't, when there is no need to invite just because she liked those plans better than hers.

What happens next year? And the year after? Can you now never go to mils for Christmas unless your brother is invited until his old enough to have other people to celebrate with? If he loves Christmas that much your parents are the ones responsible for providing that Christmas experience for him not others by making them feel bad.

So in 11 years your brother has had one "proper" christmas, and now you think he would be "devastated" if he doesn't get to go again?

tbh I think you would be extremely rude and totally unreasonable to ask to bring him to your partners' house. They already have a shit ton of people to cater for, will want to concentrate on their own family, and actually, one extra person DOES make a difference - especially if they've already sorted presents and food for a specific number.

It isn't their responsibility to give your brother the traditional christmas experience. If anything, I would be speaking to your own parents about this, and pointing out that even if they don't believe in the religious background to it, they could make an effort to give your brother the christmas experience. It's part of UK culture - hardly anyone gives a crap about the religious angle anymore.

Comparing it to Diwali or whatnot isn't the same - Diwali isn't a national bank holiday which has been celebrated here for hundreds of years and integrated into our culture.

She's not a guest!!!

Of course she is, she doesn't live with her MIL! I'm engaged to my DP and we've been together for years but I consider myself a guest in my PIL's house.

So at what point do you become family?

Family can be guests! Guests are anyone who isn't resident in your home and in most cultures guests are revered and treated better than residents. I go to a lot more trouble for guests as a sign of respect to them. How is that incompatible with them being family?

BertrandRussell

Maybe I'm the wrong person to ask about this sort of thing as neither me nor DP are big on "family". We very much view us two as one little family with our own separate branches of family. He visits his mum, I visit mine and we only visit together a couple of times a year.

My mum isn't a "family" person either, she doesn't spend time with her own if she can help it and has never met DP's parents, even with our wedding being four months away. I'll always view my PIL as his family, but I accept that many other people don't feel the same way.

Your a guest in any home which is not the one you live in as it's not your home.

I'm married and would still say I'm a guest at my mils I wouldnt just presume I could raid the cupboards and start randomly cooking food like I do in my own home.

Chattymummyhere

Yes, this! ^

I like my PIL most of the time and they always make me feel welcome but I wouldn't get up and start rummaging around in their kitchen.

Hmmmm ... I think a lot of people are projecting (me included I guess as I just know my own MIL would feel "the more the merrier", and not in a passive-aggressive put-upon way, unless she's just put on a hell of an act all her life).

It's not the rudest thing in the world if its right for this family. I maintain that a partner who gets angry over someone wanting something like this is a little red flag - not necessarily abusive jerk behaviour, but definitely an indication of behaviour that will deepen over time and might mean long-term arguments and so on.

Anyway OP, have a candid chat with MIL after Christmas with a small extra "thank you" gift and ask how she really feels. Be really sincere in the way you ask and see how she responds. You can then focus in advance on next year.

Forget the "rod for your own back" nonsense. Maybe next year you'll start a new special tradition with your brother instead, but it's not the worst of all evils to ask for him to be included. And as he heads into the teens, he might not want to be anyway!!

How do you parents feel about your brother celebrating Christmas? I am feeling it's kind of disrespectful to them to override their decision not to celebrate and to push for your brother to be included.

Exactly, Count. I'm not seeing much respect for the parents' religious beliefs here from OP or on this thread. As far as I can see, they haven't been consulted at all. If I was mil, my first question would be 'is this ok with your mum and dad?'

Anyway OP, have a candid chat with MIL after Christmas with a small extra "thank you" gift and ask how she really feels. Be really sincere in the way you ask and see how she responds. You can then focus in advance on next year

It's baffling to me the number of posters on here with total lack of social nous.

You do not lobby your future MIL to get your brother invited for future Christmases. She's been rude enough as it is.

If anything's a red flag here it would be that.

If OP wants to do Christmases for her brother from next year onwards, she's completely free to do so.

Oh and she needs to get MIL a big present not a 'small extra' one.

A really decent bottle of champagne, minimum.