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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

WIBU to ask MNers who think Trans Women are 'Chicks With Dicks' to ...

847 replies

KKCupCakes · 31/10/2015 21:49

Take a look at this article about supporting families of Transgender people by the Gires.org.uk Website to see why that view is so utterly incorrect and harmful?
www.gires.org.uk/assets/supporting-families.pdf

OP posts:
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CactusAnnie · 08/11/2015 09:52

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

ShortcutButton · 08/11/2015 10:07

I agree with cactus, its not a positive change. Its fucking nuts

HermioneWeasley · 08/11/2015 10:10

Agree cactus

You can't change biological sex and since gender is bullshit, I'm not sure under what circumstances legally changing your gender matters?

Cerseirys · 08/11/2015 10:12

I'm sure it's been mentioned here already (as there's nearly 800 posts I'm not going to look back and check!) but I'm a bit worried about the UK introducing a gender recognition law similar to what they have in Ireland. I wouldn't like to think that many men would falsely claim to be women in order to enter women-only spaces, but you never know.

QueenStromba · 08/11/2015 10:33

It's already happening Cerseirys - Gender Trender has a pretty good list of men dressing as women to access women's spaces to perv on us and worse.

PrincessTeacake · 08/11/2015 14:11

I've been reading this thread with a lot of interest. I used to be very much on the 'transwomen are real women' fence but I'm coming around again.

I have two friends who have gone through opposite sides of the trans process. I have never known the FTM friend as anything but male, he never talks about it, never insists on any kind of treatment or concessions for himself and basically lives the way a man would live. Methinks there's an element of gendered socialization there, he lived as a woman for 19 years and is used to not being listened to.

Our other friend, who is mid-transition from M to F, is the polar opposite. She has publicly, in person and online, made a huge deal out of the details of her transition. She tends to be invasive in people's personal space and hyper-emotional and insists that we make concessions for this. At the moment she is involved in a very toxic relationship and anyone who expresses concern is a hateful bigot. It's very strange, when she lived as a male she was polite and respectful, but now as a female it seems to be a combination of how she thinks females should behave mixed with toxic male entitlement.

Speaking of which, I just attended a fashion event which was mostly attended by women, and one cross-dressing man attended too. (Not trans, was just a hobby.) We were very welcoming to him and treated him like one of the girls, but he had this curiously fixed idea of how women were meant to behave and he was trying to conform to that. He was a good bit bitchier than the other girls in attendance and found it weird that we were laughing so hard and so often. When we left to catch the bus, most of us swapped out our fancy shoes for flats and he was really taken aback by that, as though he expected us to be in fancy mode until we got home.

It does raise the question as to how you can be expected to be accepted as a woman when so much of the behavior is so very male.

ItsAllGoingToBeFine · 08/11/2015 17:24

Interesting editors note at the start of this blog:
dailybruin.com/2015/07/20/free-tampons-would-slow-flow-of-gender-inequality/

Zoey Freedman: Free tampons would slow flow of gender inequality
Zoey Freedman BY ZOEY FREEDMAN
Posted: July 20, 2015 7:04 am OPINION, TWO CENTS
SHARE TWEET
Editor’s note: This blog post refers to individuals who menstruate as women because the author wanted to highlight gender inequality in health care. We acknowledge that not all individuals who menstruate identify as women and that not all individuals who identify as women menstruate, but feel this generalization is appropriate considering the gendered nature of most health care policies.

ShortcutButton · 08/11/2015 17:38

FFS.. Its like a catalytic reaction. How have this tiny minority gained so much influence

FloraFox · 08/11/2015 17:50

Women apologising for daring to talk about women. RIP feminism.

EDisFunny · 08/11/2015 17:59

And will the editors at the dailybruin then add a note to a blog about prostate exams? Not all people who identify as male have a prostate you know.

I fell like I have fallen down the rabbit hole.

TribbleNamedDave · 08/11/2015 20:13

This article popped up on Huffpost women.

I'll be honest, the whole thing made me weep for the author. Did basic biology lessons at school pass her by? I got a bit mad about her not using women, but instead using cisgender.

slugseatlettuce · 08/11/2015 20:31

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

ShortcutButton · 08/11/2015 20:34

I'm sorry, what even is that article trib?? Confused

ShortcutButton · 08/11/2015 20:38

Huffpost is normally intelligent. Was that written by a child? I presume not. I don't get the point. Are we pretending now, that our reproductive system is something we are ignorant of? To pleases transgender people?

TribbleNamedDave · 08/11/2015 20:56

Shortcut I have no bloody idea, I struggled to get past my internal cry of misery that someone was that uneducated about their own body. This is all making me ruddy livid now, women have uterus's (what is the plural), it's a biological fact not a construct. There are issues that come with having one that ruddy need dealing with sometimes.

SoftDriftedSnow · 08/11/2015 21:02

That makes no sense. She has the body of a woman, no matter how she feels gender - wise.

I feel ancient. And I kinda hate the www and how easy it has become to wipe away so many strides relating to actual women's liberation.

SoftDriftedSnow · 08/11/2015 21:07

And why do "journalists" want to advertise the fact that they are about 10 in their understanding of the world?

Oh, I know. Buzzfeed lists get clicks. Facile. I hope they are thoroughly ashamed when they are 40. But the cis nonsense is causing real harm, so we can't wait that long for them to get a grip.

LunchpackOfNotreDame · 08/11/2015 21:23

Word to the wise don't discuss this thread with your DH if he's had a few beers, some of the gems DH has just come out with:

What the fuck, why would anyone who doesn't need a tampon want a tampon? They look scary!

What happens to the prostate in transwomen? Do they remove that too or do they need to get Called for prostate exams? Will they argue it's against their rights as a woman and request a smear?

CoteDAzur · 08/11/2015 21:28

Lunchpack Grin

LunchpackOfNotreDame · 08/11/2015 21:29

He's still chuntering away here. I've switched off

user838383 · 08/11/2015 21:34

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Alisvolatpropiis · 08/11/2015 21:38

I mentioned Tara to my DH and was absolutely enraged when he said he saw no issue with said person being in a women's prison.

Berk.

mathanxiety · 08/11/2015 22:02

There are not many trans people around though so we need to keep it all in proportion along with trying to be kind to everyone and learning what vocabulary makes people feel comfortable.

How many teenage boys should it take in a girls' locker room and shower before it all becomes a little preposterous, DeoGratias?

I can tell you that very honestly it would only take one for me.

I am very comfortable with the term 'woman' and very uncomfortable with the terms 'cis woman' and 'cis gender'. If someone attempts to call me a cis woman or use the term cis gender they will learn that and I will expect them to respect my wishes.

The term woman has only recently been acceptable for women to use when referring to ourselves. Up to a few short decades ago women used to be called girls and many even referred to themselves as girls. I.e. not really possessing adult status. Now we are apparently to have 'woman' taken from us and replaced with a term that implies our gendered experience might as well never have happened, gender being such a nebulous and subjective thing, apparently.

WoodHeaven · 09/11/2015 11:56

Lunch your DH ia ace!
Very very good points actually....

changedmyname12345 · 09/11/2015 13:04

I have put my views on my blog [[http://hungryofbristol.blogspot.co.uk/2015/11/freedom-of-speech-womens-rights-and.html ]] - I agree with what has been said and hope that someone will take some notice of the views expressed...