WIBU to ask MNers who think Trans Women are 'Chicks With Dicks' to ...

[KKCupCakes]

Take a look at this article about supporting families of Transgender people by the Gires.org.uk Website to see why that view is so utterly incorrect and harmful?
www.gires.org.uk/assets/supporting-families.pdf

I find it sad that instead of helping people come to terms with the body they have, the trans movement is telling them the answer is to change. I find it really sad actually. I've mentioned on a few threads that I have suffered from bdd and disordered eating, so I really can understand the hate, but I will never believe the answer is to change your body.

I also find it sad that instead of taking the chance to knock down gender, people are enforcing it with all their might. And doing so in the name of progress of all things.

I did say I am struggling to articulate my thoughts into words. I shouldn't have posted, sorry.

No, don't apologise, howto :) I see that you reckon C. Jenner may have an ASD - I have no idea about this; hypermobility is not always accompanied by autism, by any means.

I'm not sure where you see a relationship between autogynephilia, narcissism and autism. Were you thinking Jenner might have been used by narcissistic transwomen as a kind of effigy? Or am I on the wrong track?

Is it to do with the concern that trans activists often appear narcissistic & autogynephilic, obsessed with their sense of self and presenting a hypersexualised, fetishised version of femininity, contrast sharply with the "quiet" trans person, who may or may not be gender critical - I would guess dependent upon how much theorising they may or may not have done about it, as opposed to simply struggling to come to terms with not fitting easily in to a stereotyped straight gender role and trying to find a societal box they feel more comfortable in - and the concern that this dysphoria may have an association with autism? There may be something there.

I see that you reckon C. Jenner may have an ASD - I have no idea about this; hypermobility is not always accompanied by autism, by any means. It's a possibility Jenner may, Caitlyn Jenner's wiki page states she gave up athletics due to the associated pain.

I'm not sure where you see a relationship between autogynephilia, narcissism and autism. take out the autism

Were you thinking Jenner might have been used by narcissistic transwomen as a kind of effigy? Or am I on the wrong track?

Yes

To be clear, yes to the effigy.

Munchkin, yes I was thinking along those lines.

Hmm. I wouldn't think an ASD would preclude autogynephilia. A fair number of people with ASDs have sexual obsessions, as they obsess over other things too. I don't know whether there's any sign of Jenner having an ASD. I do see signs of autogynephilia in her physical presentation and her words.

Being turned on by your own sexual presentation is narcissistic but doesn't equal malignant narcissism. She may just be an ex-bloke who fancies herself as a (stereotyped) woman. She may also have been hijacked by activists, I don't know. But this wouldn't mean she has autism.

Sorry, I'm not much help, am I!

The quiet vs narcissistic trans might be onto something.

There seems to be two extremes of trans activists - the entirely masculine male who presents as entirely male, but says he is female.

• The transactivist who have large implants and dress in a very stereotypically and overtly "feminine" manner.

Does this group = autogynephilia?

The trans people I know are not like this at all - they are very quiet and just dress in jeans and t-shirt, no make-up.

Does this group = body dysphoria?

Thanks very much for that petition link, Empress, really good to know that sanity is starting to take hold.

Its an out of fashion term now, but in old speak i would say the body dysmorphic TW in jeans are 'transexual' (of course they cant actually change sex, but that is what their aim is) and i'd say these are more entitled to womens spaces etc, and then the autogynaphilic are TG.

I'm understanding autist cpuld be taken advantage of and used as flag person by narcissists, but not seeing how you are seeing CJ as a wallflower who is being taken advantage of? But i dont know much abut her, only first impressions, but they dont say wallflower!

Oh and yy dont apologise! It takes my brain a while to catch up sometimes!

I'm very intrigued if a link has been spotted between TG and asd/hm. If i were 10 years younger, i imagine i'd be being coerced shuftied towards binding my boobs...

As a member of the eds community and having dc with hypermobility can I say that I'm more than about the eds/hm/autism/trans thing being bandied about.

Can you explain why the Lunchpack? It was something raised by a study I think, not saying that autism=transgender or anything but that there was perhaps a higher incidence than would be expected or something. So I don't think anyone is bandying it about, just discussing something that was raised.

Can you expand on your reaction?

It's more the eds - autism link.

There is apparently a higher rate of ASD in the transgender community than in the general population.

www.huffingtonpost.com/kyle-simon/is-there-a-link-between-autism-and-gender-dysphoria_b_3896317.html

www.researchgate.net/publication/272825258_Neurovisceral_phenotypes_in_the_expression_of_psychiatric_symptoms.

Lunch, the above research was posted on the hmsa website.

Did you not know there are high rates of asd in eds lunch? Its hypothesised to be due to hypermobility in the neural connective tissue. I have eds too, thats exactly why im interested if there is a link :)

Learn something new every day! Very enlightening!

As an autistic person I cannot accept that there is a higher rate of transgenderism amongst autistic people. If anything I'd expect it to be lower. We're generally very logical, evidence people who don't conform to social expectations that often we're unaware of or just don't get anyway. We're also more likely to call bullshit when everyone is thinking it but knows it's not polite to say it out loud.

Why would an autistic male say with certainty that they feel like a woman? Most of don't even feel human half the time.

*Most of us

Interestingly, saying he always felt different is something Caitlyn said over and over in her programme.

*she