AIBU?
AIBU to think people should say what they fucking mean?
LashesandLipstick · 30/06/2015 20:03
Inspired by threads in which I was told asking a question is rude because "people feel awkward saying no" and "if the person wants to, offer to do it yourself and if they want to they'll tell you not to and offer instead"
AIBU to think people shouldn't play these stupid games? Just say what you mean for Christs sake. I'm sure an adult can take you politely saying no to a request. All this does is cause confusion and create weird social norms that make no sense and confuse the hell out of people who aren't neurotypical or who are foreign.
Stop it.
DoJo · 30/06/2015 20:14
It's not conscious game-playing - it's societal and cultural convention, which is hard to fight against. There are times when asking a question is rude in itself (such as on the thread you're referring to when someone is asking someone who already has a lot on to do them an inconvenient favour rather than just offering to do it themselves) and times when the honest answer would be rude, no matter how politely you try to frame it.
Radical honesty is a nice idea, but unworkable in practice - the reason that people use euphemism, and what you see as 'game-playing' is because it oils the wheels of social interaction and actually makes it easier for the majority to get along, not a deliberate attempt to exclude those who are unwilling or unable to participate.
PyjamasLlamas · 30/06/2015 20:15
It's not a game. It's socialised etiquette.
If a guest is at your house and they say 'oh sorry I won't be able to eat that could you make me a a plain grilled chicken' of course the host cannot say no. Because they would feel rude even though they don't want to cook a chicken breast when dinner is already made and then it would be awkward and their guest won't be able to eat anything and then the friendship has soured.
Can you see that there is fallout from saying 'no' to things?
It was explained to you many many times (not by me I was just reading) about how it is really hard and uncomfortable to say no because you are actually thinking about your relationship with the person asking you a question. You don't want to ruin the relationship by saying no.
But you didn't really seem to understand or acknowledge that you understood this.
Hygge · 30/06/2015 20:17
Is this from the thread about the person cooking something like thirteen different food courses for a large group of people, and then being asked if she could go off menu and make extra but different food for a picky guest who didn't like something from every single dish she was making?
That was rude of him to ask, I thought, but yes she should be able to say no, and just no, without being made to feel bad about it or like she was the one being unreasonable.
LashesandLipstick · 30/06/2015 20:17
DoJo why is it unworkable? Why can't people stop seeing a "no" as rude or taking it personally? I also don't see how an honest answer is rude, if you don't want to know why ask the question?
Never considered most people aren't conscious of it but that makes sense.
PyjamasLlamas · 30/06/2015 20:18
I think maybe you need to take on board the numerous things people have said on the other thread tbh. How many times can it be explained to you.
And maybe think more carefully
next times when you make a request. 'Would this person feel
Obliged to say yes even d that's not really how they feel?' That might give you an idea about whether it's ok to ask or not.
LashesandLipstick · 30/06/2015 20:19
Pyjamas that's just the thing - why should saying no sour the friendship? I'm not friends with people so that they'll do me favours.
I'd be more annoyed if someone pretended to be okay with it and was secretly cross than if they just said no!
People did explain it but it makes no fucking sense to be perfectly honest. Communication exists for a reason.
NRomanoff · 30/06/2015 20:22
It's not etiquette. Etiquette is asking for a favour politely. Or saying 'no' politely.
Personally I think people dance around not quite asking for a favour so they can say 'I didn't ask they offered to help'
And we have been conditioned to think that 'no I don't want to' is something bad. That putting yourself out for anyone and everyoneakes you a better person'.
LashesandLipstick · 30/06/2015 20:24
pyjamas while unpleasant unless you're prepared for them to say yes, why ask? You're inviting opinion. Again I'd be annoyed if I asked an opinion and someone lied!
Romanoff I agree with that, especially etiquette - you can say no without being nasty, I don't think people realise that
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