To think this is rude at a concert

[TheRobbingBastards]

We went to DS's Summer concert last night. This is a big event for the music department and the children who perform.

My judgey pants were pulled well up at the couple who arrived with two younger DS's (about 7is) in tow, plonked themselves in the front row then fished an iPad in a luminous green case out of a bag. The two boys then spent the whole concert playing a game that involved much waving of arms. All the time they were sat in front of the stage, in direct eyeline of the children performing

In fairness they had the sound down, both boys stayed in their seats all the way through the concert and apart from the occasional muffled gasp or cheer they were quiet. I also realise that expecting DC to behave themselves through an event like that is easier said than done, and don't necessarily judge the parents for using an iPad to keep them entertained. It's more the inconsideration of allowing them to distract the performers as well as the audience several rows behind them.

So AIBU and curmudgeonly or was this unnecessarily rude and thoughtless?

"back of the bus" mentality implies segregating people purely based on the colour of their skin.

Suggesting that someone with a child who may disturb a school performance for both the audience and the performers sit somewhere where any disturbance will have less impact isn't prejudice, it just makes sense - for everyone. Sitting to the side or that back means EVERYONE can enjoy the show.

If this makes me guilty of believing that people with SN are inferior then I am very disappointed in myself and would love an explanation as to why it is so.

Should I just have accepted that the person behind me in the cinema had no control over their behaviour and put up with the constant kicking of my seat? I am not a good enough person, I'm afraid, I moved.

It might be the case if it was the royal opera house but to say or imply that 'those' children should be sat at the back or side (and be clear that this means 'away from') at a kids primary school play is horrible.

It isn't so much about putting up with behaviour (seat kicking) as accepting there may be reasons for that behaviour and those reason are things you cannot know. So you get up and move - great - the parent can't, can she?

I think inclusion to some people means that people with sn are allowed to be around "normal" people as long as they don't do anything that a "normal" person might find annoying. If that happens then they cannot stay there because their needs will always be less important. But "normal" people can be annoying as they want to be to people with sn.

Yes, I moved. That might not always be possible. So should I accept that the person maybe can't help it, or turn around and ask politely if they can stop?
Do parents of SN children mind it when that happens? If I am told "sorry, she can't help it", then what? I know I still could not be a good enough person to tolerate my seat being kicked.

I don't see why anybody would have an issue with a polite request for a seat not to be kicked but the implication seems to be 'you can come out - as long as you don't do anything that disturbs Normal People.'

Which is a rather nasty attitude.

If someone genuinely can't help kicking a seat then the ideal thing is for that seat not to be sat on which is what you did.

It might be the case if it was the royal opera house but to say or imply that 'those' children should be sat at the back or side (and be clear that this means 'away from') at a kids primary school play is horrible.

Well, that's rather a contradiction. You're saying that disturbing a ROH performance would not be OK, but disturbing a primary school play is. Why is that? Because the ROH employs professionals, because they are adults, because people have paid a lot for their seats?

Are you saying that the primary school children have less right to perform in front of a quiet audience?

As others have said to those primary school children, they may as well be in the ROH. To them it's JUST as important.

No. I'm saying that telling people with special needs they should sit at the back is horrible and that is a particularly unkind attitude at a primary school performance.

If someone genuinely can't help kicking a seat then the ideal thing is for that seat not to be sat on which is what you did.

Or the seat-kicker be seated where kicking won't disturb others. Which is just the same as asking people to sit at the side or the back of the school hall if their charges may disturb others.

Last week we went as a family to my dd's summer music concert. My mum, dh and I sat in the front row with ds, with his ear defenders and his ipad (with earphones) which he played with at a few times through the hour long concert.

We sat in the front row because ds gets to see his sisters perform (he struggles with picking things out of groups things, visually, so further back means he wouldn't see them) and because with mobility problems, if we needed to take him out, it is easier and less disruptive than trying to squeeze past people and then get down the steps, which he struggles with.

It is the first teatime concert we have managed to take him to, because he wouldn't have coped previously, but with the help of having the distraction of the ipad and the position we sat in (discussed with the head teacher) he did so well, and we were really proud of him. His big sisters were delighted to see him there for their performances, and they waved to him. It was a really, really lovely and happy moment for our family.

I find reading this thread just so depressing, I really hope that no-one in the concert was judging us, tutting, resenting us or thinking we should have been relegated to the back of the theatre.

At ds's school they have regular whole school assemblies, and little concerts. Ds attends a special needs resource base within the school, so there are lots of children with additional needs, both in the shows and the audience, along with siblings, parents, grandparents and babies. They are wonderful, inclusive, sometimes raucous, sometimes thoughtful affairs, enjoyed by everyone. No child is made to feel as though they shouldn't be there, all needs are accomodated for, even if those needs that might clash.

I wish the world in general were a little more like ds's school.

Thing is though those posters saying this stuff are oblivious to just how bad their attitude is. It is sad, very sad.

I am actually now questioning my conceding to sitting to the side. Actually why should we? It's not like he has the bloody thing blaring full volume and flashing.

Suggesting that someone with a child who may disturb a school performance for both the audience and the performers sit somewhere where any disturbance will have less impact isn't prejudice, it just makes sense - for everyone. Sitting to the side or that back means EVERYONE can enjoy the show.

Exactly. Why wouldn't you choose to minimise any disturbance you cause to others, whether it's due to special needs or not?

How would you feel if told your DC should sit at the back, away from "normal" people because of something they can't help? It smacks of the "back of the bus" mentality.

No one has said that, purple. No one has said "away from normal people". It's very unfair and somewhat dishonest of you to imply that. People are saying that any DC liable to cause a distraction should not be allowed to do so out of respect for the DCs performing.

I didn't have to be told. I knew DS2 (NT) would probably distract the DCs on the stage so I chose to sit at the back. The DCs on the stage, both NT and with SNs, deserved every chance to perform at their best without distraction by anybody.

I have a disability that can cause a disturbance to others. I do seek to minimise its impact on others.

Morage. With respect that's your choice.

I'm sure you wouldn't love it if you arrived somewhere and were automatically directed to a seat at the back because of your disability.

Which ultimately means that children who are oblivious to their behaviour should be 'kept away' from others doesn't it? Parents who have children who behave differently to the norm should 'keep them away'?

And mythical. With respect the kids with sN who can't help making a noise also deserve to view the performance.

Instead of segregating them so that the performing kids aren't upset why not teach the performing kids a bit about tolerance and inclusion.

Ds sat at the front with his ipad, and had to get up and down several times - we managed it hopefully with minimal distraction or upset to anyone, and he and his sisters got to enjoy the concert in the same way that other siblings were able to.

Isn't this how it should be?

But that's exactly what does happen in many places, Fanjo.

Wheelchair users are positioned near the fire exits as far as is possible. Most theatres have designated seating for audience members with disabilities.

Hazey. No. Obviously you should have kept him at home or sat at the back.

Mythical well that's so they can be evacuated first in case of a fire I assume, which is a different matter. Somewhat obtuse point to make.

exactly fanjo, this is what is so lovely at ds's school, the children, both those with additional needs and none, are very accepting of each other. how do people think special schools manage, with trying to juggle everyone's needs so that everyone can get the best out of something like a concert

With understanding, that's how.

Anyway I have no interest in arguing all day against the segregation of kids with SN.

Clearly no one read the post from MNHQ.

Fanjo - Actually it would be fine. But I was brought up to have consideration for others.

Nobody is talking about segregation.

Haxey. .exactly. .you should see the performances at DD''s school. Organised mayhem with people wandering about and making a noise. Everyone has fun.