Muslim mums at our school don't mix with non-Muslim mums

[Vanillacrescents]

There are a large number of mums wearing headscarves who are obviously Muslim at our school. They only talk to each other. Whenever I greet these mums, they don't greet back but prefer to talk to each other. In fact they look the other way. The other day I was first at the school gate and a younger Muslim mum was also waiting. I managed to have a friendly chat with her but the minute another Muslim mum arrived they only acknowledged each other talking in their own language and blanked me.

Yesterday ds fell off his scooter because he tried not to collide with one of these mums as she wasn't paying attention, looking away waving at her friends. Ds fell over and landed in front of her feet. He scraped his knee and started crying however this woman didn't say a word to him or smile at him.
I helped ds up right in front of her and still not a kind word or smile. Instead she gave me a really dirty look and tried to stare me down. I just don't get this attitude and feel it is unpleasant and segregating. I will always greet people regardless of their race, religion, taste in clothes or whatever and treat them with basic respect and be polite. It almost feels like these mums look down on everyone who isn't part of their community.

Some of these replies are really depressing. Standard daily mail type answers.

Why does anyone give a fuck what colour people's skin is or what religion they follow or if they don't want to talk to you because you eat the wrong type of cheese?

How does it really affect you? Really?

I would be interested to know what part of the UK the Op and other people who have had similar problems with Muslims have. I have never come across anything like this bar the odd individual unfriendly parent (not Muslim though).

Also, someone earlier posted that her school held a meeting and it was explained why it was that the Muslim mums weren't allowed to talk to others. What is that all about? Since when have Muslims not been allowed to talk to other parents and their children???

Sparky maybe they where BORN HERE shock horror and yes fish the good old days of 'Love Thy Neighbour' and 'no blacks no Irish no dogs' when everyone co existed peacefully and no blacks or Asians got beaten up or treated badly because we all just mixed along nicely brilliant

This thread is like the Daily Wails readers replies on acid in some places !

Every now and again a seemingly innocent question is posed about Muslims/Islam which often seems to me as thinly disguised racism.
It is common for people to stick with their 'own kind' when in the minority. Moreover you get lots of cliques in playgrounds.
While I do hate the acceptance of Islamaphobia, I have personal experience of being excluded by a group of muslim mums. My husband and children are Muslims and when we started at our current school the Muslim mums tried to 'recruit' me One lady would almost physically grab me at the school run and try to tell me what to do about issues such as participating in the harvest assembly (they wouldn't let their kids) However by the end of the first term (after ds played a sheep in the Nativity) they realised I wasn't one of them! I am now shunned! Meanwhile we were the only non catholic family in our street growing up and that wasn't fun (a very long story) so I believe anyone is capable of that kind of behaviour. It isn't exclusive to any race. This is why I try hard to bring my kids up to be open minded, non judgemental and friendly to everyone

llem73 to coin your own phrase, what you have posted is thinly disguised racism

Your op really pissed me off.

As much as you say you aren't trying to be a shit-stirrer it's impossible to target a single group and say the things you have said.

If, as you say, you do have Muslim friends from another community and you aren't in fact prejudiced then why use the word Muslim? Why have you made it about their religion? Why didn't you post a general message saying how mums from a differnt background are not mixing??? You could have started the same discussion without being inflammatory.

It's akin to me saying all the White mums at my local children's centre don't acknowledge me. It's shit stirring and inflammatory bcos Its making a big negative generalisation about a huge varied group.

It's a real real shame that you couldn't see past the head scarves. I don't assume the mums who don't talk to me are doing it because of their race, I assume it's becsuse they are cliquey and lack basic manners/social skills. I wouldn't dream of writing a post about how white mums think them selves superior based on this alone. Mainly because I don't make sweeping xenophobic generalisations from one group of people.

I saw a smartly dressed guy on the London underground today wearing a red Sou' wester.... made me chuckle.

Oh and in case anyone reads that ^ and thinks 'oh look it's the don't-offend-the-Muslims-brigade' rather than realising I have a valid point - I would like to clarify that I don't think people are unaccountable for their actions and should be offered special status because they are Muslim (or any other group). I think it's an unnecessary attempt to chuck a bit of muck at 'the moslems'

This would have gone differently OP if you had left religion/race out of it and just called them a bunch of cliquey condescending mums

I think you just have a clique, that could be my children's school. They are all white/uk but sound very similar.

Not in the least. I have related my very real experience. I got a very hard time from these parents which only eased off when the ringleader's kids left the school. I'm probably writing about it today because it caused me a lot of upset and it was hard to share in RL. The children of these mums also told my ds he wasn't allowed to play with them because his dad was a bad muslim. Funnily enough now they're at secondary school they get on really well without parental interference.It isn't racism to relate something that actually happened. What is racist is to extrapolate from that experience that all people of that religion behave like that.
Going back to the original post, I believe people's behaviour and attitudes are based on how people have treated them in the past. So in other words if you are a veiled woman who has got used to people scowling at you on a daily basis (which is a common experience) you start to almost expect a negative response from everyone. I once went shopping with an Asian friend in a mall and I was shocked at how many people scowled at her. Therefore if you really want to get along with muslim mums at school you may want to make a bit extra effort on a longer basis.

Altinkum, you typed: however if a child feel over they would help, by calling over a teacher or getting the teacher involved etc...

This suggests that the female Muslim parents wouldn't offer assistance to a child in need but would go and get a teacher. So it kind of suggests that they are not only not allowed to interact with non muslim parents but their children as well, which sounds more than odd to me.

I am keen to know why it is they aren't allowed to mix with non Muslims and yet decide to stick their children in a building with a load of non Muslims for the whole day. I would love to know where the ruling is that you cant talk to non Muslims or help their children if they fall over.

Oh, I say all this as a Muslim myself by the way.

I don't think it's a question of a "ruling"--probably more to do with the fact that some brands of Islam (like those that incline towards Salafiism) stress the duty to avoid unnecessary interaction with unbelievers.

I don't think it's the norm for British muslims, but attitudes of this kind are found among a minority of muslims.

Of course, similar ideas can be found among other religious groups as well, like Jehovahs Witnesses.

Not a problem with the mums at our school.

Funnnily enough dd fell over in the playground yesterday and was helped up by a lovely lady who just happened to be a Muslim wearing a headscarf. She'd given dd a hug and was producing an antiseptic swab and a plaster before I'd even made it across the playground from my converation with anohter lovely Muslim lady about how to make flat breads!

I've never heard of something so ridiculous.

If a Muslim didn't offer assistance to a child/person that fell on the floor, the Muslim would be sinful in the eyes of God! Helping others (regardless of whether they are Muslim or not) is at the heart of the Muslim faith.

There is only one woman with a child in dd's year who wears a headscarf.
She is very shy, her English is unconfident and she keeps to the edges of the playground. There is a Brazilian mum too who keeps to the edges.

I think some people are shy and being gregarious doesn't come to all easily.

Some groups stick together more. The Stamford Hill Jews are probably similar. If you want to maintain sexist, racist, homophobic communities where women are subservient to men then you have to try to keep your children away from the true liberal path so they are not polluted by such appalling ideas as equality.