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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

AIBU to think that Islamist Extremism is on the rise in Britain as well as the rest of Europe?

747 replies

DikTrom · 02/08/2014 11:57

In schools, local communities, pro ISIS demonstrations etc. with Muslim leaders remaining silent.

Is this something new or was it always there right under the surface?

Have we been to tolerant to people who openly reject our values and want to overthrow our society?

OP posts:
Nancy66 · 02/08/2014 12:05

A drop in the ocean compared to the catholic church's cover up of paedophile priests....

But I don't think it is more widespread just more widely reported

Jinsei · 02/08/2014 12:05

Anti-semitism is also on the rise.

As is islamophobia....

HermioneWeasley · 02/08/2014 12:08

I was just discussing this the other night. It certainly seems more evident, whether that is just that it is more reported than it was 20 years ago, I don't know.

It is NOT islamaphobic to talk about the atrocities and misogyny carried out by extremists in the name is Islam or due to some foul and twisted interpretation of the religion.

paxtecum · 02/08/2014 12:22

DikTrom: Great British Values:
The systematic abuse of children in care, ie council run care homes and boarding schools, some of it carried out by MPs.

Hillsborough: the cover up by the police under the instruction of the great leader of our country.

Bloody Sunday cover up, again under instruction from those at the top.

The Guildford Four, the Maguire Seven, the Birmingham Six, Stefan Kiszko and all the other Miscarriages of Justice that involved lies by the police.

MPs expenses.

Tax avoiders.

Our society is very far from perfect and some of people at the top have very questionable values.

Original poster
DikTrom · 02/08/2014 12:25

I know where I prefer to live. But please stick to the theme of my thread or start a thread yourself.

OP posts:
gordyslovesheep · 02/08/2014 12:31

plenty of people in the UK don't like it's values and want to change things - religious people as well as political groups - it's called freedom - it's great

Islamic extremism is no more rife than other forms of extreme views.

paxtecum · 02/08/2014 12:35

Funnily enough this is a public forum and I can post what I wish to within the guidelines.

I consider what I have posted to be relevant to this thread and of course, we do like to think that in the UK, in our society, we have Freedom of Speech.

Original poster
DikTrom · 02/08/2014 12:37

As we have freedom of speech you are free to start your own thread.

OP posts:
paxtecum · 02/08/2014 12:41

I wanted to comment on your thread.
I don't want to start my own thread.

MsVenus · 02/08/2014 12:44

What are the specific values that you are refering to as there are many?

thecatfromjapan · 02/08/2014 12:46

I think one of the greatest threats to our democratic societies in recent years has been the decline in narratives challenging capitalism. The banks crisis ( ie. theft) and the immoral actions conducted by the US in pursuit of continued cheap energy, THEY are what destabilise the world, THEY are behind the increase in religious-inflected resistance discourses.
I am no fan of those discourses but they have a history - rooted not least in the eradication of left-wing progressive movements in the Middle East - the existence of which terrified the US.

thecatfromjapan · 02/08/2014 12:50

You know, I am a loving person, but i am seriously starting to hate the cynicism of some of these new posters with their shitty threads. The sim doesn't se to be to actually get anyone to agree, but rather to move the window of the 'acceptable', of the 'reasonable', to move the perception of what constitutes the 'middle ground' way off to what should actually be vilified as abhorrent.
What a steaming pile of shit.

thecatfromjapan · 02/08/2014 12:55

And I will add that I find the co-opts toon of hate narratives that subtly demonise swathes of the electorate by our government in order to keep us in fear of the Islamist bogeyman SICKENS and DISGUSTS me.
Just because a government cynically employs hate discourses in order to fuck over it's citizens, siphon money from the workers to the rich and roll back the welfare state , it doesn't mean those discourses are true.

RonaldMcDonald · 02/08/2014 12:57

You are not unreasonable to think that but you are unreasonably policing your thread

RonaldMcDonald · 02/08/2014 12:59

Maybe extremism is on the rise generally in all forms
Perhaps this is simply the end of people joining things in a name only sense
You are in wholeheartedly or just not bothered at all?

Pumpkinpositive · 02/08/2014 13:00

Just because a government cynically employs hate discourses in order to fuck over it's citizens, siphon money from the workers to the rich and roll back the welfare state , it doesn't mean those discourses are true.

^
This.

OP, rather early in the thread to be quite so er, prescriptive, isn't it?

HappyAgainOneDay · 02/08/2014 13:01

If people don't like living somewhere, they should move to another place, whether it's from town to countryside (and complain about cockerels crowing) or from countryside to town (and complain about traffic noise). If they don't like this country, they are free to move somewhere else (another EU country perhaps). If they don't like standards and values of their chosen country, they can move to one where they like them. It's called freedom as others have said.

gordyslovesheep · 02/08/2014 13:06

it's okay to criticise your home country though - or did I miss that memo ...we do have British Muslims you know!

I am always a bit mystified by our 'values' - I worry our obsession with it may lead to compulsory morris dancing and mandatory roast beef school dinners

MarmiteMania · 02/08/2014 13:21

It's always intregued me how people who openly reject our values and have no intention of integrating into our society are still happy to live here, many living off the state. I think we have been ridiculously tolerant to them in a way only the British seem to be capable of.

paxtecum · 02/08/2014 13:29

Marmite: that seems to sum up many British immigrants in Spain and France too.

I know British people who have lived in the Canaries for 50 years, they frequent the British Club and they speak no Spanish at all.

gordyslovesheep · 02/08/2014 13:43

do you have an exact figure? and which values do you mean?

MarmiteMania · 02/08/2014 13:44

Paxtecum absolutely- I believe those british should certainly make an effort to learn the language of the country they have made their home. But the difference is that they do not wish ill on their host country- whereas a significant proportion of Islamic extremists who have made the uk their home most certainly do. Does 11/7 ring any bells?

OneStepCloser · 02/08/2014 13:48

Sorry, whats 11/7? I seem to be having a blank moment!

MarmiteMania · 02/08/2014 13:56

Onestepcloser please excuse my mistake, i meant the 7/11 London Underground bombing. Any recollections now?

softlysoftly · 02/08/2014 13:57

Well Marmite my values are to work hard, be in a stable relationship if possible before planning children, not to defoul my country with litter and dogshit. To be kind as I can and to eschew violence.

There are many many many people in Britain who live happily on the state and reject those values. Perhaps "we" should be less tolerant off them and throw them out?

Where too I'm not sure as they are generally British but I have far far less in common with them than I do my Bengali in laws. Funny that.

Do you see how ridiculous spouting "values" is when there are polar differences in values across this mongrel nation?