AIBU to think that Islamist Extremism is on the rise in Britain as well as the rest of Europe?

[DikTrom]

In schools, local communities, pro ISIS demonstrations etc. with Muslim leaders remaining silent.

Is this something new or was it always there right under the surface?

Have we been to tolerant to people who openly reject our values and want to overthrow our society?

I am concerned that extremism is on the rise, certainly. As is the average Muslim on the street. The difference between myself and the average Muslim on the street is that I, as a white British woman, am "allowed" to be just scared and nothing further. A normal Muslim woman is expected to be "tackling the problem". Which makes perfect sense because normal Christians totally stood up against and forcibly stopped the IRA didn't we? Oh, no, we didn't...

Seriously, why are we pointing the finger at innocent Muslims and asserting that because they share a religion/skin colour/style of dress with people who happen to be terrorists they should be the ones to deal with it? Why can't we accept that the majority of Muslims are just as concerned and scared as we are? The majority of people in this country are not terrorists or extremists. Fact. Black, white, brown, Muslim, Christian, Hindu, Jedi, whatever, all of us together make a huge giant majority of NOT TERRORISTS. Yet we're expecting the 4% of the population to stand up against extremists alone? While we pick apart every single aspects of their lives and religion. Resent any mention of their festivals in fucking Asda ffs.

What are we asking of them exactly? You must tackle the extremist problem. You must practice your religion where we don't have to see it or any evidence of it. But don't be living where there are others who practice the same religion, that's annoying, stay where you're a minority. If businesses try to engage your custom by including your religious needs in their service it's YOUR FAULT, stop spending money so this does not happen. Before you apply for a job, check that no BRITISH PEOPLE want that job, I don't care if you were born here you still can't come to our country and take our jobs. Don't be claiming benefits though either, you need to contribute by finding a job that no British person wants.

No pressure or anything

Sorry to double post but Diktrom I just saw your post as well. If you are seriously basing your views of Muslims off Mumsnet you need help.

I've not spoken about "the Jews" at all and neither has anyone else I've seen on MN. So that is rubbish from the start, nice attempt to smear though. Neither has anyone said that every single thing Muslims do is great. al Muhajiroun are fairly reprehensible, what I have said however is that they do not represent mainstream Muslim opinion and are not particularly good at anything apart from getting media attention. Also, if you're wanting to take up the gun, you're wasting your time with that lot. Those are matters of fact.

As for "revert" how is that a major issue. I've heard the term before and it seems to do no harm. In the old days people who converted to Catholicism were called "perverts" by Protestants, that was a far more offensive term. If "reverts" is how Muslims want to think of people who become Muslims from other faiths, that neither picks anyone's pocket nor breaks their bones.

flank seriously, feel like some one should give you a round of applause! But while your still up there on your soap box, can you tell me who 'we' is?

I don't do any of the things you say 'we do' , so inadvertently your lumping all British people in with a few who are intolerant. Kind of what your shouting about yourself.

shocking there have been plenty of prolific hate preachers linked to terrorist cells I out of this country, that's why some of them are banned in certain European country's. So your theory about not listening to the loud ones is quiet naive. But thankfully I do think our intelligence will be all over it.

op the post about MN seemingly being full of muslim women wanting to overthrow western society is hilarious - I mean come on you must have had a good giggle posting that.

From the posts I've seen by muslim women are just normal day to day bg standard shit about there family, work ect..unless, like I have seen a few threads seemingly picking at their religion, then obviously they are going to bite back because it's something they care about. Just like I wouldn't have anybody pic at things I care about. These women do not want oppression and segregation. And if they do, they can take them selfs of some where else because there is no place for oppression, dictatorship and segregation in our free society.

Softly I would say that listening to hate preachers is good strategy. That will tell you what current political thought is going on amongst people inclined to terrorism. What is not good strategy is focusing on al Muhajiroun. They need an eye kept on them but are not a major threat.

How terrorism works is a bit complex and has changed over the past few decades. In the era of social media, what you have to worry about is less al Muhajiroun and more networks and connections which are beneath the surface. Someone who's a very vocal member of al Muhajiroun, has burnt poppies or shouted "British police burn in hell" or held up posters saying "Behead all those who disagree with Islam" is on the police radar. As I am and as many other people are. Moving from that to the underground armed struggle is nearly impossible because you.are.being.watched.

Someone who's always kept his or her nose clean will do far better at this. It's nothing to do with Islam in general, it is how the strategy of armed struggle works. I am not saying do not watch them, but if you are worried about terrorists....it might not be al Muhajiroun.

What is not good strategy is focusing on al Muhajiroun. They need an eye kept on them but are not a major threat.

I'm not. I used it as an example.

Also shocking Michael Adebolajo one of the men who murdered Lee Rigby was known at hate rally's. Not.every.one.is.being.watched.

It doesn't matter if terrorists have millions of funding and hijacking planes or are small fry murdering men in the street.

Extremists damage young minds. That is dangerous.

Pmsl at Zaz, the Muslim community here in Newcastle is literally tiny compared to other towns and cities in the UK. I personally have seen no signs of any sort of 'takeover' but I don't read the DM so maybe I don't know what to look out for....

I'm sure there are some areas with a high proportion of immigrants - birds of a feather and all that.

The East End in London is famous for its waves of new arrivals. It doesn't mean that they are intent on takeover.

Been at work today, so delayed, but the answers to a few points:

Revert: Offensive & arrogant because it endorses the Islamic view that everyone is born muslim. People convert to other faiths, but Islam of course is the one true faith, so of course one reverts, having originally been muslim at birth ! .... F$%"$ to such supremacy !! ...Despite being born into a muslim family and having the shahada read into my ear, I was categorically not a muslim at birth and neither are the billions of people who are never born into a muslim family.

If universities want to provide a separate room for Muslim students taking an exam, so be it. This wasn't about separate rooms for exams, not that would be acceptable either. It was about acquiescing to the demands of Islamic fundamentalists to have segregated seating for men and women at their talks. Demands from Islamists such as the Islamic Education and Research Academy who did in fact manage to hold lectures at Leicester & UCL where they forced women to sit at the back. www.civilliberty.org.uk/newsdetail.php?newsid=1660

The issue came to light and led to Universities UK (UUK), a body who in their own words are " the definitive voice for universities in the UK, providing leadership and support ", to issue guidance that said that gender segregation was acceptable ! UUK's position was endorsed by the NUS !!!

Thankfully, following a high profile campaign by secularists, humanist and women's rights groups, the ECHR have now ruled that "Gender segregation is not permitted in any academic meetings or at events, lectures or meetings provided for students, or at events attended by members of the public or employees of the university or the students’ union.” hence upholding that fundamental British value of gender equality.

Is there some evidence that girls are being forced to sit in the back of UK classes? Yes: news.tes.co.uk/b/news/2013/10/08/muslim-free-school-threatened-with-closure.aspx

Your post is confusing in that you're co-mingling personal matters with public. Surely little girls wearing a hijab (which I find fantastically inappropriate, by the way) is not infringing upon you in any way? FGM thankfully doesn't infringe upon me or most women either - should we not be bothered by that ?

Little girls wearing hijabs is not a personal matter. It enforces a view of young children as being sexual beings. Of girls being responsible for mens urges.... Of being to blame for when they get raped by not being dressed modestly.... a view of other non-covered girls and women being 'naked whores' (their words, not mine). Of young boys and men all being sexual predators..... Islamist views, but which have insidiously crept and become mainstream muslim views.

I feel very said for you MistressMia if that is how you feel regarding the term revert.

sad even.

"It doesn't matter if terrorists have millions of funding and hijacking planes or are small fry murdering men in the street."

It does. There is a clear difference.

I was very pleased to see the Muslim academic this week say there is nothing in the Koran or Islam to say women and men should be separated. That kind of statement really helps stop sexism.

Yanbu. I can never understand how freedom of speech works, when allowing Muslims to preach hatred and misogyny blatantly infringes on the rights and freedoms of other people.

The Koran does say it's okay to beat your wife though

here

what a delightful website link.

As does the bible say women submit to your husband and is keen on outlawing homosexuality. Churches and mosques seem to be allowed to preach homophobia. There is a constant battle between religious freedom and sexism and homophobia in the Western world. I think laws against the latter should trump the former but the state does not always think so.

I didn't know it was a competition, but here you go anyway

This is the problem with religion.

Money making, man made, war causing rubbish. Funny in most main stream religion, women are basically treated like second class citizens and the men to be treated like kings... reoccurring theme. Strange.

Religions were constructed to control populations.

Some are more controlling than others.

For some reason, humans seem to need a belief system.

No OP I am ever so slightly more concerned about the rise of genocidal tendencies towards Muslims and Christians in Palestine, by the most powerful countries in the world , aka Israel backed by US and Uk.....

Hamas have similar genocidal tendencies in that they want Israel wiped off the map.

Softly that was kind of the whole point of the post. If people refer to "they", Muslims as a whole and expect them to be responsible for the actions of a minority then by the same token shouldn't "we" as a whole be responsible for the attitudes of the white British people who show bigotry and ignorance?

Once we start referring to 'them' and 'they all...' We start to dehumanise others. This happens in all coutries and cultures. I've heard it from people from all over the world. In ye olden days, it would have been about folks from the next town/county over.

'They' cause all the problems, take our jobs/wimmin/homes. 'They' do weird and sinister things. 'They' have an odd religion and aren't as good as 'us' in general.

Religion is a very useful hook (if god says I'm right, you can go to hell if you disagree). Sadly the tyrants in the ME may well have been despots, keeping people 'in line' with fear, but the religious nutjobs are far worse. This is why I fear religious extremism - there is no compromise. ISIS will slaughter the native christians (after extorting 'fees' from them to remain). Any any other religion they don't like.

These is no 'muh-slim braaveroood'(as the laddies like to bang on about on their marches near us). There are hard line groups within the whole umbrella who would happily slaughter every other 'muslim brother and sister' as they do not see them as 'real' muslims.