To be really angry with the school and be considering not sending my DCs in for the last 2 days?

[littlewhitehamster]

I have 2 DC, DS who is 8 and in year 3 and DD who is 5 and in year 1.

A new boy started the school about 2 weeks after half term and is in my DDs class. 3 weeks ago my DD said that this boy was 'not being nice to her' when I asked what was going on she said that for the last couple of days he had been saying to her she was his girlfriend and she must play with him and not play with any other boys, apparently DD said she told him she didn't want to be his girlfriend and she just played with her friends as normal resulting in this boy pulling on her hair.

I sent a not in the next day via the office for the class teacher (not very easy to grab a word in the morning) expressing my concern and asked if she could possibly keep an eye out for anything and have a word with the boy in question if needed. At the end of the day when I sent the note in the teacher spoke to me and said that she had not seen anything but assured me she would keep an eye out, she also told my DD to speak to her if anything happened.

Everything was quiet until about 10-12 days ago when again DD told me she was starting to have the same sort of problems with this boy, she had told the class teacher and he had stopped bothering her in class but started bothering her at break and lunch times, insisting she was his girlfriend, lifting her skirt up, kissing her on the cheek. I saw the teacher and the head they assured that staff on playground duty would be made aware and that the boy would be spoken to.

A few days pass with no problem and then yesterday the boy tried to kiss my DD again, she ran away from him and told the playground staff, he left her alone until the whistle was blown, while running to line up DD said he caught her and held her in a hug so she couldn't get away so her could kiss her. I didn't find out until this last night so went and saw the head this morning, was assured that closer observation would be made and the boys mum would be spoken to (not that she strikes me as the kind who would give a shit).

Tonight my DD came out of class and looked upset I asked if she was OK and she started to cry and saying something about this boy at lunch but I couldn't understand through the crying. I said we would find her brother and speak to the teacher/head. My DS came out of his class looking equally upset and when I asked what was wrong her cried too saying he has to stay in at lunch tomorrow.

It turns out that at lunch today this boy was again holding on to my DD and kissing her, when she got away she told the playground staff and was told to try and stay away from him, she tried to stay out of his way but he started to chase her and she again told the playground staff who asked her to point him out and they said go and play we will speak to him (not sure if they did of didn't speak to him). He then chased and caught her with his arms around her and kissed her on the check and then still holding her tried to kiss her lips, at this point my DS saw, ran over and pushed the boy- he fell and grazed his hand. DS took DD to play with him for the few remaining minutes of lunch.

The boy must have informed the playground staff as he now has to miss 15 mins of lunch tomorrow, sit in the class room and write a sorry letter to the boy in question. I told his teacher he would most certainly not be writing a sorry letter to this boy and went to the head, who was busy but will see me in the morning.

I am so angry at the schools failure to deal with this situation and punishing my DS for stopping that the staff should have stopped. I don't want to send my DC in for the last 2 days of term, especially if my DS is going to have to write a sorry letter and this other boy gets away with no punishment for distressing my DD over several weeks.

I have spoken with the head about this before and nothing appears to have been done.. who can I go to to make it stop??

I know a family where the boy did this.
He was 9. Some of the language he used was almost identical to the language you are reporting (you are mine, you can't talk to other boys). He was a bit more extreme though - called some of the girls whores for example. The school in question did act on it though, did ensure that he was carefully supervised at playtimes etc. And investigated - it turned out his mum 'worked from home', while the children were in the house, and under the supervision of a pimp who used language along the lines of 'Don't forget you are my bitch - don't talk to other men.' He'd seen things no child should see, especially not when their mum is involved.
The boy's father (who was at that time a NRP) came and removed the boy and took him to live elsewhere. I have no idea what happened to him after that.

Your OP sounded so similar it is scary. If the school are doing nothing they are letting down three children badly - your two and the boy himself. He needs supervising and investigating for his own good.

Because I know where the older child got his behaviour from, I'd be wary of doing anything involving 'going public' (ie local paper, Facebook etc) - I suspect this kid is in need of help and protection too and doing that kind of hell-raising could be massively damaging to a very young child who, going on my experience, could already be in a nasty situation. But that doesn't diminish the need your daughter has to be safe at school. And your boy should not have to write any kind of letter. I think keeping them off depends entirely on what they are doing at school (parties or similar) and how much they want to be part of it! But the school need to be hounded and hounded about what they are doing to protect all the children in their care.

Oh and forgot to say that of course your dc should not write a letter of apology to the boy, how preposterous of the school to punish him for helping his sister whilst the school is failing to safeguard your dd and deal with the boy effectively . Grrrrrr on your behalf.

Your dc's did the right thing and should be commended for it as you have done.

I would also look around for a local self-defence or martial arts class for children and send both dd and ds. This could give them the self-confidence to stand up to bullies in the future.

It makes me soooo bloody mad that there are still so many victim blamers out there. Why should your DD have to take steps to avoid this boy - he should be the one dealt with and have his freedom curtailed. I'd be pointing out the message that this is sending your DD and the rest of the children that gets perpetuated when we are adults - that somehow she is inviting it, that it is her fault. Let us know how it goes with the head teacher...

It would have been instinctive for your son to push the boy and defend his sister. Ask the head if he's read the book 'the selfish gene' by richard dawkins, and if not, he needs to read it!

Haven't read all this post by the way just throwing in my 2cents worth!

I'd be furious with the school as well.

peggyundercrackers

Absolutely every one of your suggested 'actions' would be totally counter-productive and wouldn't help the OP's DD in any way at all.

Don't be ridiculous.

harticus shame on me? I think not - shame on you for wanting to defend a 5yr old who is sexually assaulting a little girl - that makes me feel sick to the pit of my stomach - if it was my DD it absolutely wouldn't have happened a second time. I wouldn't give a flying fuck about anything but protecting my DD and woh betide anyone who would get in my way as well. too many left wing liberals is the problem - none of them want to deal with the real issue of the little girl being assaulted and have been trying to sweep it under the carpet.

by the time your 5 you know the difference between right and wrong - stop trying to defend this behaviour.

A letter of apology ? Not a chance .

Like it or not , such specific targetted behaviour from a 5 year is normal . Its not . Which means that potentially there are 2 victims here, both your DD and this boy. If the school does nothing, then they are failing BOTH of them . Outrageous. Ignoring this sort of thing is how abuse lays undiscovered for years . By the way, your DS sounds fab.

Peggy - of course any parent would be furious if their child was the victim of such behaviour. 5 year olds do know the difference between right and wrong if they come from a loving home. They do not if they have been brought up in an abusive situation. The 5 year olds my sister had dealt with think their behaviour is completely normal. Yes the school should be doing a lot more to protect OP's DD but they should also be putting procedures in place to deal with the boy and protect him if it turns out he is being abused.

peggy

Stop talking such complete and utter shite.
It is frothing ignorance like yours that leads to paediatricians being attacked.

You CANNOT hold a 5 year old accountable for his/her actions especially if they are being sexually abused themselves or are immersed in a highly sexualised environment where such behaviour is "normal".

And anyone who advocates kicking a 5 year old child "in the bollocks" until he cries is utterly despicable and deserves to get their own visit from the police.

It is the school not dealing adequately with the situation that is the problem Peggy. The 5 year old needs to be managed but he is barely more than a baby and his responsibility is minimal due to his age.

Schools often don't have the resources or staff experience to deal with complex child protection cases - sad but true. The boy obviously needs help - but that is no reason to minimise or excuse the impact on the victim here. Who is also only 5 years old.

She must also be protected. Otherwise there's two victims instead of one.

Peggy...your comments are a disgrace. As it happens, the law disagrees with you as 5 is well below the age of criminal responsibility.

Also from what the op says about the young boys family, I actually feel really sorry for him. Yes, I can feel sorry for him whilst agreeing his actions are unacceptable. I really feel sad for the ops dd for having to deal with this. The whole situation is sad. A 5 year old is vulnerable and a product of their environment. I really hope things improve for every child involved in this.

Very baby, a simiar thing coud well be going on with boy, or he is in an abusive environment whereby ether e is being abused r h is witnessing violence and that type of behaviour

OP what a horrible situation you are dealing with and may I say IMHO you are dealing with it in a thoughtful and dignified way.

I would definitely be going in and seeing the HT to discuss their duty of care towards your DD and their strategies to stop this boy from harrassing her.

As for your DS I would definitely not allow any letter of apology be written, he was protecting his sister. Do the school really want to promote the idea that if you stop someone from hurting someone else by pushing them away, you are in the wrong and should apologise?????? An apology only means something if it is sincere.

I hope you manage to get everything sorted.

Good for your son, looking after his little sister you should be very proud of him.

No way would I be letting him say sorry and I would not be happy with the detention.

No one else was helping your little girl, she had repeatedly informed staff but to no avail.

I think your DS pushing the boy who was holding her so she could get free was perfectly justified and reasonable.

My Son always looks out for his younger sister and I know he would do exactly the same as yours in such a circumstance.

I would be very cross with the school indeed.

No letter would be written by my child.

I would be really cross as you have flagged this up a lot.

The boy needs to be monitored during playtimes.

Good for your son sticking up for his sister.

I would go to the office and ask for an urgent meeting with the ht

My DS wouldn't be apologizing or writing any letters.

Because he wouldn't be sorry and I would not want him to be.

None of the children should have been put into the situation at all.

I have two boys but I could see DS1 protecting DS2 in the same sort of situation.

Good.

your ds should not apologise.

write to the headteacher copying in the class teacher, keeping your own copy.
make it as clear as your opening post, giving dates. make your daughter's distress and the requests you have made for support very, very clear.
refer to safeguarding pupils. mention Ofsted's concerns about safeguarding in schools, if you really want to scare them. a letter direct to Ofsted will prompt a visit...
request a meeting on the second day of the new term and make it clear the meeting is so that they can advise you of the measures they have put in place to ensure your daughter's safety.
your daughter should not be under physical duress from anyone, five or not. she is her own person and has the right not to be touched or kissed, or have her skirt lifted.
your son should not be put into the position where he has to defend his sister from abuse - the school should have dealt with the boy who behaved inappropriately so that your son was not left with the responsibility of dealing with the matter in the only way he could.
you are correct to expect that the school should take this seriously.

often mners whinge about schools. this is a serious matter and you are right to make a fuss.

yy to what rabbit lady says.

You can't ask them what they will do about the other boy, you can ask them to safeguard your daughter.

Key words are safeguarding, protecting her from abuse.
Her right to not be put in a position where she is receiving sexual advances.
It should be clear that it is not for her to be removed from the playground, but for the action to be such that the boy is watched/removed etc.

the lunchtime staff ''keeping and eye on it'' is not enough.

If the head can't see you in the morning, tell whoever is making the appointments that in your view it is a child protection issue and therefore urgent. I would not want to leave this over christmas.

OP, the people you need to speak to at the council are the Child Safeguarding Panel/Officer/Team however things work locally to you. I would raise an urgent complaint with them about the lack of action the school is taking.

I work in an aligned field and frankly would be amazed if the boy wasn't either witnessing or the victim of such abuse, and therefore for his own sake as well as your DD's needs to be raised seriously with the right people. Poor you, poor DD and hard as it may sound to some, poor boy - no child with a normal healthy family would behave this way, he's obviously disturbed. Good on your DS too. (I wouldn't let him write an apology letter, either).

Good luck with ht.

SayMyName there was a similar situation with a boy at my school.

He was always asking people to go out with him and talking about having sex. He was a bit older, we were about seven at the time and he would have been about ten. We had no idea what sex was but everyone hated him because he was always trying to touch someone or saying these things that made us uncomfortable even though we didn't know why.

He was in his early 20's when he was arrested for sexually assaulting young boys, and I wonder now if he was a victim himself. But at the time, we were children, he was older, the things he said were upsetting us and we were scared of him. Nobody really understood what he was doing enough to complain about it though, and perhaps missed the chance to stop him and help him at the same time.

It's one of the reasons why I think the OP should definitely not let the school brush it under the carpet. I'd be tempted to call social services if the school won't deal with it.

there are several issues here really.

Firstly the talk of sexual harassment/sexual asalt are highly emotive and not really applicable to a five year old child. In an adult (or older child) world those would be sexualised behaviors but to a five year old they're not - yes they're inappropriate, but they're not intended to be sexual in any way, a five year old has no concept of sex.

Secondly people are saying that the school are doing nothing about this boy's behaviour. We don't actually know that because any kind of intervention wrt this child has to be done confidentially. It may be that he is currently subject to a child protection assessment. Or it may be that he has some kind of sn which means he has no concept of boundaries or personal space. And something is obviously being done because the incidents in the classroom have stopped. But sometimes with the best will in the world it is just not possible to supervise a child 100% of the time, usually due to funding and the fact there are another 300 children to supervise as well.

Now, your dd does have the right to feel safe at school, and if this boy is upsetting her to such an extreme then something more clearly does need to be done to manage the situation. I would speak to the head tomorrow and outline what you have written hear, but I would also say that you understand that there must be some circumstance that you are unaware of because clearly this level of behaviour is not normal in such a young child, however while the school are carrying out whatever investigations they need to, be that child protection or for SN, you need to be assured that your daughter (and others who may have been affected by his behaviour) are to be allowed to be educated in a safe environment where they are not afraid of one child, and thus you would like to know what supervision is being put in place to ensure this child cannot continue to act out these behaviors.

a letter of apology might be in order you fail to understand why in this instance your son should be expected to understand that he has to apologise when the other boy does not.

There should be a governor with specific responsibility for safeguarding issues. I suggest you find out who this is and contact them as well. It might also be useful to ask for a meeting with them.