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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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To think that using peer humiliation as a punishment for a quiet, sensitive child at the start of Year 7 is very bad practice by the school?

461 replies

pippalonglegs · 01/11/2013 13:21

Oh, I need help and advice please. I'm hurting so much for my DS that I can't think about anything else. Please bear with me - it's a story.

Basically, in a drama class the children were split into boys v girls. The boys started giggling and got themselves into a position in which they became helplessly unable to stop laughing. DS commented to his buddy that it was 'as if they were all on drugs'. Teacher (probably stressed) overheard, took exception to the comment and issued a detention. DS came home seeming so sad and withdrawn and was very upset. He told me about the detention and subsequently I emailed the school (Monday), taking great care not to take sides, simply in order to understand what had happened from teacher's point of view. On Tuesday she called me, and left a voicemail in which she said that DS had 'shouted out a completely inappropriate comment'.

I had no contact telephone number so emailed again (Tues) and explained that even prior to this, DS had been struggling with high school transition and was feeling sad to the point of really not wanting to go to school, and might perhaps benefit more from an alternative approach. I asked if we might talk about the detention before it went ahead. She didn't reply on the Tuesday, the Wednesday or the Thursday - in other words, she completely ignored/dismissed my concerns - and instead simply sent him home with a detention slip for the Friday. Of course I was furious, not least because my sensible and genuine concerns had been completely ignored, and I felt I'd been treated as a stupid, interfering parent.

But then the full picture emerged. I happened to be speaking to another parent who told me she had been very shocked to hear what had happened to DS, although initially I didn't fully understand what she meant. Her child gave an account (unprompted by me, I should add) that was identical to DS's. She said that nobody had even heard his comment (which in my opinion merely illustrated a mature understanding of the potential impact of drugs anyway) and that it was only the teacher flying off the handle that caused any interest in it. But - and this is the significant bit - it also transpired from this third party account that DS had been made to stand facing the wall until the end of lesson, and was at that point given the detention. And that was the bit that crushed me. DS is the most gentle, kind and sensitive of boys, has never been in trouble before, and there could have been no need to subject him to that kind of humiliation in front of his peers. Detentions and discipline, yes - but peer humiliation, most definitely no!!!

Suddenly it all made sense. No wonder he had come home from school so upset. And the thing that really distressed me was that he had felt so much shame and humiliation that he hadn't even been able to tell me about it. My heart broke for him. Little wonder that he was unwilling to go back into school to face his peers. Personally, I felt that such a punishment merely lacked a cap with a big 'D' on the front - a punishment more suited to 1913 than 2013.

I set about researching the pathogenic effects and the damage of peer humiliation (which has a profound impact on cognitive development and behaviour in children). Armed with the evidence, I emailed the head teacher with a formal grievance (the substantive points of which were 1. the failure of the teacher to engage with me and 2. the humiliation punishment that was used). That was acknowledged by the head, who said he would appoint his deputy (also the head of pastoral care) to investiagte, and would then meet with me to discuss the matter.

The deputy called me yesterday and Oh. My. God!!!! It has been a long, long time since I've spoken to anybody who was so bloody-minded and unintelligent. In spite of promises by the head, he refused to have a meeting with me, although I asked repeatedly if we could sit down to talk about my complaint. Every time I asked, his parrotted reply was that he 'would not normally meet with a parent to discuss a detention'. It didn't matter how many times I repeated that the detention was the least of my concerns, he wouldn't listen. In the end I even said that I felt like Jeremy Paxman and I said I wanted a straight answer to a straight question - but his reply was the same again!!!

In the end, I said I would redial and speak to the head, which I duly did. Of course, in the intervening minutes, the deputy had skidded down the corridor to forewarn the head and the head was, initially at least, every bit as hostile. We spoke for about ten minutes, most of which was decidedly heated, and I have to say, most (though by no means all) of the anger came from him not me! Clearly, he was unused to being challenged by a parent and he didn't like it at all. I felt his attitude was autocratic, verging on imperialistic - and told him so!! He actually told me that DS wasn't made to stand facing the wall, he was made to stand at the edge of the room, looking away from the class group!! Oh dear. Talk about semantics!!! Paradoxically, his refusal to accept that DS had been made to stand facing the wall seems clearly to indicate that he knew how unacceptable that would have been. I said that kind of ducking and diving, that kind of manipulation was fundamentally dishonest and slippery and wouldn't play out at all well in the press.

At about that point, we had a u-turn and he invited me in to see him on Monday for a cup of tea and a biscuit.

Basically, it would help me to know if anybody else has had a similar experience. I have the meeting next Monday and would really like to know what options I have/don't have. DS is really suffering and has lost a lot of confidence and self-esteem since this incident. I think it's something that he will carry around with him for the rest of his life.

OP posts:
Strumpetron · 01/11/2013 13:26

I have experience in which I was the child facing the wall.

It didn't do me any psychological harm because I saw it for what it was, a shit way to try and discipline.

I understand people are different, but I do worry that such a small incident in the grand scheme of things can have such a negative impact on your DS.

MammaTJ · 01/11/2013 13:28

I came on here all ready to say YABU to just believe your child and not to accept the punishment but then I read the whole OP!!

Just keep calm when talking to the head, otherwise you will appear unhinged.

Mitzyme · 01/11/2013 13:28

Horrible thing to do to anyone let alone a child. Brought back bad memories for me.

pippalonglegs · 01/11/2013 13:29

So it is the kind of thing that you remember through life then. How old were you at the time?

OP posts:
RedHelenB · 01/11/2013 13:30

If there was uncontrollable giggling it would make sense to have someone face the wall to stop the domino affect. I think you are over reacting & ultimately I can't see how this will help your son? Somehow or other you need to toughen your son up, as this is a drop in the ocean to what he will face throughout his life

Strumpetron · 01/11/2013 13:31

So it is the kind of thing that you remember through life then. How old were you at the time?
I'm 22 so it only happened a few years ago. I remember it just like I remember all my school days. Not in a bad light, just something that happened!

But obviously I'm not your DS and some people are more sensitive than I am.

RedHelenB · 01/11/2013 13:32

I also think you are putting lots of extra detail in that you have no idea about as you weren't there! (Deputy skidding a long the corridor etc) Think mountains out of molehills!

ATruthUniversallyAcknowledged · 01/11/2013 13:33

Change schools. Seriously. If you're this upset by something in year 7 just imagine the state you'll be in by year 11.

MrsDavidBowie · 01/11/2013 13:33

I think you have really over reacted.

Making veiled threats about involving the press is ridiculous.

And telling the head he was imperialistic Shock

RedHelenB · 01/11/2013 13:35

Any generally well behaved child is likely to remember tellings off/punishments, because they would happen rarely. My dd still goes on about an unfair punishment (she was outside the classroom when the warning was given) but it certainly hasn't scarred her & she acceots it as bad luck & something to remember!

HootShoot · 01/11/2013 13:35

Honestly, I think getting too involved may be more damaging for your son. Maybe he didn't tell you the whole story because he didn't want you to get too involved?

CoffeeTea103 · 01/11/2013 13:35

I think you are massively overreacting here. I agree with the poster who said he should toughen up a bit. Seriously if this scars him for life then it's a cruel world out there. His comment was totally inappropriate by the way.

pippalonglegs · 01/11/2013 13:36

Yeh, the 'skidding along the corridor' bit was just for narrative effect. My grim humour, that's all and not exaggeration. As for the 'etc', you'll have to qualify that.

As for the domino effect, if employees were laughing, wouldn't you quietly ask whoever you felt was the ringleader to see you in your office? Or would you ask an adult employee to stand facing the wall? Is it accetpable to humilate children but not adults?

I would not have objected, an in deed I don't think DS would have felt humiliated if he'd been asked to stand outside the room.

OP posts:
Noteveryday · 01/11/2013 13:36

I think if your DS is in year 7 you need to start doing some work with him on emotional resilience. Most children need to learn quite quickly that some things adults do are unfair and annoying. Such as this punishment. He needs to learn how to bounce back, for example to turn it into a funny story to tell his mates.

Also the research you have done sounds like you are massively over-involved / over invested in this, perhaps because you are used to the level of parental involvement in primary school? You also need to learn that you cannot control or make up for all the negative things that are going to happen to your son, you can only teach him to deal with them.

At the least he is likely to have difficult teachers, bastard bosses, partners who break up with him, mates who tease him, wankers in pubs, redundancies, failure at job interviews...you can use difficult experiences like this to start building the blocks to teach him resilience.

Mitzyme · 01/11/2013 13:36

This was a very common practice when I was at primary school and it happened a lot to me because I struggled with arithmetic.
I am 60yr so yes it's does have a lasting affect. I caught up with the class eventually and am VERY good at maths but I can remember that horrible feeling even now.
Different times I know but yes keep calm when you see the Head as previous poster advised.

redskyatnight · 01/11/2013 13:37

So your knowledge of this event is based on gossip from a fellow parent who heard it from her child who was in the room with a bunch of children being silly. Your own DS has told you nothing (other than that he got a detention). Can I respectively suggest that it might be worth actually finding out the whole story before you decide that your child was scarred for life?

WooWooOwl · 01/11/2013 13:38

The teacher making your ds stand facing the wall wasn't the right way to try and control behaviour in the class, but I think you're over reacting and not handling any if it very well.

If your ds is still upset, I'd guess you aren't helping that. I know it hurts like hell when your child has been upset by someone else, but this really isn't likely to do your son any long term damage unless you end up making him feel like a victim.

annie987 · 01/11/2013 13:39

Total over reaction I think.
The detention was deserved if indeed the comment was shouted out rather than whispered to a friend.
A
If your son was one of the ring members in leading the mass hysteria then removing him from the situation and standing him facing the wall was fine.

lisad123everybodydancenow · 01/11/2013 13:39

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

MrsDavidBowie · 01/11/2013 13:39

I missed the bit about doing the research........ Shock

that really is ott.
You will be the talk of the staffroom.

MrsTerryPratchett · 01/11/2013 13:39

Your job is not to stop bad things happening to you son for ever. It is to give him the tools to deal with bad things when they do.

mynewpassion · 01/11/2013 13:40

That's just time out, an acceptable punishment for kids especially toddlers.

FrameyMcFrame · 01/11/2013 13:41

I think you need to decide what you want from the head and the school now. The incident can't be undone, so maybe assurance that DS won't be treated like this again?
If that's what you want, ask for it. There's no point in beating about the bush and playing the blame game

timidviper · 01/11/2013 13:41

For heavens sake! The fuss you are making over this is probably far more traumatising to your DS than the initial punishment and threatening to go to the press seems OTT to me (although I can understand your frustration with the poor handling of your complaint)

Ultimately, like it or not, schools have to function for the benefit of the majority, they cannot be tailored for every individual child. My DS, at that age, was also quiet and sensitive and would have hated that kind of a punishment too but it would have taught him not to do something silly again. You teaching him that that you will oppose the school is not going to help him in the long run.

My personal opinion is that you should have played it down, told him not to misbehave in class in future even if others are being silly, reassured him and moved on swiftly.

TheCrumpetQueen · 01/11/2013 13:41

Yanbu

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