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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Able-bodied people should offer their seat on a crowded train to elderly people, yes?

224 replies

LOLisNOTaPunctuationMark · 29/10/2013 17:32

Am i alone in thinking this? After today, i feel like i am.

I went for the train home at 4.10pm. Just like every other day, the platform was swarming with people waiting to board. So on we all rushed when the train arrived. As usual, i found myself at the back of the mob queue, so had to stand as all seats were taken. (There's really no queue etiquette. Someone who had been waiting for 20 minutes doesn't get to go before someone who's just arrived for example.

Anyway, my train home is massive. It takes me about 90 secs to walk from the first to the last carriage, and that's with me walking quickly.

I found myself an inch of a handrail to hold onto next to the doors. I was in the smallest carriage. There's 6 tables with 6 chairs to a table (3 at each side of it). All seats were full (except a middle one at a back table). There was approx 12 people standing next and around me next to the door space.

In other words, it was packed.

Behind me, an elderly man and woman squeezed onto the train. The woman was really tiny and frail. She was huffing and sighing at there not being a seat. I pointed out the empty one at the back, but the elderly man was already making his way towards it.

After about a minute, the train starts. The woman was very unbalanced and staggered into people several times. She said very loudly how unfriendly our country is and how much nicer it is in Dublin. Then the elderly man shouts down that we are friendly in this country, just not on trains.

At the next stop, another five people squished inside. The woman was getting pushed into another man sitting at one of the front tables. he kept tutting loudly and finally snapped and asked her to watch herself.

All the while, the people at the tables were just staring blankly ahead, or immersed in their phones, and two people were looking at her and grinning.

Eventually, a woman offered her her seat because she was getting off at the next stop anyway.

Apart from the elderly woman and man in that carriage, no one else was elderly. I'm aware that some people may have had disabilities, but statistically it's unlikely that everyone sitting down had a disability/disorder/pregnancy etc.

I've always been brought up to offer my seat to an elderly person if somewhere is crowded, and i'm bringing my 5yo daughter up to do the same. She has a disability which sometimes means she can't always give up her seat, but on the occasions she can, she does.

I'm just really saddened by it. The woman seemed very shocked as if she expected someone to offer her a seat, and kept shaking her head and sighing.

I'm dreading being old.

OP posts:
MrsDeVere · 29/10/2013 22:03

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MrsDeVere · 29/10/2013 22:06

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IBelieveInAngles · 29/10/2013 22:07

I've seen more people giving up seats/being polite than we lived anywhere else, in London! I guess everyone has different experiences.

IBelieveInAngles · 29/10/2013 22:08

*when we

Sharpkat · 29/10/2013 22:10

hmc - I could not get a word in at all. I was in tears as I was so weak and tired after a night in A&E. she even shook her fist at me after getting off.

I was tempted to get the sick bowl out and make myself sick to prove a point but was too upset.

TheFarSide · 29/10/2013 22:12

I also posted upthread fireside about my positive experiences on the tube in London.

If you got caught in the rush hour, you may have experienced a rush for the seats - but that doesn't mean people won't give up their seat if necessary.

moldingsunbeams · 29/10/2013 22:17

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moldingsunbeams · 29/10/2013 22:19

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williaminajetfighter · 29/10/2013 22:19

Over the years I've seen a lot of polite behaviour on the trains with seats offered up etc. however the worst culprits for never ever offering up their seats are the 'important business men with their laptops' who talk on their mobiles and do 'important work'. Wish they would f* off to 1st class. Have never ever ever seen one if them give up a seat. Shameful.

OP I'm in Glasgow - was this on the Glas to Edinburgh line? You should write a letter to Scotrail about the overcrowding...

SatinSandals · 29/10/2013 22:20

Maybe we were just lucky,but last time I took my mother on a crowded tube a young man instantly gave her his seat.

TheFarSide · 29/10/2013 22:24

I am 50+ and not at all decrepit I hope and generally find young men are more solicitous to me than ever before, offering seats, opening doors for me, etc. It's been one of the few benefits of getting older.

KCumberSandwich · 29/10/2013 22:42

william i totally agree with you about the business man on phone/laptop attitude. when i was visiting london a man actually shoved his way between me and a lady with a baby in a buggy going onto the steps down to the tube.

the shock on her face when i offered to help her and carried the buggy down the steps with her after seeing her struggle at the top. i am not saying it is specific to london, its just such a shame that so few people can spare a few moments of their time to be kind, or even just polite.

manicinsomniac · 29/10/2013 22:56

suebfg - in Brazil they get round the whole 'is she pregnant or just fat' issue by having the priority seating for 'elderly, disabled, pregnant, people with young children and the obese'. Suspect that would cover the majority of our population!

I have a total paranoid thing on public transport (particularly the tube) about constantly looking for anyone who needs my seat. I therefore give it up a lot and can actually understand why people hesitate to - on a few occasions I've been met with crossly offended or even genuinely hurt looks and comments like 'I'm not that old yet thank you' even when the person is clearly 70+. I end up feeling really embarrassed and awkward. But still obsessively look for the next person who looks, to me, like they need a seat. I think I'm frightened of being confronted and called selfish.

The situation in the OP is inexcusable though, even if the old woman's attitude wasn't ideal.

My 84 year old grandmother who has had both hips replaced still gives up seat for 'old dears'. It amuses me but I love her for it. I love her less for going to the gym every day, that makes me feel bad!

hmc · 29/10/2013 22:58

Now that annoys me too manic - people who can't be gracious when they offer you their seat!

manicinsomniac · 29/10/2013 23:15

hmc - did I suggest I give the seat ungraciously? (I don't!) or did you mean 'people who can't be gracious when you offer them your seat'?

tiggytape · 29/10/2013 23:16

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hmc · 29/10/2013 23:21

Yes I did mean people who can't be gracious when you offer them your seat Blush

tiggytape · 29/10/2013 23:26

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manicinsomniac · 29/10/2013 23:33

that's cool hmc - note the level of my paranoia as it should have been fairly obvious what you meant! Grin

OhYouBadBadKitten · 29/10/2013 23:40

I offered my seat up to an elderly lady on a bus in Sicily once. The result was totally embarrassing. She spent the whole of the journey smiling, gesturing and gabbling on presumably about me to the other passengers on the bus. The only word I sort of understood was belissimo or something similar? The other passengers stared stony stares at me the whole time. I was beet red and wishing I could just vanish. We'd only been in Italy for about half an hour.

fanjofarrow · 30/10/2013 00:03

YANBU. I always offer my seat to an elderly person. To me, it is basic good manners.

Morgause · 30/10/2013 06:25

Returned to read this thread this morning and I'm staggered to discover that there are some people who think their children are more entitled to a seat than fare paying adults. Hmm

Children travel at reduced cost or free. If people feel they are entitled to a seat then they should pay full fare for them. If they aren't prepared to do that then children should be on laps or standing.

CrohnicallyTired · 30/10/2013 07:21

Morgause- how does that work then? OAPs have free bus passes, does that mean we shouldn't let them travel on the bus at all as they didn't pay?

What if a child pays reduced price to do something like go swimming? Maybe they can only get their bottom half wet?

Reduced price at the cinema- so they should keep one eye shut during the film? Or should they only be allowed to watch the trailers then leave?

CrikeeThree · 30/10/2013 07:32

Haven't read the whole thread, but I was in a similar situation yesterday on a bus.
I just said loudly "Can anyone offer this lady their seat?"

And someone did. Immediately.

Didn't aim it at anyone in particular, so no one was singled out.
But I couldn't have watched this (very frail) old lady get thrown about and not say anything.

Nor should you have done, OP. Sorry.

Morgause · 30/10/2013 07:42

Chronicallytired, I'm all in favour of reduced pricing for children in all circumstances but find it hard to accept that they are more entitled to a seat on a bus than an adult of any description, let alone an adult who needs a seat. Basic good manners means they just aren't. If parents feel strongly that their children have an entitlement to their own seats the least they could do would be to pay for them.

I was always plonked on my mum's lap if an adult was standing and when I was older I was taught to stand. Or sis, Mum and I were squashed onto 2 seats between us.

No wonder there is a current air of entitlement among some young people if they are taught by their parents that it's OK to sit while a needy adult stands.