WWYD 5yr old 'racist' comment

[lola88]

When i picked my niece up from school on thursday the teacher told my there had been an incident with a little boy calling her a 'black face' she is mixed race. I was totally shocked she has never had any sort of racist comments before so was new for me to deal with tho i'm sure it won't be the last. The teacher spoke to the boys mum and DN seems fine about it to her it's just like being called any other name.

The thing thats annoying me is the boys mum i have spoke to her a couple of times and see her around a lot, but she's not said a word about it. If i was in her shoes i would want to say something but she has totally ignored me giving me cold looks if i catch her eye. I don't get it i tried to give her a 'kids will be kids' smile when it happened she just stalked off past me.

I don't know how to say this without sounding dramatic but i'm worried she's not said anything because maybe she herself has a problem with racism friends i've spoke to have suggested it saying he must have picked it up at home but i don't know.

WWYD if your child said that and you sort of knew the other childs parent/aunt? I'm so worried that if she's not dealing with it it could turn nasty for DN

I don't know. If the current accepted terms are 'black' and 'white' then surely saying someone has 'a black face' is not offensive and at least factually correct?

I'm sure there will be someone along shortly though to tell me I am hideously racist myself for suggesting such a thing.

Yes, I will Snow so would you go up to a black person and say "hey black face, what's up?"

Op, of course the mum should've said something. Hopefully she has educated her child

He wasn't saying she had a black face, he was calling her black face, there's a difference.

Just realised your DN is mixed race not black. That said, perhaps the boy did not know how to articulate 'mixed race' and therefore chose 'black' as opposed to 'White.'

Perhaps it would have been a good opportunity for the teacher to talk to the children about differences in colour and race and what is acceptable to say. Children do need to learn at some stage that it's not appropriate to make distinctions/ comments about people based on their physical appearance. Perhaps 5 is too young for this though - I can't see that any malice was meant unless I'm being spectacularly naive. You often hear children saying things like 'maisy with the blonde hair' 'Thomas with the green jumper' - is this any different? (genuine question)

I would just let it go, unless it was said in a way intended to upset your DN it could have simply been that child's way of describing your neice, yes of course explain to him that you shouldn't describe someone in that way but I wouldn't assume a comment like that automatically made him or his family racist.

No Chips I wouldn't. But then I'm not 5 am I?

Are you happy with the way school have handled it?

Because it sounds like she either feels arsey and defensive about it or she is mortally ashamed. Either way confronting her isn't going to achieve anything, so I would just stick to saying hi in passing.

If school are handling it ok in your opinion then that's the main thing.

Just ignore her, she obviously is not articulate enough to deal with this and probably resents you though her DS is the one who did the commenting.....make sure DN KNOWS that it's not ok for people to call you names based on your colour....the little boy wil have been told.

well its not factually correct. mixed race people just that mixed race. There is so much more in the world than black and white and to say that suggests a very limited scope.

yanbu OP. The boys comment sounds questionable (who goes around saying white face). Its a hard topic and no one wants to be labelled racist or outed as one.

Maybe the mum is embarrassed and feels that since it is sorted, she doesn't need to say anything? She could have explained to her boy about what he said and why it's inappropriate, but doesn't want to discuss it with you.

Your neice should be told that if anyone calls her names then and should tell her teacher/parents etc. Also just try and keep her confidence up and make sure she is proud of who she is as she grows up.

They need to learn....and yes...at 5....that you just DO NOT say things to people which aresigned to hurt when you are talking about their race. I am very passionate about that as my cousin was the only black child in a small Wlsh villag back n the 70s and regulalrly got called "blackie" nd kids uesd to say "But you ARE black...so you are blackie!"

ive still to speak to the teacher about it to make sure it's all resolved. Its so hard to deal as i've had no personal experience with racism her dad is black but never been around so it's new ground to us as a family in how to deal with it.

agree with whatwouldmargodo

loladoes your niece live with you?

I think the teacher should maybe consider doing a segment on multi-racialism/culturalism and inclusivity, and how it's not nice in general to pick on anyone because of a difference in their appearance. To the whole class.

The mother sounds pathetic, tbh.

I think it was probably a fairly innocent comment from the boy (eg. not intentionally racist) and he has now been told by the teacher that it is unacceptable. The mum is probably embarassed and not handling the situation well.

I am not sure about this. They are five so it is entirely possible the comment was innocent. Like calling a child with disabilities 'a wheelchair'. My ds did this in all innocence and it took a few reminders until he stopped. Mind you I suspect he had picked the language up from the escorts saying 'let's get the wheelchairs on the bus'.

It is the sort of comment that could be said by a black or mixed race child too, if there is no malice behind it.

But I don't think these things should be dismissed if there is background. I think a bit of monitoring would be appropriate.

If you are not your DN's main Carer OP, do you not think that is why she hasn't said anything?

Some kid called my DS 1 a fucking little monkey once. It wasn't meant in an affectionate way

I agree entirely with WhatWouldMargotDo.

When you say someone called her a "black face" do you know whether it was a case of "oi black face" or "that girl has a black face"?

Either way I'm shocked that people are reading racist intent into the actions of a 5 year old - get a grip!

At least 50% of DC's class have different coloured skin to their own. When they were 5 they would often refer to someone as having black, brown or pink skin/face in order to describe them. If my DC had been chastised for doing so I'd not have been impressed

mixed race people just that mixed race. There is so much more in the world than black and white and to say that suggests a very limited scope.

I agree 100%, the point I was making was that as an adult, we know this and that's why I would frankly bite my own arm off than refer to someone by race, I'd always always pick a 'safer' description lest I offend anyone. The point is, a 5 year old may not have this understanding - it is not innate, it is something that needs to be taught.

I just think that it is rather a big leap to say the mother has a problem with racism based on a comment her child made which could have been innocently meant. You don't know, she may have been mortified and spent all evening talking to her DS about it?

My impression is that the mother is probably embarrassed - or can't see what the problem is.

It is a big problem IMO - my sister, of mixed race appearance, went through years of name-calling (often from so-called friends). In those days (early 1990s) teachers didn't seem to pick up on it like they (rightly) do now. It ruined my sister's education & confidence. She now feels that she has to look 'perfect' all the time. She STILL gets 'leading questions' on her race from a variety of ignorant nosy people.

The racist bullying was triggered when she was 13 due to jealousy (she's very pretty, was popular & kept winning awards for sports); & the fact that boys resented it if she wouldn't 'go out with' them. NO excuse, in my eyes, for the disgusting names they used for her.

The children at school who got the most racist abuse were the mixed race children. I suspect that most of the bullies' attitudes came from their families & family friends; so they would have grown up & not seen a problem with those attitudes.
It seems to me that people are happy if they can put you in a neat category, but not if they aren't sure what race you are. I don't know why - a lot of people (of all races & nationalities) are still very prejudiced against mixed race people - it's totally irrational.

It needs to stop - children need to be taught to accept others as they are; & judge others based on personality, not looks or racial background.
School is the ideal place to learn this - parents can be ignorant or prejudiced themselves, but if a child learns to accept others then they can sometimes influence their parents' ideas.
I would speak to the teacher & let the school deal with it.
Children need to learn that there are things that you don't say because they are hurtful & insulting.

It's difficult because children are contrary - some of them will use a 'bad word' even more if they are told not to.

I understand the silence. It's an awkward thing to bring up. y1 DS once called a brown-skinned y5 boy "brown head". The y5 boy took great offense and told my own y5 DS that our whole family must be racist & refused to be friends with y5 DS after that. I only know about the whole thing because of the friendship loss.

I feel sure that for y1 DS it was a fact; a rude thing to pointedly observe but he was 5 (& a very immature 5 at that), they impulsively say blunt & crude things about anyone's physical appearance. Like most white families we don't much discuss race it doesn't come up in daily life (very very white area we live in & we don't watch a lot of TV, either) & it would be contrived & intangible to discuss race out of the blue. I later apologised to the brown-skinned y5 lad, but I didn't see how I could make him understand what a meaningless comment it actually was to my y1 DS.

I don't think telling people to get a grip when we are discussing possible racism against our children is appropriate.

Suggesting a clear look at the incident is one thing, telling someone to get a grip is dismissive and insulting.

The only 'grip' I want to take if someone is cruel and offensive to my child is round someone's neck.
Parents of black and mixed raced children shouldn't be required to be more accepting than any other parent.

I prefer not to ignore potential racism, what message does that give to my children?

My daughter went through a stage at about 5, commenting on negatively people's appearance. My family used to laugh at my massive discomfort as I have worked in social services for years and am well known in the wider family for my guardian reader tendencies....My mum would warn my uncle at parties to keep his unpleasant views to himself because 'emma likes Pakistanis and gypsies'.. Etc etc

My daughter and I were on a bus in Wood Green, some way from our Surrey suburb, and in fact the only white people on the top deck. She looked around, I could see her processing the situation and she suddenly said, in a massive stage whisper, 'I don't like BROWN faces...' I could have died. I said something loudly like 'don't be silly, God loves everyone exactly the same' it was all a bit of a blur really.

She told me at the same age that she didn't want anyone with a brown face coming to her birthday party. I spoke to the teacher about it as I was horrified that they would think it was being taught to her at home. I think it was just a realisation of people being different and processing that difference. Children with brown faces did come happily to her parties!

Now she is 16, the majority of her friends from her Surrey school were from different ethnic groups and now we we live in rural Dorset, she complains about how her school friends are racially unaware as it's a bit homogenous here.

Reminds me also about the time a chap with an eye patch walked past my son and I on the high street, he was also about 5. He said, in that voice which really carries 'that man looks just like a PIRATE.'

Agree MrsDeVere.