WWYD 5yr old 'racist' comment

[lola88]

When i picked my niece up from school on thursday the teacher told my there had been an incident with a little boy calling her a 'black face' she is mixed race. I was totally shocked she has never had any sort of racist comments before so was new for me to deal with tho i'm sure it won't be the last. The teacher spoke to the boys mum and DN seems fine about it to her it's just like being called any other name.

The thing thats annoying me is the boys mum i have spoke to her a couple of times and see her around a lot, but she's not said a word about it. If i was in her shoes i would want to say something but she has totally ignored me giving me cold looks if i catch her eye. I don't get it i tried to give her a 'kids will be kids' smile when it happened she just stalked off past me.

I don't know how to say this without sounding dramatic but i'm worried she's not said anything because maybe she herself has a problem with racism friends i've spoke to have suggested it saying he must have picked it up at home but i don't know.

WWYD if your child said that and you sort of knew the other childs parent/aunt? I'm so worried that if she's not dealing with it it could turn nasty for DN

bojangles
not everyone is a bigot and racist. If every one let the that be what you are identified by the we'd still be called the n word.

It up to individuals to call themselves what they are and for others to accept not the other way round.
Race relations in usa and uk are very different like black americans find black offensive and perfer afro american. If Obama calls himself anything its afro american not black which is frowned upon in polite society.

People have fought long and hard not to be dumped into a generalisations of if you are not white you are black. or coloured or half caste. Mixed race people have the right to have their identiity respected over the small mindedness of a bigot whether they be black or white or whatever else. There is a whole world of diversity and maintaining a colonial mindset towards it is backward.

I agree but you have the right be known as what you wish but just dont be navive how others see you

If your mixed raced then you have every right to call yourself mixed raced, but you are idding your self if you think people see you any diffrent to a black or asisn who are a few shades darker or lighter

My 3 dcs are mixed race black/white, and all 3 of them describe themselves' as 'black'.

All depends on the words used, and the way in which they are being spoken IMO. My DD was called a paki at nursery aged 3, by a boy about to turn 5 - by the tone of voice and the fact she was being pushed, she worked out it wasn't being used as a compliment. So came home and asked me why this boy didn't like her. It turned out he was only calling children with dark brown hair "pakis" - none of whom were (all white school / nursery). I am absolutely sure that he saw it as an insult, and that he had picked it up off his parents. However he clearly didn't understand precisely what he was saying as DD might be dark haired, but is white!

I had to sit down with DD and have the racism talk - as there was no way I wanted her using that word. She has never (to my knowledge) repeated it.

However in a child's mind, what is the difference between calling someone a red head / an afro head?! And we don't often see kids being told to stop calling someone a ginger!

With DD, I always tell her, before she does anything, think would she want to be called the equivalent, laughed at etc ...... however she still asked me (while standing right next to the big burly bloke) why he had those things through his lips and did he think they looked nice and were they difficult to eat with! Fortunately I could truthfully tell her my cousin had similar ones (just not on his lips), and some people like them and some people don't - so he smiled rather than turned round and glared!

My point is kids observe things, and there isn't a hell load we can do about it. And if we shush them too much, then they will think it is something to be ashamed of.

My dc used to refer to anyone who wasn't white as having a grey face. This is not even something I have heard before let alone something I've said. My point being is that young kids just say it as they can best describe it and very rarely mean it racially.

bojangles

I think people that matter get the difference and know where to draw the line.

Sorry didn't read all the thread - and have now seen its descended into shades and labels. I hate labels - we're all people - just some have better in-built skin protection than me. Have a nice evening, I'm going!

Do thu think that maybe the other mother thinks that the op made a compalint about it in the first place and that this is why she is avoiding her?

Emmanems you sound like me. My dd said something similar in a stage whisper, when she was about 3 - we don't like people that have faces like that, do we mummy? - in response to an asian lady giving her a lovely smile. I could have died. At the same age she also asked a black man on a train 'what colour is your willy?' not racist, but very embarrassing. Luckily he looked at me and laughed.

I very much doubt a 5 year old used the term "black face" with a racist intent because I don't think children of that age tend to use race as an insult. If it was said in an unpleasant way then the teacher needs to give a stern talking to about referring to people as individuals - "X has a name, please use it. I don't want to hear you calling anyone anything except their name again"

BUT

I would place bets that this child has picked the phrase up from home. I've never heard a 5 year old describe anyone as "black" or "white". They call the brown, pink, dark, light etc because to a 5 year olds literal mind people aren't black or white.

My 6 year old has been chased around a playground by older boys twice in the last 2 weeks yelling "HEY JAPANESE BOY" at the top of their voice. You can tell when children are being nasty and when they are being descriptive. And no, I don't ever intend for my child to see me putting up with him being hounded because of how he looks - even if its not overtly racist. It is not on. I have zero tolerance approach.

"but you are idding your self if you think people see you any diffrent to a black or asisn who are a few shades darker or lighter" - um I think you probably mean
"most white europeans" rather than "people". Most white Europeans consider DS to be Chinese (Japanese was a new one one me but in fact he is neither), most asians consider him to be mixed race.

Out of pure curiosity, what is the current PC way to define race if need be.
Describing someone as 'white male/female/boy/girl' seems to be acceptable, no? How about someone who is not white? There are so many racism related accusations flying around, quite often completely unfounded, one would like to clarify the above matters.

I have a mixed-race DS (black/white) and he certainly doesn't consider himself black, nor do any of his mixed-of-all-races/nationalities consider themselves so. And they are the whole colour spectrum, from blonde/blue-eyed to black!

With globalisation more and more multicultural relationships and children are the result. Thank god! We are all unique individuals and the sooner we stop putting people into pigeonholes the better.

rollmops using an accurate description of skin colour if necessary shouldn't involve any accusations of racism unless you are using it un-necessarily or choosing obviously insensitive terms. Would you really describe someone Japanese as "yellow"?

I'm sure most people can get by without a paint chart approach.

I dont know what 'current PC way' means.

Rollmops I think race is now a non pc work now and you should refer to ethnicity or ethnic group or origin. Unfortunately the ethnic classifications cover such an enormous range now that you are bound to offend someone. If the matter ever arises in conversation I tend to either plonk for black, white or mixed (or blended) or describe people as white european, african/caribbean or asian - but then always ask them whether I've got it right. Most people don't take offence if they see that you aren't trying to cause offence.

"you are bound to offend someone" - no you aren't. As you said yourself "Most people don't take offence if they see that you aren't trying to cause offence."

I'm 47 and I genuinely believe that in those 47 years I haven't ever offended anyone in describing them appropriately whatever their race, colour or ethnicity or age or size - its generally called being polite!

We live and have always lived in a very 'white' area, also all extended family blond/blue eyed so it's high time for DTs to understand that there are people who look different as in skin colour etc, yet are same 'inside' iyswim.

suburbophobe - thank you in respect that you say that we need to see people as individuals.

I look how I look - I actually don't look like any of my backgrounds. I'm usually mistaken for something completely different. It's so f'cking boring after 43 years when people constantly ask me where I'm from (London) and then after I tell them they decide to point out to me (like I don't know ) 'well you don't look like you are from there'.

Well holy shit - really? I'm not from there - I'm mixed - that's why I look like neither. And because I don't look like from I'm from here that's what you're asking. So what exactly am I supposed to look like?

I despair at today's so called 'multiculuralism' - I really do. My parents agree with me and think the UK has actually gone downhill in this area. So strange hearing people say was is this race and what is that race - and what mixed race is and who suffers more racism. I've never been so labelled in my life than now.

From what I can see the OP is doing her best for her dn. Good on her.

If someone could explain a few things to me, i am not racist at all and neither is my family or anyone i know, as i don't associate myself with those people.

But if someone is black, why is it racist to say they are black? Is it because you are just referring to their skin colour and nothing else about the person?

and why is it alright for someone to say call me white, but not a black person black?

Racism is a social construct and when communicated it's usually the tone that people take offense to. So depending on how the 5 year old conveyed his comment, will determine whether he was being racist or just stating a fact.

My 4 year old (he was 3 at that time) saw a short adult in a town somewhere in Europe and said 'mummy, why is that man so little?'. I was mortified and thankfully the man laughed and said that DS was cute (obviously he also understood English!).

Another time, dh brought DS to a playgym which was attached to a proper gym. And for 10 min DS was fascinated by people exercising on thread mill and bikes. Then he said v loudly, 'daddy wow look at that fat woman - she can cycle real fast!!!'. Thankfully it was behind the glass window...

I honestly think he was describing and stating as fact. Eg the yellow man (man in yellow t-shirt).

so Kate - you would walk up to a someone and say "hello black man"?

Of course its perfectly reasonable to describe someone in a crowd of others - though generally I find a point and "that man over there" works just as well.

Are people really so dull-witted when it comes to what is racist and what is a reasonable description.

If a reasonable person would wince at what you said, the chances are its racist. If they wouldn't and its something you would quite happily say to the face of that person (without actually intending to offend them) then it probably isn't.

I do get a bit exasperated when these threads always turn around to "but its OK to call people black" as if that's the point. As if those of us who live with racism have a hair trigger and are unable to tell when people are being offensive or not. My experience is that those people who have a reason to be concerned about racist attitudes probably put up with more shit than anyone else would in the their position.

"Japanese boy" is not an insult (though factually incorrect) but running around a playground casing a much smaller boy shouting "HEY JAPANESE BOY" was designed to try to intimidate him and scare him (probably because they hadn't spot his eagle-eyed but different looking mum giving them the evil eye and thought they were safe). I didn't see anyone running around screaming "HEY WHITE BOY" at anyone else. Because "white" is not in the vast majority of cases deemed to be an insult because it covered 95% of the people there. It was news to me that you could turn Japanese, Chinese (and even lovelier Chinky) or Asian into a insult but bugger me - you can, if you try hard enough.

Is redneck racist?

no idea, I've never heard it used in the UK so I don't have a strong feeling about it. Would think it a bit odd if someone used it here rather than racist. I don't know how its seen in the US but from memory its something which is seen as an insult coming from anyone, white or black, so although possibly offensive I'm not sure if its racist.

It strikes me as strange that it's not, if it's not. We visited Lynchburg and they had Redneck China on display. It was paper plates and cups.

I guess white people don't take offense to being called names.

I don't think redneck is racist but it is classist.

Thanks Tunbwitch. Yes, it is classist. It's just wrong.