to want to stop breastfeeding just because...

[takingiteasy]

I do? Oh I dunno if I'm making much sense but here goes. Ds2 is almost 5 weeks old. Both he and I took to feeding really well and have had no real problems. He's gained a pound since birth, sleeps well, only gets up once in the night and is very content. I took a bout of mastitis a couple of weeks back but we fed through it and coped.

So in spite of all this I am thinking about stopping. My reasons are so selfish. I feel like I do nothing but feed I swear I'm going to get pressure sores from sitting on the sofa. I haven't spent any decent time with ds1 and miss that. Thinkin forward I would quite like a night off sometime in the next wee while and a gin

In all honesty I wasn't expecting to get this far. I only made it ti day 5 with ds1 and have no guilt. I sais I'd give it another go this time round but really didn't think it would work and here I am looking for an excuse to stop. All the while there are women putting themselves through hell to do it.

I also have zero.sex.drive which is no fun.

Takingiteasy - I believe that your experience with your peers etc can make a massive difference. Even though I came from a very working class background, I come from a big family and all my aunts etc always breast fed, probably because they couldn't afford formula! I spent a lot of time in childhood at family gatherings keeping one aunt or another company while she fed her baby in another room, often because I couldn't bear to be apart from the baby as I loved babies so much! One aunt used to get her baps out in the social club we went to on Sundays in front of all the old men! So for me seeing a babe with boob in mouth was so natural and nothing to be ashamed of so I of course naturally wanted to do it myself. However i hit some massive wobbles as I thought it would be as easy as my boob wielding aunts made it look, but it just wasn't at first. But I persevered and it became that easy within a few months. When I was wavering lots of my bottle feeding friends made me feel like I was silly to persevere. However i was also getting it in the ear from hvs/bfing counsellors that i must keep going at all costs. In fact I did try and give up, but my milk kept coming and I was mixed feeding in an attempt to reduce my supply and eventually stop, but I found during this process I just started to find it so much easier, maybe because I had I oversupply before? So I went back to ebf and never looked back , plus I now had a baby who would take a bottle of formula occasionally if I needed a break and cba to express.

Why not throw in the odd bottle of formula? You might find the bf less if a drag if there is less pressure and you don't have to do it so often. Then once it gets easier and feeds take less time etc, you may decide to go back to ebf, or perhaps stick with the bottles? You won't be able to give up overnight anyway if you're anything like me, your boobs won't let you!

I remember my dr saying to me that even if I could give my dd a thimble full of my bm before I gave her a bottle that would do her some good. So just goes to show how much antibody etc is in just a tiny amount of bm. But of a guilt trip I know, but it worked on me.

Roundtable - I also think that studies on bf vs ff babies probably don't take lots of other factors into account.

I haven't read through all the messages, but I would totally agree with what devon said. Try mixed feeding for giving you a little break. Do you have someone such as your mum or partner who could feed your LO either expressed milk or formula while you spend that time with your oldest? If you go gradual about phasing it out, you hopefully won't be left with a decision you regret either way.

Take care of yourself and good luck with what ever you choose. Oh and an extra big hug for your 6 year old. I'm sure he's being an absolute star of a big brother.

I totally support your decision, whatever choice you make.
I just wanted to add though it does get easier. If you are only feeding on a sofa I am not surprised you are feeling bored .

I breastfed without a break for seven years ( not just one child!) so I can appreciate your feelings.
If you can master feeing in a sling then you will actually find you have more of yourself to give to your other child as you have two hands free to interact, do a jigsaw hold a book etc.
The length of feeds and frequency of feeds will diminish in coming weeks as your baby's jaw muscles strengthen and become more efficient.
By 12 weeks my babies could take a full feed in around 10 minutes.

Switching to formula may actually take more time away from your toddler because of cleaning and sterilising bottles, making up feeds etc.
There is no harm in having a drink while you are breastfeeding, alcohol is poorly transferred to breastmilk anyway.
If you would like to drink more you could express beforehand, have fun then express and dump the milk that may be alcoholic, while feeding your baby expressed milk.
All these things are possible.

I think you are being a little unrealistic regarding expectations of a sex drive 5 weeks after giving birth.
I don't think many women whether they breast or formula feed feel very sexual at this time, so please don't blame breastfeeding.

Just to add there are some of us who find breastfeeding very sexual and fecund, I know my OH did, and our sex life was fantastic while I was lactating.

Roundtable - studies of the wider and more reliable kind do not show that (the Millenium cohort) they show that formula from birth is worse for health than early weaning (before 16 weeks). That is largely because of the high dose colostrum for immune system support but also because of the make up of formula - iron loaded, changes to the gut using formula and no immune support (despite claims) as well as a more risky feeding method.

I've rarely, well never, seen such a good natured, sensible and supportive thread on the breastfeeding issue on Mumsnet in the three years I've been on here. Which is bloody brilliant considering it's such an emotional issue for some who are struggling.

Paperback - Thanks for coming back with another lovely post! You sound like you would be such a valuable, supportive, fair minded, emotionally mature and self aware friend to lean on in times of stress

Yanbu or selfish. As has been said before , your new baby is part of a family where everyone's needs and happiness are equally valid . I succumbed to breast feeding pressure and really resent it now. Feeding was painful and I spent most of my days dreading the next feed.
You might find Zoe Williams' article on breast feeding quite interesting. It was published on line yesterday in the life and style section.

Studies don't take into account all the emotional and practical factors such as needing to return to work and feeling subsumed by the baby but that is because what they are interested in is purely the health effects of breast/formula milk. Women can make their own choices based on the health evidence and on their own emotional and social, perfectly valid and important factors. There have been loads and loads of studies into infant feeding. It really is unequivocal that formula milk increases risks of illness and death and poorer neurological development in the baby, also breastfeeding reduces risks of cancers for the mother proportionally to the amount of time spent feeding in total. But this is why you get the "mine had formula and were fine" anecdotes. Most babies are fine but it can't be known whether they would have had better long term health if they had been breastfed - some of them would, some would be unaffected. In reality this may be unimportant given that health outcomes in this country are brilliant overall.

These are just medical facts. It isn't about bashing formula feeders, people should be equipped with this knowledge so that they can make an informed decision about feeding their babies. Some of the lack of knowledge on this thread makes me really because women are being denied that informed choice. Yes, some studies are better than others, it is a difficult area to study but that does not mean that formula is actually just as good.

Formula is a valid choice to make, it represents a valid nutritional choice for women in the first world who have the ability to make up feeds optimally but feeding behaviour really affects safety. It is very important that you make up each feed freshly into a freshly sterilised bottle and that you don't store and microwave bottles. This does make formula feeding harder but it is very important because formula is not sterile and contains some nasty bacteria which grow easily and make little babies very sick. Formula fed babies in wealthy countries do get sick and die this way. They also have an increased risk of SIDS, some think because of the deep sleep which is brought on by formula being harder to digest.

No doubt I'll get called "breastfeeding militia" now which is ironic because actually what I'm concerned about is women getting full information so they can make the best choice and protecting babies. There are many ways women can reduce the risks of formula feeding but you have to know what the risks are first. Burying your head in the sand and thinking "they wouldn't sell it if it was that bad" isn't a great idea.

This OP has done great, exclusivity of feeding is important but if social and emotional factors affect her then it is valid to introduce some formula I think and completely her own valid choice that should be supported. The only thing I object to is the perpetuation of the myths that you have to sit down to feed, you can't play with your children because you are always feeding, you can't drink any booze and it puts you off sex. None of those things are necessarily to do with breastfeeding and none of them will necessarily be improved by formula feeding.

The lack of peers who bf is a big issue for me too. Before DD I had no clue about babies and knew nothing about things like growth spurts, cluster feeding and sleep regressions. I did imagine that babies are demanding but had never thought that a feeding session could last 3 hours, or that a baby would literally need contact with my body 24 hours a day (on bad days only thankfully!).

Each baby is different and I now have friends who have had different experiences but with some babies I think you do need to resign yourself to just doing the baby all day (and night) long. This is not an easy thing in itself, but add to that other children, a partner, work, and other obligations and modern life is not really set up for childrearing!

(baby crying, got to go, but had some more thoughts I might try to add later!)

Any links to up to date research please Offred? I'd be interested to read any studies that takes into account weaning as well as milk choice.

I'd imagine that any study would still need to be on going though?

Good post Offred. I too want women to be able to make informed choices. It's so hard to present the facts without appearing to be a breastfeeding militant. It's not about that, as you say, it's just about making sure that the decision is made with the correct information to hand

Showofhands I've added your excellent post to my screenshot archive.

Ta proudscary, good to see you are taking more sense now...

As I said Roundtable it is the Millenium cohort I think!

Should point out the comparison was specifically early weaning vs no breastmilk (formula from birth). If you are debating whether to give formula or food in addition to breastmilk at an early age you are increasing risks associated with non-exclusivity of feeding and formula is the better choice.

So it'd be interesting to know what the comparison would be for weaning at 6 months after ff with blw and comparing with puree too vs the same but with breastmilk. Garbled sentence, but hopefully you get the drift!

Ff doesn't equal early weaning, although some may choose to, so it seems odd to just compare that?

Sorry op to deviate, finding this interesting!

have you thought about mixed feeding? advantages are that you hand baby over for a feed and if you are caught out delayed whilst out with baby you have food on tap.

mixed feeding kept me sane through sore boobs and 18-20 feeds a day!

Very well done for getting this far. I have the utmost respect for anyone who does BF, even though I'm one of those selfish bastards who chose not to.

Good luck to you whatever you decide to do. If mixed feeding is working for you so far, it might be a very handy option rather than just doing one or the other.

Roundtable - I'm sure I've read some tentative research or professional hypothesis, although not sure where, that weaning pre 16 weeks has increased risks for all but that it is more important ff babies delay solids until 6 months because of different populations of gut flora.

I suspect the natural process was breastmilk until the baby started being interested in food and then some masticated and finger food until the baby could manage to eat enough themselves. Not into the war between BLW and purées/mashes. Think babies probably had a combo, seems strange to let the baby completely fend for themselves straight away!

I agree Offred, that seems more natural to me. With DS I tried "pure" BLW but it didn't sit right so ended up mashing with a fork and some finger foods. I even used to chew some bits of meat for him before giving him

With dd I'm giving mashed first then some finger food alongside.

I think Gill Rapley mentions mums giving masticated food in her BLW book but the principle isn't applied in BLW for some reason?

Is there a war? I hadn't noticed.

I took it to be down to the type of child. Ds took to it straight away at 6 months and ate with minimal problems pretty much straight away. His poos became solid within the week.

However, if he was needing food pre 6 months for whatever reason or struggled with chewing, I'd have given him purees, then worked up from that.

All babies develop at different rates, so this must apply to food. I agree about the masticating. (is that even a real word?) Makes sense when you see it around us in nature, however, I'd rather use a blender!

As long as it not too early, healthy and doesn't involve force feeding and coaxing, I suspect it makes no difference or very minimal.

Would be nice if they looked into it though.

It is hard to study because so few babies are breastfed exclusively to six months!

You should do what you want to do!

My DD is FF and In the middle of the night when I'm doing bottles in the kitchen for DD I really really really envy breast feeders! But there are defo pros and cons both ways.

Well done for doing it so far!

Could your DP do an expressed/formula bottle at bedtime so you and DS 1 can have quality time?