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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to NOT have smacked DS1 when he bit and kicked me

196 replies

LargeLatte · 05/04/2011 20:10

Long - sorry.

DS1 (5yr 10mo) has had an hour long melt down. We were leaving my Grandad's, I gave him fair warning first, then when I went to put his shoes on he kicked me.

I told him not to kick me, I kept my cool, put him in the car while he bit down on my arm, then as I leant across he bit into my back.

As I reversed the car he undid his seat belt, so I got out and went to strap him back in, and he sprinted past me and down the drive.

My Grandad's pearl of wisdom - 'you can't let him do that to you'- I think the implication being that I should've hit him back.

I caught him, put him back in the car and said (again still amazingly calmly) 'If you hurt me again or undo your seat belt we won't watch your cartoon before bed'. Result - still swearing and angry but otherwise a safe drive home.

I opened the car door and off he ran down the road, really fast - have got him home safe and sound after a few minutes.

I'm not a smacker. I'm not a shouter. I do natural / logical consequences, but I can't help but think that if I had lost it with him when he first kicked me (like many other parents I have seen) he would've just bl00dy behaved himself!

OP posts:
Ismene · 05/04/2011 20:13

YANBU not to smack, although I would have shouted at the running away, but we are all different. I hope he didn't get to watch the cartoon after the second dash though!

Hulababy · 05/04/2011 20:14

YANBU. I have never smacked 9y DD and never intend to.

girliefriend · 05/04/2011 20:15

tbh I think I would have punished more than no cartoons before bed. I wouldn't smack (I hope!) but would have prob shouted and been v v v cross, also time out when we got home and poss conviscated a fav toy. I don't think you can tolerate that kind of abuse from a 5yo - my dd is similiar age and I would be mortified if she had behaved like that!

So YANBU but YABU not to punish a bit more imo!!!

squeakytoy · 05/04/2011 20:16

I will go against the grain here and say yes, I certainly would have given a smack for that sort of behaviour. But I know I am old fashioned.

MmeLindt · 05/04/2011 20:17

Hmm. Unsure, tbh.

My DS is 6.5yo and has for the past year been having this kind of meltdown. Not normally for such a long time, I think 20 mins was his longest.

I don't smack, but do sanction him (withdrawl of TV or iPad privileges).

It has got better now, and he is finally starting to be able to calm himself down.

What set him off?

I have to say though, that kicking and biting would mean a bigger punishment than no cartoon before bed. That is totally unacceptable.

Original poster
LargeLatte · 05/04/2011 20:21

He was totally devastated about the cartoon (the upset is what prompted rhe 2nd running away) - it is our special treat together once ds2 is in bed, so I know that seems a bit soft but I was quite pleased to see how much he was stil begging to watch it (cruel, evil mother).

Ismene - when I am scared I can't shout. Literally no sound will come out. Which is not that helpful when you have kids and you need to keep them out of danger but literally nothing would've come out. By the time I got him back in the car I could speak, but then it seemed a bit odd to shout at him at close range.

Maybe I do need to start confiscating toys but in the past when I've tried that he does something he knows he shouldn't and then gets a toy and says 'here, take my Leapster' - same with time out. I could confiscate Penguin (his favourite soft toy) but that seems really cruel? Isn't that a bit mean, or is that OK?

OP posts:
compo · 05/04/2011 20:22

I think it's shocking he was swearing at you Sad

Ismene · 05/04/2011 20:26

I missed the swearing bit! That is shocking TBH.

I would absolutely take the Penguin, because he is sensing your hesitation and playing on it.

louloudia · 05/04/2011 20:26

i would have whacked the little sod

plus he is putting himself in danger keep running off

GrownUpNow · 05/04/2011 20:27

I think from my experience of having smacked and shouted, that all it actually does is escalate the tantrum because they're already usually out of control when they get to this point. I try now to keep calm and quiet, refuse to engage him at all until he's calmed down, then give him a consequence punishment for the violence and stick to it. I am often not sure when to punish expressions of frustration, but physical acts get automatic removal of privileges and time out in the bedroom usually.

At least I am happier dealing with it. Losing my temper, smacking or shouting all make me feel completely awful and out of control. My mother seems to think that I should be firmer, but her idea of firm is talking to them horribly, dragging them about, emotional blackmail, shouting and smacking. I used to do the same, but I've reached a point where I don't want that any more. I think it's wrong and continuing on a bad pattern of behaviour.

So no, I don't think you are being unreasonable.

I'm personally looking for a way to parent without me having to use this sort of thing at all.

Whatever17 · 05/04/2011 20:27

I have 2 DSs (11 and 20) DS1 drove me to despair sometimes and I did smack him about 5 times in his life, it was always from anger and an inability to cope (I was too young having him) and I am ashamed of it. With DS2 I was older, have never smacked him.

I just think it's morally wrong, you are bigger and stronger and there are better ways to do things. Although I have no clue what they are!

I just think hitting (which is what smacking is) isn't the answer, even though I have done it myself.

MmeLindt · 05/04/2011 20:29

No, don't confiscate his favourite cuddly toy, his comforter.

But you do have to do something to make him see that this behaviour is not acceptable.

For me, it was not reacting. Which is actually pretty much what you did today, when I think about it.

If that cartoon with you is his favourite time of the day, then perhaps it was the best decision. As long as it is not something that you threaten often - only for really terrible behaviour.

Can you talk to him afterwards about it, ask him if he understands why you were angry?

catchmeifyoucan · 05/04/2011 20:31

Escalate the tantrum be damned! That kind of behaviour, where he could possibly have come to harm by running away from you and could CERTAINLY have harmed you with biting absolutely must be punished in such a way as to embed a message to never ever even think about doing that again. My son has been smacked twice in his life - once was for running away into the path of an oncoming car. It missed him by half an inch.

Ismene · 05/04/2011 20:32

I'm always intrigued by people who are against shouting because I don't think it always means that you are out of control. I'm trying to understand here BTW, not judging. I'm not advocating screaming your own head off, but if a child runs off down the road then surely you would shout 'Stop right there....now!". 'Now' is definately my scary 'just you try it' word.

Original poster
LargeLatte · 05/04/2011 20:32

Whatever17 - that is exactly my problem - that I know I don't want to be a violent aggressive parent, but just haven't found an alternative that works.

My friend is a childminder and was telling me about 'reflection time' and not making a big deal of bad behaviour - that you just ignore it and move on, praise the good etc etc etc - and that all sounds very lovely except what is the lah-de-dah approach to tonights debacle?

OP posts:
girliefriend · 05/04/2011 20:33

Its sounds like tbh your son needs you to take charge a bit more, yes take the penguin - you are in charge and he has to realise that it is not okay to behave like that at 5yo!!! Why are you worried about seeming 'a bit mean' when your son is swearing, biting and hitting you!!! OMG!!!

louloudia · 05/04/2011 20:34

mine are grown up now and i found that a firm smack when they did something really naughty soon stopped them from keep doing it

squeakytoy · 05/04/2011 20:35

My parents were not at all violent or aggressive, but it very naughty behaviour warranted an immediate punishment, (which kicking and biting does in my opinion), then a smack is the most effective method.

I completely disagree with the idea of "ignoring the bad and praising the good" as to a child, ignoring something they do means that it is acceptable.

BitOfFun · 05/04/2011 20:36

I'd have hit the fucking roof if either of mine had behaved like that- they'd have been lucky to escape a smack, frankly, and I certainly would have shouted.

Ismene · 05/04/2011 20:36

I agree that 'ignoring the bad and praising the good' is far too wishy-washy. Children need boundaries, not over praise.

Vallhala · 05/04/2011 20:37

I agree with squeaky, but then I'm old-fashioned (and just plain old) too,

ApocalypseCheeseToastie · 05/04/2011 20:39

I'd have gone batshit at the swearing alone. That sort of behaviour is not on at all.

MmeLindt · 05/04/2011 20:39

It is all very well, to say that the OP should just smack and shout at her child, but she has already said that she does not want to do this, and that she feels uncomfortable doing so.

I do shout - boy, do I shout sometimes - but I don't smack. Like GrownUpNow, I used to and found it to be totally useless way of stopping the tantrum. It just made it worse.

Smacking shows the child that you have lost control. And when you are trying to teach him how to keep his temper and calm down again once he has gotten angry, it is counter-productive.

girliefriend · 05/04/2011 20:41

if you just ignore the bad behaviour then basically you send out the message that that behaviour is okay and there are no consequences.

Did you not feel angry when he behaved like that? I would be!

The only time I came close to smacking my dd was when she went to slap me across the face, I was so angry with her I was physically shaking!!! She has not done it since (she is now 5yo and that was about 2yrs ago)

heliumballoons · 05/04/2011 20:42

largelatte Can I just say (unpatronisingly I hope) well done for not shouting or smacking.

I would have tbh have given a consequence to the kicking - warning or withdrawal of priviledge. At nearly 6yo he knows better than to behave that way.

YANBU to say no cartoon - I think he got off lightly tbh. Grin