To think Surestart groups are crap

[Pushmeinthepool]

and to never want to go there again!?

I went to a Surestart group for the first time this morning, with a friend. We normally go to a different toddler group but thought we'd give this one a go.

First of all, the "official" Surestart ladies standing observing all the mums. You just KNOW that they are looking for stuff to feed back to your HV about you.

Secondly, offering useless, unwanted advice to mums that are clearly competent. I know some mums don't give a stuff about their children and need to be told where they're going wrong, but honestly, surely it's able to tell one of those parents from a normal, competent parent?

My friend held her 7 month old baby boy on a rocker type thing, and immediately a do-gooder woman rushed over saying she must use the strap when he's on there. WTF?! She was holding him tightly and would hardly be likely to leave a baby on there unattended.

My 20 month old DS was running around, as kids do, under my watchful eye of course, and another of the SS ladies told me to be careful as he might run into one of the tables at the edge of the room and bump his head. She was about 18, I am a mid-thirties mum of 3. It's obvious that my child is clean, tidy, I wasn't swearing or shouting at him or ignoring him like some parents were to their kids. Surely I don't need to be told something like that. They even watched us all strapping our babies into their buggies at the end of the group.

Anyway, I think SS groups are just to try and catch parents out and for the SS workers to find fodder to tittle tattle to health visitors, so I won't be going again.

What, pascoe, do you suggest replaces SS in terms of identifying and preventing abuse (for example)? Vigilante groups? They could certainly recruit from these boards in that respect...

I live in a posh area and our local toddler groups are full of 40+ first time mothers who are very snobby and judgmental about other people (much like you come across op)

My wife prefers to go to sure start groups as they have alot of normal people in them (my wife is 27 and has two children DS1 is 2.5yrs and DS2 is 9m, it is a much friendlier atmosphere there.

Surestart is also set up for low income families and young families to offer support and advice but they welcome everyone.

Also they regularly offer free courses to people. my wife was offered a free english and maths course (she politly declined as she has a degree) but i bet the op would of been offended at this instead of seeing how good the offer was.

Op your very unreasonable. grow up.

glad to hear all you have to do to be a competent parent is to keep your child clean...

I thought it also meant demonstrating positive qualities like tolerance and open mindedness

But I guess I could be wrong there.....

Hobgoblin - I see, so SS (apt abbreviation, btw) were set up to identify and prevent abuse, were they? Is that their primary purpose or a secondary 'benefit'?

How do they identify abuse then? How do they prevent it?

What kind of track record do the authorities have when it comes to identifying genuine abuse? And failing to spot it? And misdiagnosing it?

Of all the arguments that could be used to defend SS, this is without doubt the weakest.

You'll be seeking to expand such 'provision' by placing a monitor in each and every home next.

There is a huge amount of misunderstanding here even from the SureStart supporters.

They are not for poor people or unemployed parents.

The underpinning principle is 'Every Child Matters'.

Literacy and numeracy support is with a view to supporting children's learning, though access to information on improving one's own adult skills is available through links with employment and training agencies.

SureStart is about children's life chances. For some that may entail support for parents regarding finances (benefits) for others it may involve literacy or linguistic support. For children it may be a safe place to play, or an outdoor area to play or an opportunity to socialise. There is NO single group that SStart serves other than CHILDREN, and it does this by supporting their families too - regardless of status or class or education.

Our local sure start centre is fabulous, darling. Not a chav to be seen. It's permanently habituated by nice, middle class mums with thoroughly nice, middle class kids. A fantastic use of resources, I feel.

There is NO single group that SStart serves other than CHILDREN

'nuff said.

Baroque - more aimed at the OP's determination to label some of the parents as 'crap' and 'don't give a shit' parents. And that OP wouldn't be darkening the doors again because she is 'normal and competent'. The heavy implication being that SS should be left as the exclusive preserve of bad parents.

I think that most parents of under-5s look for help and support at some stage. That's what SS is meant to do - in a non-threatening, non-discriminatory way. They don't try to judge you as you walk in the door - because they can't second guess your reasons for turning up.

Bloody hell, having read through this thread, those supporting SS groups have convinced me that the OP is right and all SS groups are to be avoided.

Meaning what? lochnessmumster

ahhh I'm with you pira

I have to confess to not having used many of the services often. And DS3 (my youngest) is in nursery now I'm close enough/well enough to get to the groups regularly anyhow)

I use my local SS centre purely for a little social interaction (and free cup of coffee though if I have my wallet with me I do throw some change in the voluntary donations pot)) a couple of times a week in the Family Kitchen. There's always someone else down there just having a cuppa after dropping their child at nursery and/or waiting for one of the centre groups to start.

It sure beats coming home to an empty house and drinking coffee on my own as there's always someone around whether it's staff or other parents.

Meaning, having read through this thread, those supporting SS groups have convinced me that the OP is right and all SS groups are to be avoided.

Would you like to back up this failure statistically Pascoe. I mean do you know how many children are being abused unknown to SS? If you did happen to have this info then I really think our country's children could use it, so don't hang onto it will you?

Just because there have been some well publicised failings of SS depts. does not mean that SS are wholly unsuccessful in identifying and preventing abuse.

I am well educated as to the signs of child neglect and abuse, but do not suppose to hold any type of CCTV grade of 6th sense in this area. Social Workers are too, but it is the lack of funding to support their work that disenables them from eradicating further the abuse that continues on in homes up and down the country.

Did I say SS were set up to identify abuse? SS exist to keep children and adults safe. It is that simple. Not every individual is capable of achieving this for himself and it would be inappropriate to favour a community approach to such a task over a centrally regulated one for obvious reasons. Strike me down, even I will concede that some Social Workers are incapable of competently following guidelines on data protection. But again, pay peanuts get monkeys.

Our protection system for vulnerable children and adults is underfunded and inadequate. It fails...countless times...but it also succeeds and every success is another child that has mattered enough to have a system in place that tries to protect him.

I'm sure you won't be missed

There is no evidence to support your existence anyway lochnessmumster

Er,,, OP. If your OP and subsequent comments are true and not as full of the shit you say the nappies were - wouldn't you HOPE that the workers might in fact "feedback to the HV"?

Just giving my opinion, why so touchy?

Ours is great - I'm back at work now so don't really get to go but I took DS every week to a 'Baby Explorers' session - lots of sensory toys, soft mats for him and others to roll around on safely, ball pools, messy play and singing at the end.

Wide range of mums (and dads) and lovely staff.

Like anything, I'm sure some are better than others, but I think OP is VVVU, and SS centres are resources that need to be protected from cuts and closures, because surely if they help any parent, who is sruggling in any way, that's a good thing.

Gosh there are some judgemental thickos on MN at the moment - how sad.

• or even struggling!!

And i'll have you know there are some very grainy photos of me taken at night, many years ago that prove, beyond doubt that i exist.

There is a huge amount of misunderstanding here even from the SureStart supporters.

A lot of that misunderstanding comes from these threads telling MC mums they shouldn't be diverting resources from those in need which does imply, sure start is aimed at a particular group, especially when some groups are facing complete closure.