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Original poster

To think it's about time we could choose the sex of our babies..

227 replies

Articulate · 07/01/2011 16:38

Provided we already have one of the opposite sex. Horrible story in the DM (yes, I know)..about an Australian woman aborting healthy twin boys because they wanted a girl.

Yes, utterly vile and unnacceptable, but couldn't this have been avoided if she could have chosen the sex?

Like I said , only if you already have one of the opposite sex (or two maybe)...

OP posts:
ValiumTinselton · 07/01/2011 20:50

so why are you saying that her posts make you sick to your stomach?

I think it's a really interesting question.

I understand the wider issues, just because I don't 100% agree with you in lambasting another poster you think I have it all wrong, I'm thick, and that I ahven't read this thread or many others like it.

Original poster
Articulate · 07/01/2011 20:52

I didn't call you selfish for disagreeing with me. I called you selfish for point blank refusing to empathise or even try to understand how someone who desperately yearned for a son/daughter felt.

You're also twisting my words. My opinion changed throughout the thread as to the one (or two). This is because I listened to reasonable replies. Is every comment you make set in stone??

YAVVU.

It was a tad harsh to call you selfish, but you've won the insults race since then I'd say.

OP posts:
ValiumTinselton · 07/01/2011 20:53

but the scenario she offered up was if a family already has a couple of one sex they should be allowed to then select the other sex. And in theory, I agree with her that that is not that unreasonable or shocking. It's not the same as demanding a boy when you've no children at all, or aborting a girl, or aborting girl after girl.

And in this part of the world, people are as likely to want a boy after three girls as the other way around. This isn't china. Mothers value girls

Earthakitten · 07/01/2011 20:53

Because her peddling the idea that we should have legalised sex selection just because the occsional nutter might abort the wrong sex child is abhorrent to me.

ValiumTinselton · 07/01/2011 20:55

ofgs, is she peddling the idea, or is she just raising an interesting question for discussion??

She didn't say anything about abortion either.

People can abort their child with or without sex selection.

Earthakitten · 07/01/2011 20:55

"they should be allowed to then select the other sex"

Do you know how sex selection works? Microsort sperm sorting isn't 100% so you'd have to resort to IVF.

IVF that is invasive and can be damaging to women (my friend's breast cancer was accelerated by IVF, she died when her kid was two, by the way). Just to fulfil some whim of getting the 'right' sex.

Earthakitten · 07/01/2011 20:56

"She didn't say anything about abortion either"

Jesus Christ.

Seriously, HAVE you read the thread? Do you know the news story that provoked it?

ValiumTinselton · 07/01/2011 20:56

a whim to you, but you're not the ultimate judge of what was a whim or what was a risk worth taking....

All IVF carries the same risk I presume? So do you think there should be no IVF then??

Earthakitten · 07/01/2011 20:58

"So do you think there should be no IVF then??"

No.

Original poster
Articulate · 07/01/2011 20:59

It's abhorrent to me that you think I'm saying we should have legalised sex selection just because the occasional nutter might abort the wrong sex child.

That's not what I'm saying at all.

Thanks for your imput Valium Smile

OP posts:
ValiumTinselton · 07/01/2011 20:59

wow, you're fucking nuts. In the posts I read, and in the OP, her original scenario didn't suggest abortion.

But either way, you're WAY too angry and worked up ramming what is just your OWN opinion down my throat.

I'm not obliged to have read every word on this thread.

The original question, the basis of this thread is not totally unreasonable imo. And my opinion is no less valid than yours no matter what you think!

WhereYouLeftIt · 07/01/2011 21:01

"But for those who really longed for a certain gender, why not?"

Be careful what you wish for, as the old saying goes ...

Let's imagine for a minute that what you propose exists. Parents get their longed for correct-gender child. Existing children of other gender - how do they feel, knowing they are second-best? Correct-gender child - how do they feel, knowing they were only wanted for their genital arrangement and not for the unique individual they are? Would they feel the need to conform to gender steroetype, else their parents wouldn't love them? That could really screw up every child of the family.

As my mother told me (and I tell DS), "I want" doesn't mean "I get". And if someone feels so strongly about wanting a particular gender of child, they seriously need to address WHY that is and not inflict their issues on children, born or unborn.

earwicga · 07/01/2011 21:01

Ahem, I thought I attacked you earlier

Actually, reading more of your comments I think I understand more where you are coming from, and also read the DM (spit) article. But I think you have chosen the wrong starting point.

Sex selection is wrong. There are 100 million missing reasons for that.

Abortion should always be available legally - free and safe.

But, this couple conceived through IVF. That would be my place to start criticism - the IVF clinic. 'Balance' doesn't play a part in this - it isn't a valid reason for sex selection. The couple are trying to replace their daughter who very sadly died. The IVF clinic are in the wrong here. The couple need counselling, not a legal judgement to allow them to replace their daughter.

ValiumTinselton · 07/01/2011 21:02

No worries Articulate.

Eartha, you think there should be no ivf???? wow. A lot of my friends' children wouldn't exist then. You have some extreme views I think.

Caboodle · 07/01/2011 21:02

Articulate - you say because it's not my issue it's bollocks - i.e that's why I don't agree with you. You're right, it's not my issue, I wouldn't let it be my issue - I couldn't disagree more with having the 'right' to choose the gender of your child. I don't think because it is possible to abort an unwanted child because of gender that the answer is to be able to choose the gender, nor do I think because I may 'want' something I should be able to get it. This is an emotive issue so you will get very strong opinions in response - what did you expect? You have also been harsh on Earthakitten IMO.

Earthakitten · 07/01/2011 21:03

The OP:

"To think it's about time we could choose the sex of our babies.. Provided we already have one of the opposite sex. Horrible story in the DM (yes, I know)..about an Australian woman aborting healthy twin boys because they wanted a girl.

Yes, utterly vile and unnacceptable, but couldn't this have been avoided if she could have chosen the sex?

Confused
earwicga · 07/01/2011 21:03

'The original question, the basis of this thread is not totally unreasonable imo.'

It is though. Sex selection (with no medical reason) is abhorrent.

Earthakitten · 07/01/2011 21:03

Er, no! I said no to the question, "you think there should be no IVF?" As in, no, I don't think there should be no IVF!

ValiumTinselton · 07/01/2011 21:04

Yes, the OP said it was an horrible story. You're twisting the point she was making. Deliberately obtuse I think.

Earthakitten · 07/01/2011 21:06

What????

Her premise is that sex selection should be allowed to prevent abortion!!

I am not twisting it, that's what she said!

altinkum · 07/01/2011 21:06

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

ValiumTinselton · 07/01/2011 21:06

Well then if you're not anti IVF, how can you differentiate between the health risks you mention wrt normal IVF and IVF for sex selection?? same health risks with both, but you mention the risks only in conjunction with ivf for sex selection.

flossymuldoon · 07/01/2011 21:06

Earthakitten. Just because Articulate doesn't want a girl it doesn't mean that she can't empathise with someone who does!

I don't agree with gender selection and stated my views, and i thought this thread was supposed to be a healthy debate - not OP bashing!!!!

Original poster
Articulate · 07/01/2011 21:07

I've been hard on Eartha!!!! Not nearly as hard as she's been on me, be fair!

earwicga...yes you did, didn't you..forgot that. I agree abortion should be legal.

I feel that aborting a child based on it's gender is plain wrong, and there needs to be a solution.

OP posts:
tholeon · 07/01/2011 21:08

I think anyone who can have a healthy child when they want to is very lucky. I have one son, conceived via ivf. At one point he was very ill but now he is well and I feel so lucky to have him, every single day.

Having said that, before I started ttc and just wanted a baby, I'd have always said I wanted a girl. I guess because I like women...in general. But my boy is perfect for me.

I have a friend with three boys and I know she would like a girl. If she went to the States for gender selection ivf I wouldn't hate or despise her for it. But I don't have a lot of sympathy for people who suffer 'gender disappointment.'

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