Support group for those affected by someone else's drinking thread 6

[pointythings]

A new thread so that the conversations can continue overnight. We have sadly been very active lately, so I thought it best to be proactive.

These threads are for everyone who has an alcoholic in their life: partner/husband/wife, sibling, child, parent. This is a safe space where you can vent and say all the things you can't say out loud in real life.

The people on these threads have all been there or are still on their journey. We will share what we have learned, crack dark jokes and offer a shoulder to cry on. Welcome to the club nobody wants to be in.

Link to previous thread here: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/alcohol_support/5515006-support-group-for-those-affected-by-someone-elses-drinking-thread-5?page=40&reply=153683715

Yes his phone was broken but managed to post on fb 🙄

hope visiting dh goes well @AcrossthePond55

I'm back, with my head hung in shame, when will i ever learn????
It's been interesting reading the last couple of pages discussing hope, that's what got me again.

STBExH stopped drinking for 2 weeks! No real idea why if I'm honest, but all that hope came rushing back. Maybe the divorce getting closer made him realise what he was losing, maybe the new mental health meds were the only ones that would work & he'll be ok now etc etc. Truth be told the sobriety was a blip & after 2 weeks we're all back to normal with him drinking & feeling sorry for himself. he really is the epitome of 'poor me, poor me, pour me another one'!

Thankfully i found my rage before my sorrow & got myself in a position where I've got the finances to negotiate a divorce settlement, although he's now taken to his bad because he's got stomach ache & is far too ill to progress the discussions. He'll be lovely to me later when he wants me to go fetch him some booze. I probably shouldn't but if i frame it right i can use it as a bargaining chip to get him to stay in bed & then i get a peaceful evening on the sofa with the dogs. I'm just so bloody sad at the whole situation even though i don't want to be. I know being mad or even indifferent would be a better use of my emotions, but i don't quite know how to stop myself from keep slipping back into sadness.

All your feelings are normal and valid. Don't beat yourself up for grieving over the loss of your marriage. It's a big thing, you're entitled to be sad.

Pat yourself on the back for staying the course. Freedom beckons. These are yhe hard yards, but you will get through them.

</pep talk>

@Ebananascroogey

Hey pal, no head hanging allowed on this thread. We will all hold our heads up high even after we've made a 'less than perfect' decision. Because we know that we are all human and that that damned hope is always lurking around the corner. And that we deserve to be proud of ourselves for recognizing that our partners/spouses are alcoholics, no matter what we do afterwards.

Hope is a real bastard. It pops up at the very worst times. I guess all we can do is remember that 'the best predictor of future behaviour is past behaviour' and squash those 'maybe' thoughts by following them with "Yeah, but probably not".

.....I can use it as a bargaining chip to get him to stay in bed & then i get a peaceful evening on the sofa with the dogs.

We do what works for us to give us a little peace.

...but i don't quite know how to stop myself from keep slipping back into sadness.

Neither do I. But I can say that as time has passed there are fewer instances of sadness and they are farther apart. And I've found that my moments of sadness tend to be focused on my 'personal losses' rather than the loss of my marriage. For example I get sad that my RVing days are over. But not that my RVing days with him are gone. They're gone because I can't afford it and couldn't do the 'heavy work' involved. It's a subtle difference, but it's a step away from sorrow for the loss of my marriage.

At this point I don't worry much about anger. Anger just takes up too much of my emotional 'coin'. And I'd rather 'spend' that on making myself happy than spend it on anger at him. Not to say I never get angry at him, but it's pretty uncommon these days. Mostly it's exasperation and pity. But I think that has to come in its own time.

@Ebananascroogey I’ll tell you a story.
over a year after we separated he was still trying to come back to me. 6 months after he got into another relationship I actually gave in . He managed to convince me he’d stopped and I thought surely no one else would put up with the shit I have from him so maybe it’s true . I was also jealous that this other woman was getting the ‘sober’ version of my husband I’d been denied.
He came back to me and our son for one day after dumping her
The next he does a complete one 180 and goes back to her
and thank fuck he did as shortly after he was banned from driving for 3 years and lost his teaching career for gong into work drunk
this all happened on our wedding anniversary too
Couldn’t make it up
they’re married now
shes put with far worse than I did

Oh @Ebananascroogey. Gives a most unlike mn ((hug))

it’s fine to have hope and we all had it once - but they literally piss on our hopes and dreams and now is the time to be strong

you have him another chance. Just incase - well he has abused it

I forgive ex countless times and hoped that blip would be the last one - it never was

be proud that you negotiated the divorce

has he actually signed it /agreed to the financial stuff

it’s fine to feel sad and angry

Thank you everyone, I needed those messages more than i realised. I hate that we've all been through similar horrible experiences, but it's so helpful to understand I'm not alone.
So much so I've been looking at air bnbs that he could move into until we get something sorted.
Nothing is signed legally but he's agreed a figure that I can work with. He's got pound signs in his eyes, or maybe that should be vodka bottles.
I've broken my heart with sadness over what he has lost, I have no idea why, because he's only sad about it when he can weaponise it.
I've kissed the dogs & retreated to bed with a hot chocolate & a bag of minstrels to read house magazines on my kindle & plan for when I can redecorate just how I like.
Please let this be the point where I stop being a pushover & put myself first 🤞

To get sorted. Do you mean sell the home ? As hard as it is to live (and thank God once I said no more , I didn’t live with dh as my house) my one saving grace

that he’s lives in an air bnb till sold - that may take months and is a cost

but if you can afford it and don’t have to live with him and his drunkenness I can understand why you want to

what breed dogs do you have ?

Thankfully when I was in my early 20's I decided rental property would be my pension, it means I can now sell one of those to pay him off & keep my home. I also have some inheritance from my dad who died recently. (His look at me, im so upset performance at that time I dont think I will ever forgive). He has his eye on a flat locally. It's a repossession so could complete in a month or so. Makes the air bnb a bit more achievable. If I could get him out before November I could see my grandson on his birthday which would make it worth any amount of money!
Oh & the dogs, they are dogue de bordeaux. If you're old enough think Turner & Hooch. X2. My whole entire world in a couple of tons of hairy ginger slobber!!

Oh I’m def old enough. Weirdly I watched that for the millionth time with dd last week. They are adorable !

tho seems unfair you lose your pension .property to have to buy him a place but guess marriage things gets split

sorry about your dad but I guess if he was alive he would want to help you and leaving you money means he has

Me again.
back in July, when my other half went on a bender after 4 months sober, I clearly told him if he did it again I’d throw him out.
Over the last 3 months he has been sober but increasingly very unpleasant. Angry about every little thing. Almost unbearably depressed and pessimistic. There are severe issues going on in his life- terminally ill baby grandchild for one- however, I don’t see these things as an excuse.
Five days ago he went to the shops and came back acting weird. I had a bad cold and could not smell. I asked him, he lied, I said look, if you’ve been drinking I want you to leave. He walked out, got in the car, reversed into a large ceramic planter and smashed it, and left. I have no idea where he is because the reason he’s been with me is because his own apartment is being renovated- it’s not quite finished and has nothing in it.
On the day he did this, he had been getting ready to go on holiday the next day with me. I had to cancel it last minute.
For once, I'm not taking him back here, not going to find him and not going to help in any way. He has nothing with him except one bag.
It’s up to him now. His choice. My support has ended- nothing I have done has made a difference and I need to look after myself.
I’m very alone in this…. no close friends or family nearby. I’ve basically spent 5 days crying, and on the phone to Samaritans at 4am. It hurts. I’m devastated by it every single time. My mother thinks I should just see him when he’s sober- but that means being let down, upset, and going through this.
The fact is, whether he’s near me or not I’m still going to worry because you can’t switch off caring about someone….but I can say ‘not near me, and no I’m not just taking you back without change’.

Thank you @Penguinsandspaniels it's fitting that it ends up being my inheritance that gets used, my dad's answer to anything involving emotion was to chuck money at it & hope it went away!
I've wrapped my head round my early retirement being a pipe dream, it's not just selling the house to be honest, i dipped into other bits of the fund to fund his alcoholism when i didn't earn as well as i did now. My stupidity, they were the blind years when i thought everything would get better.

I realised something when i was wide awake gong over everything at 4 o'clock this morning. The calmest i've felt in ages was when he was really bad a few months back. As long as i delivered him a bottle of wine every 3 or 4 hours & a couple of sandwiches he stayed in bed for about 3 weeks. I loved those 3 weeks, i could go where i wanted when i wanted. I ate what i wanted, watched what i fancied on TV, the dogs were calm & settled & i slept whole nights waking up refreshed. I need to keep reminding myself it will be like that permanently once he's moved out.

@Fibblet well done for staying strong. There's nothing i can say that will make it any better, i know it hurts so so much, but hopefully that will lessen with time (i'm hoping that's what happens with me anyway)

Oh @Fibblet. You should have gone on holiday alone. To get out of the area and give you heard space

well done for asking him to go

you are a better woman than me having him stay while his place is being done - no way would I have ex dh anymore

I can just about cope him coming round if his eldest is over as he’s polite then

your oh won’t stop drinking and yes you have to look after yourself

is your mum a drinker - seems weird she would say stay when sober

means you are always on tenterhooks and can’t plan anything

really sorry no close friends about - what area are you in ? Maybe one of us is semi near

I’m in the north of Scotland…
No…. none of my family drink! Nobody.
I couldn’t go on holiday alone because I have a large caravan which takes two to deal with as there’s no motor mover. I would have done otherwise!
I just got a call from him, in a hotel, I calmly said this was his choice, I am now basing my actions on his choice and I am no longer going to be there for him but will base my future on what he chooses- so if this is it, I’m out. If I see something change and he is actively working at changing I will be there for him. I said do not contact me until you are sober and then we can talk.

will base my future on what he chooses

There were a number of occasions where I, explicitly or implicitly, took the same position with my alcoholic ex. At the time it seemed like a reasonable approach. In hindsight I'm not so sure because what it meant was that I was stuck in limbo having put my future plans in the hands of an alcoholic. That wasn't a wise choice for me.

Deep down I think what I was really saying is "I'm giving you yet another chance to show me that you love me enough to prioritise me over alcohol" and for my ex, at least, that was never going to happen.

Yes I see that… but I’m going to go ahead and make my plans and carry them out regardless.
I’m in the position where I personally know quite a few guys - around ten- who have stopped permanently, and are between 1 and 25 years sober, mostly at least ten years…. so by strengthening my boundaries, refusing to live together, becoming more independent and dropping my ‘rescue and forgive’ attitude I will then be stronger if it doesn’t work out- which I know, it probably won’t!

I have to agree with @HowardTJMoon that you are saying /giving dh another chance. You have moved your boundaries again and he will drink again.

but that is your decision and we will be here to support you now and for the next time. As there will be a next @Fibblet 🌸

It's 100% your choice, and you clearly love this man very much, @Fibblet . I hope you get the outcome you want.

Hope absolutely gets us all. It took me a few false starts to leave Ex for good (14 months now!!), maybe there just needed to be enough failures for me to be forced to put my future out of the hands of an alcoholic. I consider them my relapses actually.

I think I desperately wanted to believe that his relapses were circumstantial and eventually the conditions would be positive for him to stay sober. This would be the right rehab clinic, this would be the right anti anxiety med, medicating his ADHD would be it, seeing his children again would be it, better support worker, AA vs SMART, etc etc etc. I think I had to see it play out that every time, EVERY time, there would be yet another reason for relapse and likely always would be. If getting a cold meant low mood meant needed booze it was literally never going to be any different. The sheer evidence of constant relapse regardless had to outweigh the creeping hope.

So no hanging head, we have all done it. I began to congratulate myself for how quickly I nixed the hope each time - that was the win!

now the only thing that gets me every now and again is sadness - it horrifies me that he has lost everything and will never become who he was again. I’m fortunate though as we are no contact. I haven’t seen him in well over a year, spoken a handful of times a few months ago when flying monkeys dragged me back, and I don’t reply to any emails any more . So I don’t have any reason to hope because I don’t have to engage with his life at all.

I feel the same sadness at times. He has everything with me and a good life and a job a family who saw him.

now has nothing

Exactly this. He has spent so long telling me how its all down to his mental health that I've been thinking the same, if only he had more help, if only they changed his meds for some that worked etc. The scales are falling off my eyes now & I can see how this is just a reason for him to blame everyone else & not have to face up to his own failings in not seeking help or not engaging when it's offered.
It's still sad that he's chucked everything away for a drink, but I'm starting to feel resigned rather than desperate which I think is a step forward for me.

It’s a massive step forwards @Ebananascroogey. It’s when you begin to reach acceptance that this is it, life is only going to be a series of very short periods of sobriety followed by months and months (or years now in Ex’s case) of relapse and the chaos of ongoing active addiction.

I also really really believed that it was mental health and neurodivergence and horrible/ unsupportive Ex wife/ family/ friends/ my own failings. Now I recognise that this things all co-exist too, but what Ex fundamentally needs to fix himself is different coping mechanisms than the alcohol/ drugs and the resilience for the tough work of early weeks and months of sobriety. Ultimately, he would like not to be an alcoholic, but he likes doing the hard work of sobriety less. He wants someone else to fix him for him - meds, support, child contact, me/ his partner, his family etc. He doesn’t want anyone to exercise boundaries to protect their lives from the fallout of his addiction. What he wants should come first - and that is marriage/ partnership/ child contact to be his even if he is constantly under the influence.

He claims we (me, ex wife, family) made sobriety too high stakes. But I couldn’t cope with the ups and downs and sheer hell of active addiction periods anymore. He was absolutely vile in addiction - verbally abusive, emotionally abusive, erratic and intimidating. I couldn’t have my access to a calm and peaceful and normal life dependent on his ability to withstand cravings anymore. I chose me. As I tell myself when guilt creeps in: I was setting myself on fire to keep him warm while he kept spiralling ever downwards. Pointless!!

Well ex has done the usual thing. Got paid. Brought vodka. Posted woe is me on fb. A relative replied - I really can’t say what it is as so outing - but I was so pmsl at her reply as was friends who sent me the screenshot

@Nogoodusername reading that was like you were writing about my life. I'm sorry it's happening to you too, but it's so helpful to know that i am not being heartless & that it shouldn't be down to me to fix him when he won't do the work to help himself (& will also never see that he even should put some effort in).
It scares me to think he will get so much worse so quickly once he is living alone, but that's his choice & not my doing.

@Penguinsandspaniels sorry he's done it again. I am in awe of how matter of fact you sound about it now. I hope that's me one day!