Friend from my group keeps copying me and putting me down - sorry it is long!

[PippaRamadge]

I’ve been friends with a woman in a wider group setting for 10 years. We have a shared hobby - knitting if you must know 😆.
We have been in a WhatsApp group with 12 women since Covid. It’s a very active WhatsApp group and until recently we probably only met once a quarter or less in person despite talking every day on our phones.

One of them is quite negative but I thought nice enough to pass the time with in a pub whilst waiting for everyone else to arrive.
However I’ve been forced to become close to her by virtue of having a baby in the same academic year and living 2 streets away.
Mine born in the September and her baby born the following August.

Since then (and she has every right to) she has:

• Joined the local mum and baby group I set up.
• Started all of the same baby classes as me (and gone on about why they are better at the different time she does, compared to me/better for younger babies/better if you drive than go by foot/basically better if she does it)
• Taken up a plot on the allotment I’ve been on for 15 years (and said how and why her plot is better than mine)
• Put her daughter in the same nursery as my child, despite at first saying it was “grotty and working class” and then finding all the others nurseries full and having to “resort” to our nursery - where btw my child is very happy and thriving.
• Booked herself onto my other hobbies - hobbies she didn’t previously share.
• Booked herself in with my hairdresser, eyebrow woman and massage therapist.
• Bought loads of the stuff I have bought for our house.
• Applied for a job at my workplace - I would be her head of department.
• Said I shouldn’t be upset about being a victim of a crime and I was making our area look bad.

Other things:

• Slagged off my child’s hair - good luck doing your daughter’s hair when she’s 20 months and running around the house.
• Slagged off my child’s nursery clothes, nope I’m not giving her Organic Zoo clothes to spill ravioli or paint down.
• Slagged off nearly everyone in our mum and baby group.
• Slagged off my child for saying the shortened version of a word they have learned.
• Slagged off the positioning of my house on my road 🤯
• Told me that the days she’s going to return to work are “better thought out” than the days I work.
• Told people she “knows my dogs better” than me.
• Told people that I don’t in fact hold the degrees that I do. My education has no impact whatsoever on my working life, so her saying that doesn’t actually cause any issues it just makes me look like a liar and I JUST DON’T GET IT.

She is pivotal to my knitting group and I have some very close friends in that group but they have NO idea she is like this because they aren’t subjected to spending time with her ALL THE TIME.

All my peace and tiny bits of “me time” are either taken up with her being there or me feeling tense fearing she will turn up somewhere I am.

Now I don’t feel like I can do to my allotment because she’s always texting to comment on my fucking weeds, meaning she has let herself through a gate and into my plot for a look around.

I don’t want to leave these baby groups because 1. I set some of them up 2. I really enjoy them and so does my child. 3. They were pivotal in helping me deal with post natal anxiety and do the same for other women that I like to support.
But she fills me with an overwhelming sense of dread.

I’m absolutely exhausted by her constantly telling me why her and her child are better than me an my child. I’m having a rough time at work and with my wider family, which is causing depression so I’m probably letting this overwhelm me more than I would before I had a baby but truthfully I’m struggling.

This evening I took my child for one last go on the roundabout in the park close to our house. She turned up and proceeded to tell me I was wrong for getting on the roundabout with my child. Blah blah fucking blah.
Even if I don’t invite her around me she just shows up and tells me why I’m wrong.

This!

Why are you putting up with the rude comments in silence?
"Jane, it's really amusing the way you seem to want to copy me in everything, but it stops being amusing when you’re rude to me and tell lies about me. Please stop it."

Personally I would block her on my phone and just blank her
She's bat shit
I predict she will cause a shit load of trouble for you before this ends
People like her always do
Fingers crossed she doesn't get a job at your place of work
This thread is highly identifying..I hope you changed plenty of details

I wouldn't criticise other people, but otherwise, Yes this is a good approach

💯 that woman is not your friend and not trying to hide it. Whether or not she wants to Wendy you out of your own group, or she is a stalker or just a common or garden frenemy is irrelevant. You need to respond in kind.

You need to grow a backbone.
“Sandra, I didn’t ask for your opinion and if you are just going to criticise everything I do or have done, I’d rather not have anything to do with you.”

This is a very good technique for dealing with people like her.

Answer everything she says with a question: but be very direct ( borderline insulting), she'll get a shock and go on the defensive - but it'll mean you're taking back control.

Why are you so obsessed with my garden plot, if you see weeds in it , you pick them up.

Why are you always commenting on my child in a negative way - you have enough to be dealing with your own child.

Why are you always so negative, I find it exhausting?

Why are you always calling to my house unannounced, its rude, I am very busy, I'll let you know when I am available?

Why are you so obsessed with everything I do?

Why do you always feel the need to comment in a passive aggressive way?

Why are you applying to the same company as me, are you obsessed with me, it feels a bit like you're stalking me?

Stop being a walkover, she is actually jealous of you, but gets a kick in putting you down and keeping you in your place. She is a nasty piece of work, you need to put her in her place and give her a wide berth going forward, let her do what ever she wants but not around you, she sounds like a deeply unhappy person.

Attack is the best form of defence!

As I just said on the other thread about women in a group / bullying
It just takes one or more of the other women to tell the aggressor to cut it out and quit the shit behaviour or leave the group
But everyone wants a quiet life and no one wants to get involved
In my book that's not great friendships
Friends stand up for each other ,they don't turn a blind eye to bullying of someone they care about

I agree with this.

Op you are going to have to stand up for yourself, because it's clear none of the group are .
Next time
Say ... Enough.. firmly and loudly and walk away .
Don't give her time to talk to you ,walk of ..she's not your friend

If ever a scenario merited grey rock this is it.

Hi OP, I feel your pain. I’ve become something of an “expert” at dealing with these types of people over the years.
My mother is one, over the years a few friends turned out to be like this (after reeling me in) and more than one boyfriend too.
I'm guessing you have my personality type - genuine, kind, polite, passive, people-pleasery?
The only thing that works on these people is boundaries.
The minute you stop with the passivity and start calling them out on stuff, stop being so agreeable, stop sharing so much, they will drop you and move on to the next victim.
You are helping her to fill a deep void inside herself where she don’t know who she really is or what she reality likes. I’m armchair diagnosing (from your description of her) that she has a personality disorder such as narcissism.
She has latched on to you because she wants to be seen like she perceives you to be.
It follows a pattern and she will eventually get bored and move on to the next bright shiny new person/hobby.
I hate to say it because it’s obvious yet hard to accept: people will only treat us how we let them.
Im now in my forties and have reformed my people-pleasing ways after a lot of hard internal work and inner child healing.
My boundaries are iron clad and if a so-called friend started telling me how shit everything I do is (whilst simultaneously copying it) I would completely disengage.
She is not your friend.
If she still didn’t get the message I’d be willing to be hated and tell her that our “friendship” isn’t working for me any more.
You really need to stop being passive or nothing will ever change.
And yes it’s likely after that she’ll smear your name to anyone who’s willing to listen in the knitting group, but it’s a chance you’ll have to take if you want to regain your peace. If they are nice ladies they won’t listen to her as they’ll know what you’re really about.

Shes one of those people you have to call out very firmly as they are oblivious to how much of a cunt they are being. Any copying of stuff I'd call out straight away and directly as 'why have you bought the same as me'. Any mention of my allotment weeds would be a firm 'its none of your business what i do on my allotment, thats my private space and I dont appreciate your comments ' Basically you have to tell her to fuck off as people like this are very thick skinned. I'd also back away from having her in your life so much. Be distant at joint gatherings and dont answer messages.

Oh and if you have any power at all to stop the recruitment at your workplace I would as it sounds as if she could stray into single white female territory

She is doing this to you because she knows it upsets you and that you don't feel you can respond.

I would firstly block her on everything possible, mute her where you can.

Talk to friends and tell them what's going on. You don't need to slag her off, but do share what's happening. You have no reason to protect her, but you want to be careful because she could be trying to strategise you out of your groups and take them over.

Then when she speaks to you, adopt a very formal tone - as if you actually are her manager (and I really hope you are able to veto her job application - what a nightmare!) When she says something nasty, give her some silence then ask her to repeat what she just said. If she actually does, give her a bit more silence, then say, hmm, that's what I thought you said. Don't give her any other reaction.

What is she like with others, and what's she like when others are around you? If she's very different, you can use this to your advantage. E.g. she praises someone else's choice in front of you, and you say, 'oh that's funny, weren't you just saying you though that X was crap? What's made you change your mind?' She might be too smart to leave herself open to that, so don't depend on it as a strategy.

The other option is to abandon all your existing groups and hobbies, which I think would be a big loss. Trust that others will come to see what she's like, if they haven't already. It might take a little while, but she'll find a new victim when she realises she can't win against you.

This woman is not your friend. Why she is behaving like this towards you is up for debate. The issue is that she is undermining you and your child; she is salting the earth of your daily life. You don't need to accept it.

I would suggest you take a far firmer approach. In your own words of course, but with eye contact and a strong voice, tell her that you do not appreciate her rude, negative comments, that she is absolutely out of order to criticise your child (How dare she!), that your choices are none of her business, that you have had quite enough of her intruding into your life, and to cease spreading falsehoods about your educational qualifications.

Rinse and repeat every time - clear, strong, serious. Avoid her at all times.

I’m listening to a podcast episode at the moment to do with envy which is good, it’s Conversations with Annalisa Barbieri if you’re interested.

I think I would be tempted to say to her: "Look, I just wanted to ask - I've noticed that you are really negative about everything - is everything ok? It's just that it's really noticeable how negative you are." If she's got an ounce of self-awareness then she might stop and think. And if she doesn't... well then I guess I'd follow up with "Ah, well you might not be aware of how you come across then".

Are you just passively going along with this? Because you must realise it won't stop and will get worse if you are. What did she say when you asked her why she has told people you lied about your degree? Be aware as well that shes probably saying a lot more bullshit stuff about you that just hasn't got back to you yet

Firstly stop telling her so much about your life. If she didn't know who your hairdresser is, that you have an allotment, what classes you go to etc then she might not be at the same ones. If she was it would be a coincidence.

Haha, I'm sorry but the whole thing made me chuckle. It must be unbelievably annoying though! I have a friend I see a lot who is a tiny bit like this sometimes and even to that degree, it grates badly.

I loved PP's idea of psyching her into getting and doing absurd things that you then don't do. 😆 Failing that, as she is so incredibly blatant, I would think of a calm response to deliver with a glint in your eye - "Oh wow, you don't like something I'm doing/have got? That's new!". Rinse and repeat.

You need to start saying something.
Every time she says something you could ask her why she's so critical. Maybe say are you aware that you criticise everything about me? What's that about?

Or you could start agreeing with her that she's better than you.

Or you could stop interacting with her.

You dont actually have to socialise with her.

You need to fall out with her really. Tell her she’s rude and you don’t want to hear it.

You need to tell her to fuck off. Or every time she slags you give her the thumb down slowly. Slagging your wee girl? I'd bite the bitches head off. Send her a lawyers letter asking her to desist slandering your qualifications and reputation. Don't put up with this shit. Tell her nothing. Don't allow her in your home. I'm in my 50s now and i wish i could go back and tell my younger self to take no shit from anyone ever. She is fucking with your life as she is distressing you. Be strong and end it now. ❤️

I don’t think you should just rise above it, I think the next time she says something you should say ‘OK, that’s enough, I don’t know if you’ve noticed but you’re very critical of me and my choices, I don’t need to hear it anymore. This isn’t a competition and even if you don’t mean to be critical, that’s how it’s making me feels so you either stop or we stop being friends’

What a b**ch