Friend from my group keeps copying me and putting me down - sorry it is long!

[PippaRamadge]

I’ve been friends with a woman in a wider group setting for 10 years. We have a shared hobby - knitting if you must know 😆.
We have been in a WhatsApp group with 12 women since Covid. It’s a very active WhatsApp group and until recently we probably only met once a quarter or less in person despite talking every day on our phones.

One of them is quite negative but I thought nice enough to pass the time with in a pub whilst waiting for everyone else to arrive.
However I’ve been forced to become close to her by virtue of having a baby in the same academic year and living 2 streets away.
Mine born in the September and her baby born the following August.

Since then (and she has every right to) she has:

• Joined the local mum and baby group I set up.
• Started all of the same baby classes as me (and gone on about why they are better at the different time she does, compared to me/better for younger babies/better if you drive than go by foot/basically better if she does it)
• Taken up a plot on the allotment I’ve been on for 15 years (and said how and why her plot is better than mine)
• Put her daughter in the same nursery as my child, despite at first saying it was “grotty and working class” and then finding all the others nurseries full and having to “resort” to our nursery - where btw my child is very happy and thriving.
• Booked herself onto my other hobbies - hobbies she didn’t previously share.
• Booked herself in with my hairdresser, eyebrow woman and massage therapist.
• Bought loads of the stuff I have bought for our house.
• Applied for a job at my workplace - I would be her head of department.
• Said I shouldn’t be upset about being a victim of a crime and I was making our area look bad.

Other things:

• Slagged off my child’s hair - good luck doing your daughter’s hair when she’s 20 months and running around the house.
• Slagged off my child’s nursery clothes, nope I’m not giving her Organic Zoo clothes to spill ravioli or paint down.
• Slagged off nearly everyone in our mum and baby group.
• Slagged off my child for saying the shortened version of a word they have learned.
• Slagged off the positioning of my house on my road 🤯
• Told me that the days she’s going to return to work are “better thought out” than the days I work.
• Told people she “knows my dogs better” than me.
• Told people that I don’t in fact hold the degrees that I do. My education has no impact whatsoever on my working life, so her saying that doesn’t actually cause any issues it just makes me look like a liar and I JUST DON’T GET IT.

She is pivotal to my knitting group and I have some very close friends in that group but they have NO idea she is like this because they aren’t subjected to spending time with her ALL THE TIME.

All my peace and tiny bits of “me time” are either taken up with her being there or me feeling tense fearing she will turn up somewhere I am.

Now I don’t feel like I can do to my allotment because she’s always texting to comment on my fucking weeds, meaning she has let herself through a gate and into my plot for a look around.

I don’t want to leave these baby groups because 1. I set some of them up 2. I really enjoy them and so does my child. 3. They were pivotal in helping me deal with post natal anxiety and do the same for other women that I like to support.
But she fills me with an overwhelming sense of dread.

I’m absolutely exhausted by her constantly telling me why her and her child are better than me an my child. I’m having a rough time at work and with my wider family, which is causing depression so I’m probably letting this overwhelm me more than I would before I had a baby but truthfully I’m struggling.

This evening I took my child for one last go on the roundabout in the park close to our house. She turned up and proceeded to tell me I was wrong for getting on the roundabout with my child. Blah blah fucking blah.
Even if I don’t invite her around me she just shows up and tells me why I’m wrong.

It's jealousy.
She sounds like a stalker too.
I'd show her this thread.

With good reason!

I'd stop worrying about being polite, because she doesn't! I'd probably either ignore her rude comments entirely or contradict her every time, whichever you think will have a better effect on her. If she likes to argue, then having a few bland responses or pretending not to hear her might be best. If she'll be annoyed that you dare defend yourself, don't let her get away with anything from now on without pointing out how rude or incorrect she is. Either way, I'd stop any politeness or pretense of friendliness with this miserable woman. She's not a friend. You don't have to be friendly.

How weird. I feel for her dc. Imagine having her as a mother.

With the work thing I'd be telling your boss HR or both that she's stalking you and lying about you.

All the rest I'd probably laugh in her face and avoid as much as possible. She really sounds nuts. Has anyone else heard her? If you're in company repeat what she says loudly. Like " So you're saying my dd's hair is awful? Why would you say that Jane?"

Bloody hell, just match that energy and call her out on it! Every single time, and she'll get it through her negative brain that you won't tolerate it. There's not much else you can do, she's not your friend and who cares if your kids are potentially in same class going forward, you don't have to tolerate her rudeness!

Gosh that very negative

you’re always so negative

your negativity is very draining

your negativity is all consuming are you every anything but negative

How did she show up at the park randomly while you were there? Is it possible she's stalking you?

The thing with telling people that you are lying about your qualifications, I would call her out on that. Even though you don't need those degrees for your job, it could still harm your reputation if people believe you are lying about your qualifications. It's not ok for her to do that.

She sounds awful.

This woman sounds like she’s stuck to you like glue, OP. Fixated on so many aspects of your life.
It sounds hard as she’s there all the time.

I remember years ago having a work colleague who copied my outfits which they would have had to go to the store to get it (before online shopping was so widespread). She copied my haircut, my mannerisms, pretended to look to buy a house instead of saying a simple congratulations when I shared that DH and I had purchased one (she said something negative about it). The supposed friendship finally ended when we were in different work areas.

Hopefully your friend gets a clue and steps back or moves away, OP. It sounds as though she is quite intense.

There's nothing to be lost here by losing your shit a little and letting her know what a twat you think she is.

A big sigh, a big eye roll, and say something harsh and dismissive enough to make your irritation clear without causing WW3.

'Whatever! I really don't care.'
Long pause. 'Oh my god, you're actually being serious. Fuck me!'
'You never let up do you?'
'Wow, that's really mean - luckily I don't give a shit what other people think.'

Why did you tell her the hairdresser you use? The eyebrow lady? Etc?

I wouldn’t entertain her at all. Just ignore. She seems unhinged and I’d avoid at all costs.

And she sounds like a bunny boiler 😦

This must be draining and exhausting!
Limit what you share with her.
Create distance wherever you can,avoid one to one if possible.
Spot the root cause ,likely the copying is deep insecurity and admiration ,the criticism is likely to make her feel superior .

If you will be her head of dept, just weed her cv out, as you would interview her. Tell hr or your boss you know her personally and she is not a team player. Cite her disruption over your degree.

Block her from all your social media. Except the knitting.

Before blocking her, send a group message to everyone stating someone has been spreading slanderous lies about you, questioning your education snd degree. Say your professionl career and qualification are real, and you have been advised to take legal action..

You seem quite senior. Dont you have a steely glare to hand? Id be very blunt myself, interupting ' stop saying these things please, youre fucking with my karma' or ' stop moaning! All my friends tell me im lovely so leave me alone!

I had one of these once. It was awful. My dm intervened one day- icy polite and very clear. It was such a relief.

Tell the allotment police someone keeps going on your plot.

I think that you can probably reclaim your hair/nails etc lady fairly easily by choosing another salon and sending a message in the WhatsApp asking whether anyone has tried it because a friend has recommended it but you’re a bit unsure. And then post a picture of your new hair/nails and say you do like it aft all. Quietly return to the old hairdresser.

I’d also choose your favourite baby group, don’t go for a couple of weeks and tell her that your baby is a bit too mature for the group now so you’ve stopped going. Wait for her to announce that she’s stopping going and then return very quietly.

Absolutely don’t consider employing her!!!

This is classic covert narcissistic behaviour. Grey rock her gradually and find techniques to gently push back on her when she does push your buttons too hard. Lots of useful advice out there. Dr Ramani is a good start. Its exhausting; I’ve had friends like this and its incredibly hard work.

My DM had a "friend" like this. She used to ask what I was getting for my birthday then buy it for her DD first (until my DM worked out what was happening). She used to love it when her DD was better than me at most things - we were in the same class from 5-18. When I started doing better she hated it and her DD started bullying me (presumably because her DM was angry that she could no longer boast to my DM) - so keep an eye on the children's relationship as time goes on. We were in a small village, so it was hard to avoid them.

I live with tweens. Sometimes when they go low....you go lower.

Clair: "OP, your kids hair looks rubbish"
OP "Your hair looks rubbish Clair"
Clair "your allotment is a mess"
OP "your a fucking mess Clair"
Clair "your kids are dressed poorly, OP"
OP "you look like shit and all your clothes are shit, Clair"

Tell her you're joining a swingers club and getting a new 11 thousand pound kitchen.

Shame you aren't in Scotland.

'aye, right' would be perfect here.

But honestly you wouldn't be unreasonable to bite back at least a bit.

'yeah, so you've said'
'you're entitled to your opinion'
'gosh, what an interesting take'
'comparison is the thief of joy'
'it's really sweet that you care so much about how I can improve my life, but I really love x. It suits me way better than x would'
'each to their own'
'you are so cute, thinking everyone would want the same as you'
'I hear you, but I don't care much for x'
'Life would be dull if we all lived it the same way/wanted the same things'
'oh, you think?'

And start mentioning things that happened when youn were studying (name specific qualification)

I'd just pipe up with "well that's rude" every time she spoke. She'll soon get the message.

I’ve got to say if the shortened word is ‘ta’ I hate that! Just say thank you

Hi @PippaRamadge , I'm sorry you're struggling right now. Life can be very demanding and difficult sometimes.

This woman really does sound like a LOT!

As PP have said, her comments could stem from insecurity or jealousy.

You are obviously quite successful (good job) and come across as confident - not everyone would be able to set up a mum and baby group, for example.

You enjoy a range of hobbies, you choose nice things for your home, and you look after your appearance.
And you are well educated.

She maybe lacks confidence in herself and her taste, so finds it easier to copy someone whose tastes she admires. But she can't say that, because that would expose her insecurities.

Or she could just be a not very nice person!

Either way you need to find a way of dealing with her.

I do think PP have come up with some great suggestions for shutting her down.
Tempting though it is to just tell her to fuck off, I would try some of the others out first, see which one works best, and just keep repeating it.
eg 'You might think that (getting on the roundabout with your child) but I don't agree'.

Avoid her as much as you can at the groups and activities you both go to, and don't tell her about any new ones you join!

It is important that you clear up her lies about your qualifications, because that is making YOU out to be dishonest and untrustworthy.
Who has she said this to, and is there any proof of it? How did you find out she said it?

That is the kind of thing you could say to HR at your company, because it shows HER up as being a liar/shitstirrer, and no company wants to employ someone like that.
I wouldn't go in to details about the other Single White Female stuff as it's not so relevant to how she might do her job.

The other thing you can work on is how you think about her and what she says.
You don't value her opinion at all, so just discount it in your head. 'I don't care about her opinion so I'm going to ignore it and move on with my day'.
Maybe have a brief mantra to repeat to yourself : 'Discount. Ignore. Move on'.
DIM for short!

I hope some of the advice given in the thread is helpful, and/or she gets bored and moves on to another victim!

💐

“This evening I took my child for one last go on the roundabout in the park close to our house. She turned up and proceeded to tell me I was wrong for getting on the roundabout with my child.”

How did she know you were there? She sounds creepy .

But if someone was bagging my child their hair and clothes etc I would not be being as passive as you are - tell her to pull her head in and don’t mention your child again!!!

it sounds like your children are still too young to have started school- I might e wrong- but when school applications become a thing, please DONT tell her where your actually want to send your child. Keep it quiet and maybe mention some schools you’re definitely not considering. And only confirm what choices you made if you have to, AFTER the deadline or after you’ve actually been given the school place.
your situation sounds dreadful but I’d struggle to confront her or be rude considering there are shared activities. And it’s hard to avoid sharing if you’re in a group setting and someone else asks you where you do your hair etc; you could just be a bit vague and say you’ll text them later? I’d struggle being confrontational or rude to her but I’d be inclined to speak to some of the others in the group in confidence so they know what’s going on and support you. In case you missed the post about her applying for a job at your workplace and you’d manage her; speak to HR and give them the heads up about the drama and they’ll be unlikely to hire her.