What do women who want a family do now we all think men are useless?

[ClawsandEffect]

It's OK for me to think 'fuck 'em'. I'm old. Been there. Done that. Had the family and the divorce.

BUT if you're heterosexual AND want a family but realise that most men (#notallmen) are not viable options, what DO you do/plan to do?

Genuinely interested.

I’m the first to say there are a lot of awful men out there, but tbh, if I thought like you do, I wouldn’t have children because what if you have a son?

The answer is to not settle for a shit man. If you don’t find a good one, don’t have children. I’m not in favour of sperm/egg donation or surrogacy so I certainly wouldn’t like to see more going down that route.

I don’t think all men are shit but I do think most women get a raw deal out of relationships. Some women are horrible. Some men are fabulous.

Getting back to OPs actual point though, I have two GEN Z DC and from their experiences and those of their slightly older friends, there is a lot of egg freezing going on.

Also a fair amount of gay male best friend providing sperm and being an active and engaged father.

It would be disingenuous to pretend there aren’t women having children with men who earn well but aren’t considered marriage material. These men are often very good fathers.

The nuclear/ideal family set up is not going to survive in its previous format for much longer. It has slowly evolved over the years.

Single mother as a term is almost meaningless at the moment - it can mean anything from partner works away to literally doing it all alone. They have varying levels of contact with their father and very different levels of income and therefore education.

If you start from that position, you've got your answer. But I don't agree with the initial premise, most men are not like that, you hear a lot of it on here because this is where women come to bitch about the bad ones. Many women and men have a happy married life, not all roses obviously.

I can tell you that I'm 0% open to physical relationships with women.

Ok, I'll ask the question a different way.

How do you explain boys born to single mothers who have absolutely no contact with their father or a step-father, being misogynistic?

And 'single mother' has never meant 'partner works away'.

Isn't it the opposite of what INCELS say? Their point is that women don't pick them and it's not fair. They believe they have a right to have the women as they are viable options.

This point is that historically men have not pulled their weight with childrearing and family work, or behaviour for that matter, and as society has changed and women have increasingly gone out to work, there has not bee sufficient rebalance of attitude or activity.

Tell that to the mum's at a friend's kids' private school!

I have never met a man who is the product of a single mum who is openly and obviously misogynist because they had a single mother. I know plenty of men who grew up on estates with little money and education who find that lazy way of thinking appealing though. Boris Johnson had a dad in the picture so it's clearly not about the mum.

Most incels think that modern women have been ruined by feminism and that's why they don't get picked. They only want the virgin, tradwives, who also somehow contribute 50/50 financially. It's one of their main gripes.

Have we really cancelled all men? Fecking hell- we women aren’t a walk in the park either, and much as myself aren’t in a good place now, he’s helped me through some bad shit in the past and not judged me on how crazy I was at times.

Exactly

I'm now 57, married age 32, after waiting to find a good man who wanted a family. We married after 5 years together & had our first child 3 years later.
He turned out to be abusive (only really started after 2nd child arrived by which time I had 2 under 3 & was physically disabled myself as a result of birth injury)
I eventually divorced him (should have done it much sooner). Both my kids are Autistic & have quite pronounced needs still as young adults. I am their Carer.
Ex H is not available for either routine or emergency cover (never has been). Some maintenance is paid but nowhere near 50% of costs & I am on benefits.

My eldest is a boy. My younger one is a girl (but thinks she 'may be trans').
The world is totally mysogenistic. I fear for their future in an increasingly polarised world full of AI rubbish & division. Many men are good people (I just didn't find one) but it is certainly true that there is no societal payment for behaving badly as a man (in many ways it is encouraged) the way there is for a female (I wonder if that is why my Dd wants to be a boy) I am enormously proud of my son who is gentle, kind, intelligent & sensitive. All very 'manly' imo.

I have never met a man who is the product of a single mum who is openly and obviously misogynist because they had a single mother.

I don't think you're following the conversation properly between a PP and I.

None of us have said men are openly and obviously misogynist because they had a single mother?

How wonderful for the children

I agree that there are loads of terrible men out there; but OP was saying all/most of them.

It's a rookie mistake in analysing statistics to think that 'most X are men' = 'most men are X'. Just like most scammers who target British people by phone are Indian, but that most certainly does not mean that most/all Indian people are lying scammers.

Surely we can focus on and criticise/reject the bad members of any particular large basic biological demographic without lazily assuming that millions and millions of people who share one basic bio characteristic are all the same?

Not me, I'm afraid. My best friendships have always been with women but I only fancy men. Mr Kinsey doesn't get to tell me what my sexual preferences are!

No, 'we' haven't done anything.

There just seems to be a hardcore group of MNetters who insist that all women think and feel the same, and that all men think and act the same.

Leave that group aside, and you'll find MN still has intelligent women who have their own independent thoughts, feelings and opinions thank goodness.

Jesus Christ, another man hating thread. Get a life will you.

All men aren't useless but some are; all women aren't amazing but some are; one person's meat is another person's poison; you'll find good friends and real partners regardless of your sexual orientation if you back yourself, work out what your standards are, and stick to them.

This.

I can't comment on the scientific 'findings' leading to that particular claim, although common sense and the experiences of women across the world would beg to differ - but personally, I wouldn't entertain for a second automatically believing any statistics or methods that came from that evil man or which bear his name or legacy.

This is the same man who sexually abused tiny children and then documented his 'findings' as to what he claimed were somehow their signs of 'sexual response' - when they screamed in terror at his abuse.

What a disgusting comment. Plenty of boys raised by single mothers grow up to be good men.

Be far more discerning.

This is such a lot of nonsense. There are many wonderful men out there just as there are a huge number of dreadful women I wouldn’t want my sons to go anywhere near

Awful post. Maybe take a look in the mirror and I am sure you will find plenty of faults - this thread being one of them.