DS back from 4 years at Uni - advice needed

[JenW84391]

My 22 yr old has returned from
Uni, we live pretty rurally and he does not drive so I am on hand whenever he needs to be anywhere etc, we feed him, keep him alive etc and financially support him around £200pm, anyway just lately he has become quietly horrible to me and my hubby, if we enter a room when he is in there it’s like we are in “his” home, I feel uncomfortable in my own home, this eve he came to speak to us to ask us to stop giving him any advice and to tell us his situation here at home is far from ideal! That going from his room into our “spare”room, now his office space is not fulfilling him, he has a little cleaning job which gives him some spends but feels it’s beneath him, he has become a real snob since uni, and I don’t recognise my own child, today I decided perhaps to suggest he move bk to his uni town and help him financially to set himself up?? (I haven’t spoken to him yet) He isn’t happy here and we are feeling really uncomfortable in our own space, it’s the exact path his elder brother took and I’m not sure I can go through those feelings again?? He has become an A**hole and I don’t know what to do??
pls don’t suggest kick him out etc it’s not helpful and it’s not something us as parents would choose to do, but we do need advice from anyone who has experienced this behaviour? To add, we have been very accepting of the behaviour during his settling back home period, understanding he has left his own space to go back home to Mummy & Daddy but he is becoming quietly cruel now ffs it’s so hard!! And so sad seeing my lovely child be one and ogre

I am sure the OP knows how to use AI herself!

Hello - my friends was in a similar situation when her daughter moved back home from university in May….. first there was the adjustment of her leaving to go to uni; and now there’s the adjustment of her returning home with a different outtake on life / arsehole mood because they’ve had to be more independent when living away from home… my friends daughter asks her mum not to interfere or asks questions about her life; or texting her when she’s out etc, then flips it around (when it suits) and asks her mum why she’s not interested in what she’s doing?! It’s like my friend can’t win no matter what she does!
If you’re unable to speak to your son, have a conversation with your husband and write your son a letter outlining your thoughts etc… this way he will have read it and he can then come back to you when he’s ready. Ultimately you have to do what’s right for you and your husband….

NRTFT but when DD2 came home after uni with no graduate job lined up, we gave her a few days to settle back in and then over lunch had a family meeting. We said how lovely it was to have her here with us, but as she had been used to doing her own thing, we wanted to have some house rules so we all knew where we stood.

We started with the positive: she didn't have to pay any rent as long as she was applying for jobs and working p/t in the local cafe. She can drive and has use of a car, so could get herself to and from work, but if it fitted around our work plans, we were happy to drop her off or collect her. However, she would need to take some responsibility for house chores e.g. putting a wash on then hanging it out, getting my dad's newspaper in the morning, sorting dinner occasionally. When she had interviews, we would help to get her to the mainline train station as we also live rurally.

It worked really well. Everyone knew where they stood. She was a great help with my dad and he loved having her around. She saved her earnings from the cafe so had a mini nest egg when she moved out a couple of months later. She is a keen baker so it was lovely coming home from work to another bake (and she also cleans up after herself!) She's been gone almost a year and I really miss her!

He needs to apply here
It also pays his National Insurance contributions towards his state pension & other benefits if he is not working FT

https://www.gov.uk/universal-credit

Talk to him and ask him what he wants to do and break down how to get there into steps. It sounds like he is struggling to adjust as much as you all are.

Behaviour is always just the tip of an huge iceberg and teaching our children/young adults how to deal with difficulty times is all part of parenting in my view.

Very few people are inherently bad they just need the right support to help them get back in balance and move forward with life.

He is going though grieving the loss of his own life where he had freedom and may well feel like a failure moving back home. He is obviously not happy. I would calmly try and ask him does he miss living where he lived. Also if he is applying for jobs and he is not getting any interviews or jobs this will have knocked his confidence. Maybe say you are proud he is applying but you know people that told you they had the same issue. If he starts to relax maybe offer to go through his CV with him and see if it can be improved. Also encourage him to write a cover letter
saying Desr Sir/Madam, thank you for taking the time to read my CV. My name is …….. and I have completed….. and I am passionate about. (Not saying you should do this straight away. Baby steps and love is what is needed.

For your own well being put up boundaries and maybe if he starts to be abusive say son while we love you please do not speak to me/us like this and remove yourself from the situation. Try and do things for you as well and be kind to yourself. ADHD is tough on everyone involved.

You're coming across as slightly over-defensive of him here, OP. I completely understand he’s facing a contracting job market and there’s disappointment around having to return home, but the bottom line is that he is being rude and making you feel unwelcome in your own house.

Applying for permanent jobs isn't enough, he also needs to also be applying for temp/part time/volunteer roles to tide him over (and learning to drive) until he gets a permanent job. They will give him an income and extra skills to make him more competitive in his job hunt, and stop him from spending so much time around the house being moody.

If you re read your OP without the emotions you've been experiencing and without the tone and attitude he's presumably been giving, you can probably sympathize. His situation is far from ideal. He'd imagined himself with a job that he wanted, living his best life. Getting advice from your parents is annoying when you're 22 and think you know it all. However much you do for him, and however amazing you are, he will still probably feel like this.

I've had 2 DC move back home. DC1 found it incredibly hard as she took job rejections so personally. I supported her a lot. DC2 was more prepared for the knock backs and lives life fairly positively.

Advice for you would be to stop trying to fix things for him. You are not responsible for his happiness. Take that burden off your shoulders .
You could start to require him to either pay for his keep or pay for his medication. I'm sure he could afford it from his wages. It will actually make him feel less like a child.

I think often on MN there is a lack of realism about how common it is for adult children to live at home. In the Uk, according to the Institute of Fiscal Studies (they don’t play 😂) ‘at age 25, around 49% of men and 38% of women live with their parents’, and recent studies by Natwest suggest that the average age to leave permanently is 28. It may well be higher than average among graduates, among those with any medical issues, and of course in areas with very high cost of housing.

So I think it’s important for DS and you to know that’s it normal, it’s very normal. That doesn’t make it easier to iron out any issues though so I really sympathise. I wish I had more practical advice but I think your idea sounds good and I also think that the relationship and his attitudes will improve with time. He hasn’t really turned into an ogre, just acting like one for a bit!

Use this

https://www.gov.uk/get-a-ppc

If he signs on or applies for UC (to top his job up) he will likely get free prescriptions. If its not NHS Prescription medication why not etc he needs to try and sort that.

At the moment he gets free everything household wise, money towards medication and has a job for pin money.

None of this gives him the right to expect a bedroom or facilites at home or make his parents "suffer" because he is cross about his own inadequacies. Stop being doormats and sit down and have a discussion, he wants to be a grown up treat him like one and when he starts to kick off you tell him its not acceptable and he is not the one in charge here.

His priorities should be finding a better job and learning to drive (assuming tthat is possible given undisclosed medical condition requiring 200 quids worth of medicine a month)

What you do with money etc is your business but for me a clear boundary is that I will not be insulted or abused in my own home. I set that expectation with my kids and we stick to it. I’m not rude to them either.

I think in your case if he’s starting a Masters soon I would sit him down and just discuss your ground rules around being polite and behaving appropriately in the house. Stress that you’re not his housemate, this is your home which you have worked for and if he wants to share it he has to be respectful. If he finds you and your DH annoying then he needs to work out ways to live which don’t involve losing his temper or making life miserable- e.g could he set his room up more like a bedsit with TV and kettle so he can relax there? Could he find a social space outside the home. So not kicking him out but just establishing some good boundaries.

Sympathies, it is hard! I can remember how cut adrift I felt at a similar age even just coming home for the holidays from Uni! It wasn't that I didn't love my parents, but I was used to doing my own thing without a barage of questions and cooking/eating when I wanted etc, plus I missed my friends so much.

My dd has recently moved home after 3 years at uni followed by a year living abroad. She has been pretty busy and away quite a bit, she started her Masters today and is living with us until next September.

We have had a few flash points but we have settled down now, we live in an area with great public transport so we don't have the issues around that (which I would say is probably the worst thing for your ds, feeling stranded and not able to go anywhere without asking for a lift must be awful!) You say you haven't always lived rurally, so have you moved since he was at home? If so he presumably doesn't have any local friends, which could be making him feel very isolated.

When we do have an issue I try and put myself in her shoes, and also remind myself that this is likely the last period of time we will all live together and so try and make it as enjoyable as possible rather than feeling resentful. I also remind myself that it is her home as well as ours, despite it being pretty much just us for the last 4 years. I know I would have hated moving back home after uni and this generation really don't have it easy in that respect, we could get housing benefit and sign on if we couldn't get a job, so we really didn't have to move home. Anyone who did was thought of as a bit odd (rather unfairly, but that's how it was).

So I have cut her some slack, but also had conversations about food (we get food she can cook for herself as we don't know when she will be in/out and I hate food waste, but we have agreed we will all eat together if we are in the house) and tidiness (she is much better in this respect since living abroad). We are financing her as her Masters is very much full time contact hours + many evenings, but in return she is doing some work for DH helping with his business.

DD is lucky in that she has the top floor of our house so has a bedroom, a sitting room/office and a bathroom to herself, so she can choose to keep herself to herself and can have friends over without us all being on top of each other. Would there be any way you could carve out some living space for DS so he has his own space, it's not for ever!

Would it be possible for him to get a moped/scooter to get around on, you can drive those on a learner's permit after an introductory test I think. Or even an E bike depending on quite how rural you are.

If he's got his own old bedroom plus your "spare" room which is now his office space, there's no need for him to make you uncomfortable in the common areas of your house. When he comes into a room and performs, or is rude to you, tell him to go away until he can be civil. This isn't unreasonable or a hardship for him; two rooms is plenty and if he needs to use the other areas of the house he is quite free to behave cordially or at least neutrally during the time he's sharing space.

Sure, it's normal for a young adult to live with his parents if he can't afford to live elsewhere, but it's also pretty normal for people to do the bare minimum to get along for the sake of the household. If he were in a share house or a dorm his housemates or roommate wouldn't be putting up with endless humphing, snarking, and arseholery while contributing far more than he does, so get him prepared to deal with that reality in case he ever does have a chance to live away.

I've never known a time when things were so hard for new graduates. What he really needs is a nice job, I don't think people know how hard it is for young people to find work these days, especially if you don't live in a town.

He maybe feeling stuck and without much hope for the future at the moment. I know my DS (a bit older) is incredibly touchy when he is unhappy, and sometimes takes any helpful advice we try to give as a criticism. It's hard to break through that wall they sometimes put round themselves, of course part of that is pride mixed with some fear of finally having to go out into the big wide world. He could be projecting the negative feelings he has about himself onto you.

I hope you can convince him that you aren't being critical of him, you just want to help, in whatever way he thinks will be best - if he wants help fine, if he wants to be left alone, also fine, but that you do expect to be treated respectfully by him in your own home.

You need a chat, tears may be involved but you'll all feel better afterwards.

it’s the exact path his elder brother took and I’m not sure I can go through those feelings again

What was the outcome of his brother?

Did you encourage him to move out and are helping with funding him in any way.

If so maybe your DS wants you to suggest that he also moves out and you pay a brunt towards his living expenses.

The work he is looking for ... it is not full time career orientated work if he is going to start a masters in Oct? So come October he will be busy and focused and doing something purposeful? My youngest has been home for a couple of years and is going back to Uni this month. They do not get a free ride, but after a disastrous job situation that left them with poor physical and mental health in the middle of a relative dying, we have given them space to sort themselves out. We have helped support them financially and in return they have to clean and tidy and cook.

However, at no point would I accept rudeness or cruel behaviour from someone I was housing, funding and supporting. I do think OP that you need to have an adult conversation with your son about expectations and responsibilities. It was the first thing we did when our youngest moved back and when they left their job and applied to go back to study. They are adults now, and so need to behave like adults.

I can't imagine giving any of my DC a 'deadline' to move out.
As long as I have a home they have a home, no matter what their age or circumstances.

I don't understand the kick them out posters either. They mustn't love their DC.

How is someone without a job going to find somewhere to live? No landlord would touch them with a bargepole, and a graduate is likely to need a guarantor and references.

I feel that these posters and the "I moved out at 16" posters have no idea how tough the rental market is these days or how brutal the job market is, even for graduates.

You pay £11 month get unlimited prescription medication on the nhs.

Quite - kick them out, indeed!

But reading the OP’s posts… he’s doing a Masters - well, he’s just in between positions then. In that case, given that he has a forward plan, he can at least be civil. I agree that if there are no adverse circumstances he should learn to drive pronto or at least get a bike.

I think this is now a re-occurring issue for families. When I was a kid, getting a University education was a pathway to a better future and I think that a lot of academia still promotes this ethos to the students when it no longer really applies in the same way and I think we are setting the youth up to feel failures as a result of it. Its drilled into them that great futures, higher wages are there for the taking if they get a degree, let alone a masters and its no longer that simple and for a long period of time now, more people have been making it to degree level studies so it no longer carries that kudos (I'm generalising here - it still applies in some cases).

So the students qualify and this rosy, well paid future doesn't happen for all and it makes them wonder what is wrong with them. It has to be so depressing and demotivating for them. Not only has your son not walked into this fantastic career but he is living at home on handouts from his parents with what he perceives to be no privacy or autonomy. He probably knows you are trying to help him but he is also potentially seeing too much into your advice...as in, well even my parents think I can't make decisions for myself! Its a catch 22 situation and you are just being a good parent.

But credit to him for getting a cleaning job - he clearly isn't too proud to do what he has to.

I think you need to sit down with him and ask him, how you can help him as you can see how hard he is trying and he is clearly unhappy and you have been unintentionally causing offence by trying to support him with ideas. Reconfirm that he always has a home with you. If he can't think of anything, then say allsorts has run through your heads and mention what you suggested in your posting but basically just say you want the best for him and if there is anything viable you can do to help, you would be happy to discuss it .

Good luck, being a parent is never easy no matter how old they get, its just the challenges that change.

And what if the parent is doing without necessities to cough up money to their adult " child"

But surely you expect them not to treat you like shit while you are providing a home for them?

This might be completely daft, but would you consider moving house to a place where he has more chance of independence (eg accessible public transport) and finding work, if he can't move out, or drive? Only if it would also work for the others in the family as well.
You don't need to accept bad behaviour, regardless. He is lucky to have such a kind family.