Extent some people go to satisfy their want for a child

[kaffeine123]

This is going to come across as judgmental but I’m finding it a bit shocking the extent some people go to, to satisfy their yearning for a baby.

I’ve read a thread today which made me shocked at some of the comments encouraging this lady to separate and have a second child, even if it ends her relationship and is not in the best interest of her first child! There are other threads like this too.

If you cannot provide for the child emotionally and financially, when does the yearning for a baby become selfish and it should instead be a matter for a therapist to work through in coming to acceptance.

I know someone who is planning her second child at 45/46 which will involve IVF and she is already in significant debt from the treatment for the first and childcare fees. I just think why! Try and be happy with what you have.

I have never felt this level of yearning for a child, but I can only assume it is a feeling so powerful that it makes you unable to look at this logically (am I too old to have a child, can I afford to have another child, is my mental health robust enough to have another child)

How old are you? As you've said in your post- you haven't (yet) felt what these women have- and you can't understand it, and juts how important it is to. So no, really can't comment. You've got a baby currently and no way to know how you'll feel in a few years regarding having more.

@JugglingJanuary I didn't expect to ever get pregnant due to infertitily. I was when DD was born, and totally used to the idea that I would never have children.

I was always ambivalent about having DC anyway though.

I know a lady in her late 80’s who still talks regularly about her miscarriage and how different her life would have been with her baby. I don’t think she ever did accept it or become ok with it. She is still in love with her ex husband and her greatest wish in the world was to have a baby. She could never bare to hear a baby cry. My Mum knew another lady who ended up in a “mental institution” due to a breakdown over her infertility, I hope she found some peace with it in the end. My Mum didn’t know her well enough to know whether she did. Still today women don’t get to become Mum’s. IVF gives many more babies and adoption is an option too but it still doesn’t happen for everyone who wants it. It’s easy to think of it as a miracle.

I completely agree with your points. However the yearning for a baby for some women can take over all logic.
Before I conceived via IVF, having a baby is all I could think about. Every night I would dream that I was pregnant, then wake up devastated when I realised it was a dream. Like a PP described, it's like a black cloud. Every single month full of expectation and then heartbreak. My body even started having pregnancy symptoms and late periods, that's how powerful my desire for a baby was.
If you've never experienced this heartbreak and you have your babies, then you're so lucky. Just remember it's not that easy for others.

Just read a post above this about apps and lots of abbreviations I don’t understand, dark lines etc. I would assume the person has struggled to conceive so needs that help. Luckily I don’t understand how that feels

Yes @Beginningless i think you’ve hit the nail on the head there.

What I’m trying to articulate is that my judgement does come into play where I’m looking at the situation logically and it seems to be that satisfying the need to have a child is going to be at the child’s expense (fraught relationship between parents where both parents are not on board with having the child, much older parents who will be verging on 70 years old when the child is 20, can’t afford the child), or unethical solutions like surrogacy.

This is what I think too - need to make sure existing child(ten) are having those needs met

Agreed

Im infertile and I also had a chest infection so severe that whilst I was trying to get to treatment it was sheer force of will keeping me breathing

I can absolutely attest that the urge to breath is far far stronger than the urge to have a child, and thats from someone who jumped through a lot of medical hoops because I desperately wanted a child

Its the kind of complete bollocks someone who has never actually had breathing issues might spout

Also sad situations like having a pp mentioned - going ahead and having 2nd when it isn’t safe to do so and leaving the first without a mother. Incredibly sad and all I’m wondering is whether people in this situation would benefit from speaking with a mental health professional to make peace with their family size as-is.

I don't think you're completely unreasonable op. I can understand someone having a desperate urge to have another baby but truthfully I think sometimes you have to make calls that are right for the child and family you have. I'd love another child but with childcare costs I simply don't earn enough and it would put us into debt. I often get really torn by my own wants and what I think would be beneficial for ds (ie a sibling) but equally I have to logically recognise that it's more important that we're financially stable so ds isn't growing up in poverty.

I agree I'm not sure ending a marriage is the best move when there's already a child involved- I was really shocked at some of the advice given on that thread. I would never want to do anything to jeopardise the stability and security my family provides my son. Anything else is my issue to deal with.

If you’ve clearly quite easily had a baby and said you never needed ivf etc then I don’t think you’re in any position whatsoever to judge how someone else might feel who wasn’t that lucky, or equally how you might’ve felt had things been different.

It’s not comparable to say you probably would’ve been fine & happy, you simply do not know so it’s an incredibly naive thing to say.

I know someone like this - they’re friends of my in laws and in their 80s now. They told my MIL that the heartache of watching all their friends become grandparents had brought back the pain of infertility all over again.

It never goes away 😢

Lots of people seem to be in agreement that whilst the urge to become a mother (I.e. have a baby of your own) is strong and can be overwhelming, the urge to have a second isn't usually strong enough to jeopardise the health and wellbeing of the first child. Including breaking up a happy home, or risking financial wellbeing.
And most of us believe we would try to put that thought out of our heads and focus on what we had.

I was just thinking today that women who don't want children are quite lucky. Having a child is a beautiful experience but also comes with much angst and has the potential for untold heartache. The journey to have a child can also be fraught with heartache if it's not straightforward for you, and if you have that all-encompassing biological urge for children. If you don't have that OP, then count yourself lucky. For those of us who do or did have that, it's nothing like as simple as 'look at it logically or get mental health support' 🙄

Also, remember that if it weren't for that strong biological urge to reproduce that some women have, the human race may have died out long ago. If we all made childbearing decisions based purely on logic, there'd be a lot fewer babies being born. In fact we'd have died out in the Middle Ages, when it was much more risky to give birth.

Also you know that ivf very often doesn’t work even now for many many people who have it?

The concept that because ivf is now available and people can have it means that’s a solution and nobody these days is still in this situation is quite naive, lots of people now could have this conversation, as well as in the past.

I can see this from both sides. The biological urge to have a child is very real and defies logic and reason. Before I had my DD I struggled to be around babies or pregnant women as the need to have my own baby was so great. However since having her eight years ago that feeling has never returned. As I am personally happy with one child I do struggle to understand why someone might break up their family or risk financial difficulty just to fulfil the urge for a second or subsequent baby, but clearly for many people that urge never goes away like it did for me.

I have one child. I could have had a second with my exh but the relationship was failing and my urge to have another didn’t supersede my duty to my existing child to be as stable as possible whilst destabilising the family unit. A second baby “just because” was not a good enough reason to have one.

I subsequently had a long relationship with a man, who in hindsight, should have a 6 month fling. Considered having a child with him, but ultimately knew that no matter how much I wanted another, it wasn’t right.

I’m now (quite literally) on the cusp of getting married to my very lovely partner, we’ve blended our families pretty well and we talk about having a child together. It feels right. But I take the view that if it happens, it happens, if it doesn’t then we’re going to have a wonderful life together anyway.

Perhaps having a copper iud has been helpful, can’t just stop like with the pill, there’s no impulsive “let’s just do it” or indeed the “it can be a surprise for him” involved. My urge to have a second child has never overridden the very planful nature of having an iud removed before now. Well, it did once, that’s how I have my lovely child.

Humans don’t have sex purely to procreate though, the pleasure element is a massive driver. Pregnancy prevention methods are littered throughout our known history, granted they weren’t very successful most of the time.

YANBU.

I don’t understand it but that’s probably because I never wanted children (despite now having 2). I’ve never had that urge/want/need of having children so it’s not really something for me to try and understand. Everyone’s different

Parents do all kinds of things that potentially aren't in their children's best interests: fucking off and leaving them, lying about their income to avoid financially supporting them, cheating, choosing high-risk careers, smoking, and so on and so on.

Why is breaking up a relationship to have another child so much worse than breaking up a relationship for any other reason?

For me, I always wanted children and Im lucky enough to have two DCs. It was a very powerful drive. I would have felt bereft if I hadn't.
My daughter ( just turned 16) is so broody - goes to look at baby clothes in TK Maxx with her friends 😆 I try and tell her to wait until she has a degree 🤞
It's a very strong biological urge

I’m absolutely a slave to my hormones. Every month I turn nasty and hate everyone and everything. The moment my period comes the fog lifts. My spacial awareness even goes a bit off. This if well documented in women and is part of us. Yes you can think things through but clearly these women, despite knowing it’s not sensible timing or finance or whatever wise, feel their desire wins out. If it isn’t hormones I guess it’s just…pig-headedness. But hormones are nothing to be embarrassed of.

I spent 80k on ivf and we now have debt. Best money ever spent! We have 2 children now and couldn’t be happier and don’t have that awful sad yearning. Would do it all again. I think it’s something in me that made me broody and determined- wasn’t totally rational maybe but i would have done anything. I also had 3 ruptured ectopics all requiring surgery and a dangerous cornual ectopic that burst my womb but still carried on trying and would again!

@SemperIdem I'm not sure i understand your point?

I do kind of agree - I have 2 DC but come from a big family and DH and I always wanted 3.

However, I had two complicated, high risk pregnancies. I had GD, pre - eclampsia, an 8 week prem and a NICU stay among other things. We had to look at this from a rational view and consider the risks in another pregnancy. Ultimately we decided to stick with the 2 healthy children we have.

Despite all the logical reasons, emotionally this has been a big struggle for me and I still feel upset by it now! I will work through it eventually and know in my head it was the right choice. I do think you do have to consider what is the best decision for the living children, not just what you want and balance it out.