This is another porn thing, isn’t it?

[Nastra]

It’s not a problem really but it made me wonder because it was weird.
I believe my DP and I are generally fairly open with one another. I don’t mind if he initiates something while I am asleep and vice versa because we both wake up and only engage if in the mood. A while ago he asked me could I pretend to be asleep while he did things. I was ok trying it but it was actually just weird and boring at the same time and not my thing and nothing I need to do again.
Yesterday he asked if I’d ever consider taking a sleeping tablet so I’d sleep heavily and he could tell me the next day what he did. The simple answer is “no” because I think it’s kind of creepy plus the fact that I wouldn’t take any medication just for fun.
He was fine with that and agreed that he’d probably find it creepy too if it was the other word around, so I think this is settled but it made me wonder. I couldn’t think of anything less appealing and I wonder if many people actually do this? I assume it’s a porn thing that isn’t really done in real life?

I had the same thought. Like he's got fed up of doing it on the sly and thinks how much easier it would be if OP just agreed to take an OTC sleeping pill voluntarily. Would save him from having to get hold of whatever it is he's already giving her. He went from "let's pretend" to "take a pill" quick enough, without any consideration to OP's opinions on the subject or else he wouldn't have asked a second time, given she didn't really like it the first time. He's not thinking of her at all beyond what he can get her to do.

Obviously my take on this is very different from the majority here.

If I cuddle my sleeping (and semi naked) partner when I wake up in the night, maybe kiss his neck, is that sexual assault because he is unconscious and can’t consent in that moment? It doesn’t feel like it to me. It absolutely would be sexual assault if I did the same thing to someone else, but not with him. Surely? If I wake him up with a blow job have I assaulted him? If I did that to someone else then obviously yes, but with my partner (and discussed beforehand) that seems ok to me. Even though he can’t consent in that moment there’s established norms between us that seem relevant.

None of that involves drugging anyone but they are sexual acts on an unconscious person. And at least cuddling a partner while asleep must be very commonly accepted.

There’s a relevant difference in that I don’t think cuddling a sleeping partner is made hotter because they’re sleeping. But waking him up with a bj… it’s kinda hot that his body responds before he’s fully awake, and from his perspective it’s nice to gradually wake up to something so enjoyable (and it’s enjoyable because it’s a known person doing something familiar. Waking up to that situation with a stranger would be totally different and terrifying).

These examples aren’t anything to do with rape fantasies on either side.

I absolutely wouldn’t defend doing anything with a sleeping partner if you haven’t established what’s ok beforehand. And I agree that taking steps to ensure she stays unconscious would be too far for me. I suppose it’s just not so obvious to me that enjoying (the idea of) sex with a sleeping partner must be about a desire to rape, even less obvious that it would lead to actually raping her.

Not the same thing at all. 🙄

Did she tell you that?

"She had unexplained gynaecological problems. Subsequent medical examinations found she had been infected with four sexually transmitted diseases."

😣

I agree it's a creepy request... but he asked you, you vetoed it and he thought again and agreed. I don't think its fair to call him some kind of rapist!!! He asked. Rapists don't ask.

This is really, really weird because why does he actually want you to be asleep? Like how is it better for you to not know what’s happened?

But he’s asking her to be passed out so she can give no consent to whatever he does!

Didn't you read about James Cleverley?

This is a porn thing and it's really horrible that he wants to do that to you.

Except it’s not even a fantasy - it’s actual rape as he wants her to be actually unconscious!

https://www.theguardian.com/society/2021/jun/15/the-sexual-assault-of-sleeping-women-the-hidden-horrifying-crisis-in-britains-bedrooms

This is a pretty worrying turn of events, OP. He’s got this idea from….where??

An integral part of what you describe is the partner waking up - that's part of the enjoyment. But the OP's partner specifically wants her to stay unconscious throughout. Which makes it completely different.

No, but they do sometimes have relationships with people where they will see how far they can go. Ted Bundy comes to mind, but there's another that I remember (maybe ex-wife of 'Black Panther' in the 70s/80s) who said that he had asked her to do this, try that. And while he/they took no for an answer there, it wasn't the same way with their victims.

Sounds like a necrophilia thing, what a weirdo, I don't think I'd ever want to have sex of any kind after that suggestion.

I thought the same.
Deal breaker for me too I'm afraid. Huge red flag here.

Just asked a man’s perspective. His eyes bulged out of his head and he said in no wwaay is this normal nor generally porn related and it sounds like step one on his way to killing her.

Giving me the creeps this post.

This is the most disturbing thing I've read on Mumsnet.

This is vile and disgusting and is definitely something a sexual predator would do. It happened to me. I was 14 years old. My half-brother sexually abused me whilst I was asleep. I woke up but was too terrified to move, so I pretended to be asleep until he stopped. 40+ years later I still remember it like it was yesterday and I still have nightmares about it. To think your partner has suggested it to you makes me want to vomit.

This is terrifying op.

Please leave.

This woman was married to her husband for 20 years until she found images/video of him raping her with various household objects while unconscious.

I don’t think a story has affected me, as awfully as the experience of the poor woman in France. Some men are gross so I wouldn’t be surprised if this is a fairly common fantasy, but I’d be very worried if my partner wanted to drug me to act this out. I don’t think it’s a stretch going from a willing participant to an unwilling one.

I don’t think it’s a stretch going from a willing participant to an unwilling one.

It’s a huge f*ing leap from a willing participant to an unwilling one! Rape is inherently violent and is a totally different thing from consensual sex, even if it is a weird kinky not-for-me-thankyou kind of sex. Lots of people, men and women, have fantasies that are messed up in some way. Wanting to play with those fantasies with an informed partner who agreed to it is not the same as unilaterally deciding to act them out on someone without their knowledge. It is entirely reasonable for OP to feel uncomfortable and creeped out by the suggestion, to want to delve deeper and determine for herself if this is a red flag. It’s a bit much for random people on the internet to call this guy a rapist without any actual evidence of any non consensual sex.

It doesn't matter if the partner wakes up, the sexual assault has already taken place.
If your partner has a fantasy about waking up while you are performing a sex act upon them and you do it, you put yourself at risk.
What if they wake up and say 'WTF are you doing?!'? Next thing they are on MN asking for 'advice' and then you're on the sex offenders register.

A neighbour of mine over a decade was routinely drugged. He filmed himself having sex with her and put videos online.

This request makes me feel alarm bells in my gut.