Children Who Ignore Adults?

[JoJoBoZoe]

When did this become a thing and since when do parents allow this rude behaviour?

Whenever I'm on the school run or at parties and I meet with parents, I aways greet them and say hello and also hello to their child.

The amount of children that don't reply and ignore me and the parents say nothing is ridiculous! They just say " she's in a mood or she's tired "

I was raised, when an adult was speaking to me, that I answer them. If I'd have tried to ignore someone my Mother would have made me reply and would have embarrassed me.

Have all basic manners gone out of the window?

I would add that my comments apply to NT children and to the many children with SEN who are capable of normal polite interaction with others. Of course, there will be some kids with SEN for whom this is not possible, and that's a different scenario.

I would add that my comments apply to NT children and to the many children with SEN who are capable of normal polite interaction with others.

Even NT children can be shy. And learning manners is a process, nobody is born with them.

I'd be interested in how I can 'make' my child talk?

I have a very shy 4 year old. Outgoing and happy to talk to children but will not speak to an adult other than family and his nursery key worker. If I said he 'had' to say hello he simply wouldn't. I'm sure he'd happily stand for hours not saying hello, and no one has time for that! Even people he's known his whole life he's terrified to speak to.

He's incredibly anxious and nervous in other aspects, and gets embarrassed very easily.

I don't think it's my parenting because his 6 year old brother could not be more different - he is the most chatty and outgoing person imaginable. He talks to everyone. Going into/out of school takes forever because he stops to say hello to everyone (child or adult) he knows. In shops or wherever he's happy to go up and ask for what he wants etc. I've literally never seen him embarrassed and I sort of worry he's going to grown up to be an annoying gobshite 😆.

I know this is part of the reason DS2 is the way he is. He doesn't need to speak, he always has DS1 to do the talking for him. But even when DS1 isn't around, how do I make him talk? I can't physically open his mouth and make words come out of it.

This. You cannot know if a child has an invisible SEN that makes them unable (not just reluctant) to respond, like my son.

So the polite thing to do as an adult with all kids is just to model polite behaviour yourself by saying hi, bye etc without any expectation or pressure for the child to respond. It’s not hard.

Have you actually read my post?

Of course NT children can be shy. I have acknowledged already that many 6yos won't yet have the confidence or social skills to interact effectively with adults. That's fine and developmentally quite normal.

My point is not that there is anything wrong with kids being shy. My point is that the adults around them should be helping them to overcome that shyness, and teaching them the basic social skills that are needed to function effectively in society. The adults should not, imo, be shrugging it off and saying it's fine if they are shy, it's fine if they don't want to talk.

I was a very shy child myself (undiagnosed neurodivergent but actually perfectly capable of interacting with others appropriately). My shyness massively held me back when I was younger, and it wasn't until I was an adult that my DH really helped me to properly overcome it. I wish that my parents had been more proactive about addressing my shyness at a much earlier age, as it would have made such a huge difference to me. I really think parents do their kids no favours by ignoring the issue.

I agree with this. What is in it for a child to comply other than to avoid punishment? Just leave them alone. They don't learn by being forced, they learn by observing.

I wouldn't give it a second thought if a 6 year old ignored my greeting. They are children and manners develop by observation. Honestly, most people on MN expect kids to fall out of the womb with an handbook on societal norms and values.

Funnily enough the children I know who were made to 'conform' to their parents teachings are now crippled with anxiety and not well balanced at all.

No, I agree that the OP doesn't know and that you can't make judgements about individual children/parents because you never know what's going on.

My comments are aimed more at the posters who seem to think it's fine to let kids opt out of normal polite behaviour because "boundaries" or whatever. I think they are doing their kids a massive disservice.

It also seems to me that Covid has become a distance memory for some.

For us oldies, the impact on our social skills isn't so great (but actually there is an impact - look at the increase in Anxiety diagnoses as just one example).

For youngsters who at a crucial stage in the their social development were not mingling, not going to nursery/school and keeping away from other people (to the extent that many people would cross the street to avoid walking immediately past someone) there was very little opportunity to build these skills in a natural way. At an extremely impressionable age they were being taught that we keep our distance and that we don't stop an chat. I'm sure this has had an impact.

The issue is whether the adults around them see it as a teaching opportunity to help them build their confidence and social skills or whether they just shrug it off and say, oh well, that's fine if they want to be rude.

They may well be shrugging it off - so it's not a big deal because it's an issue they are working on.

As a parent you model the behavior, you prompt but if it doesn't happen making it seem less a big deal may well be best approach as you have years to rinse and repeat.

I'd often shrug it off as nothing because it's socially unacceptable to punch rude arseholes making it a huge fucking deal with a young child they were often visibly frightening - you step in minimise and try and redirect their behavior at you not your child if you can not shut it down immediately.

There are increasing number of parents who aren't teaching basic manners or any consideration - I do agree there - but I think it's harder to know here if its that issue or shyness being dealt with in an appropriate way with very young children or even if SEN often more visible and frequently diagnosed at older ages causing it.

@Flowers94 So, if someone said "Good morning!" to you, you'd ignore them?

"French children don't throw food" is intersting on this. Basically in some cultures (France, Italy, Spain) this type of "shyness" isn't tolerated. Allowing a 5 yr old to hide behind your skirts when a (I assuming) completely non threatening know adult speaks to them isn't doing them any favours IMO.

Yes, I agree that they may be working on it behind the scenes and that there might be reasons for not intervening in a particular situation. I agree, too, that we have no idea what was causing the issue in the OP's situation.

But there are some parents on here who don't seem to see the need to work on the issue at all because they think the child should have the right to choose to ignore basic manners if they wish. From my perspective, that's pretty poor parenting.

Interesting that you added the 'assuming' there. I think history tells us that we have no idea who is threatening or non-threatening, and this obession with pushing children to conform in the guise of 'good manners' has resulted in a complete lack of boundaries for many vulnerable children. A child can learn good manners in an healthy way or an unhealthy way.

But there are some parents on here who don't seem to see the need to work on the issue at all because they think the child should have the right to choose to ignore basic manners if they wish. From my perspective, that's pretty poor parenting.

I'd agree and long term it really isn't doing the child any favours.

I tried slowly building confidence and offering reassurance - mainly as my parents veered between shoving me into awkward situations and demanding certain behaviors from me and being upset if I struggled and actively stopping me interacting in social situations as I was shy and embarrassing and would struggle.

Shy people do need to learn how to interact with wider world but often takes a bit longer than more socially adventures children. Though I encountered a few very outgoing children not taught basic manners though by 8/9 even they had often picked up via peers and school staff basic manners.

She's a misery because she thinks manners are important and children should be taught to be polite? OK then... raises eyebrow

OP says these children are known to her, have been to her house. Yes I think we need to assume adults on school premises are safe. Teaching distrust isn't great either TBH.

I used to work somewhere that had whole class visits and I would stand at the door saying hello and goodbye to every single person who was visiting and I found it pitiful that so few of the children acknowledged me in any way. On the other hand there was one teacher who was amazing and when I was saying hello and being ignored she stopped the line and said Mrs Ginslinger has said good morning to you all - what do you say?

But you're not teaching distrust. You're allowing the child to become comfortable with people at their own pace. I'm sure there were plenty of kids that had been over to Jimmy Savilles gaff too. He wasn't a stranger to anyone was he. Good old Uncle Jimmy.
Similarly with schools, educators are great but a good educator will build trust and not force it. History also tells us that those working on school premises are not always 'good people' ie. Ian Huntly and Maxine Carr.

I don't think I've ever seen an headline where a deranged killers background story was 'killer had a difficult upbringing, he was allowed to go through life without saying please and thank you'.

I think the real issue is why an adult needs a child to validate them by being 'polite' when they could just say hello and put that shy or anxious child at ease by moving on and conversing with the parent.

Having lived, taught, and raised a socially anxious child in 2 out of the 3 countries you mention, that’s just not true. Of course to some degree every culture has different conventions and expectations regarding politeness and manners. But there are plenty of shy kids in those countries and plenty of tolerant adults too who understand that kids are not mini adults and that forcing/shaming kids is not the best teaching tool. That book is full of stereotypes generally.

It's a sorry state of affairs if you can't expect school aged children to manage a simple greeting. State schools have a lot to answer for here. We've had our kids in a mix and at the preps they've been at this basic level of communication is expected as a bare minimum. They greet their teachers individually in the morning. We do our kids no favours to think being a bit tired gets you out of manners. They don't have to hug anyone or even engage in a conversation but should greet known adults with a hello.

My son is 7. He won't say hello to people he is familiar with, and honestly he doesn't have. I won't make him. If you think he's rude then that's on you. He doesn't feel comfortable and I can literally feel him going stiff next me. But that's ok. You carry on thinking kids are rude coz they won't say hello. Maybe they just don't like you.

Completely agree

You are spectacularly missing the point. Statistically speaking a person is more advantaged thinking the best of people and going through life with a generally optimistic and outgoing outlook. Serail killers are far more likely to target "shy" children than confident ones.

It is absolutely not for adults' benefit that children need to learn to be superficially friendly and responsive.

But its subjective. Statistics don't change the fact that many people are abused due to people pleasing tendencies being forced upon them in childhood leaving them ill equipped to set boundaries.

I think this thread is proof that the OP is not deserving of manners or politeness of any child. They've proved themselves to be narrow-minded, judgemental, intolerant and entitled. The kid on the other hand is just getting on with their life whilst adults discuss 'their bad manners' that really have no negative affects on the adult OP whatsoever.

And I'm inclined to believe that serial killers are more likely to target those who don't have boundaries than those who have been allowed to develop them naturally and sense the difference between a good person and a bad person, rather than being told by adults who have repeatedly, willingly and unwillingly led many children into the hands of predators.