Thread 24, Sunak and the local elections aftermath

[DuncinToffee]

Previous thread

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/_chat/4793978-thread-23-sunak-unicorn-kingdom?page=1

Leaving aside any ethical considerations, it amazes me how stupid this policy approach is. The boats aren't going to stop, and it's incredibly obvious they're not. It's just not sensible for any politician to try and make political capital out of controlling something that isn't controllable.

There was someone on the radio yesterday saying that making an aim to halve inflation was about as much use as saying you aim for it to be sunny on Saturday. That applies even more to legal migrants crossing the channel in boats.

They going to detain migrants, no idea how, where and how long for
They going to send them back, no return agreements in place so again where and how
Rwanda, if implemented will take about 1 or 2% of the migrants

And stop the boats is very low on voters list of priorities

The BBC had an article over the weekend saying that the
policy will cost £3-6 billion (building detention facilities & removals).

Today the Times has an article entitled "Rishi Sunaks migration plan 'based on demented assumptions'" - the article states that Home Office research concluded that there was no evidence that hostile policies changed the behaviour of migrants.

There is also the question of why the Home Office hasn't published the impact assessment - ordinarily this would have been published when the legislation was produced.

And stop the boats is very low on voters list of priorities

So we can judge how low a priority it is, is it higher or lower priority than "knowing what a woman is".

I'll let you know once it is being listed as a priority.....

I don’t appreciate the repeated snide comments aimed at those of us who are gender critical and find it makes our political decision making more complicated and difficult.
I’m disturbed by any political party that buys into an anti-scientific, reality denying and misogynistic ideology. This actually includes all of them, so I can more or less discount it, which is some comfort.

I’m disturbed by any political party that buys into an anti-scientific, reality denying and misogynistic ideology. This actually includes all of them, so I can more or less discount it, which is some comfort.

Same. As the mother of a neurodiverse girl approaching adolescence, it's a huge concern for me and I don't have the luxury of pretending otherwise. There are plenty of us who are parents of disabled children who also need to worry about womens sex based rights.

However, it's not the case that the Tories can be trusted on this and the parties of the left can't, as some of the other GC feminists on here claim. It's not their broad concerns that are wrong, it's their framing of the issue.

Agree with this.

The comments are often aimed at the fact people spout "at least the Torys know what a woman is".

But they don't. And they have seen men out in woman's prisons. Rape woman in hospital wards and run refuges on the Tory's watch.

The truth is that no party does it well.

So for me any comments are based on the fact it's not a priority voting issue for me because other parties are likely to do so much other stuff better. Like just being able to tell the truth.

I'm very concerned about the fact gender and sex are being confused. But not enough to vote Tory thinking they will deal with it.

I also think when a government starts properly funding the NHS, mental health services, education, SEN provision, the justice system etc, a lot of these issues will be addressed.

Bob Stewart: Conservative MP charged with racially aggravated abuse
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-65814126

more on that story
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/dec/19/human-rights-activist-complains-to-tory-party-after-mp-tells-him-to-go-back-to-bahrain

What a horrible sounding man.

Presumably Stewart's constituency association thinks the way he behaves is absolutely fine. It certainly makes you understand how they came to elect the likes of Truss and Johnson.

I very much agree with this. As I've said before any one saying that this is purely an issue of the left or right is doing so for nefarious purposes.

Hope I'm not naive in thinking that on this thread there is more that unites us than divides us.

Hope I'm not naive in thinking that on this thread there is more that unites us than divides us.

I don’t think you’re naive. The “at least they know what a woman is” is the Tory voter’s last resort. Duncin hits the nail on the head, once the Tory party puts its money where its mouth is on issues that affect women they might have a point.

Agree it makes voting more complicated. But if it’s complicated that suggests weighing up the issues and that both sides are problematic. I’m not sure that’s who the ‘Tories know what a woman is’ is aimed at.
I think it’s more people who will come onto a thread about say, people dying because they didn’t receive emergency healthcare on time or mothers skipping meals just so they can afford to feed their children, and insisting they’ll still vote Tory because at least they know what a women is with no acknowledgment at all that tons of Tory policies have been terrible for women.

I don’t think anyone on this thread doesn’t recognise the damage that the Tories have done to women and children because they just don’t care about anyone but themselves.

https://twitter.com/Haggis_UK/status/1665753772239273984

When is a fact, not a fact? When the Home Secretary is presenting it to the HoC and it doesn’t matter whether it is accurate or not.

Times reporting that ACOBA has decided Sue Grey can start work in September after 6 months of gardening leave.
Cabinet Office had pushed for 18 months but ACOBA had raised concerns about basis of CO's claims.

twitter.com/steven_swinford/status/1665952294095994880?s=46&t=Uw4lJNwxFZFnX0Xs3doHYg

At what point did the Cabinet Office become so political?
I thought it was staffed by civil servants, but it seems now to just be an extension of Tory HQ.

Simon Case?

Well I think we can guess how certain Conservatives will react - stitch up etc.

ACOBA has 8 members - 5 independent individuals, 1 from Cons, Lab, Lib Dem. Current chair is the Conservative member.

Everything seems to come back to him doesn't it.
That said I have a small amount of sympathy for anyone working with Johnson - he's supposed to have said "what more can I do to stand up to a PM who lies?"
Presumably the same doesn't apply to Sunak?!

I watched that and was totally perplexed. Braverman lied on backlog of migrant figures. Fact. Yvette Cooper came to the HoC and asked for this to be corrected. She was very specific as to why what had been stated by Braverman was incorrect. Deputy Speaker said no.

"The way in which facts are presented in the Chamber is a matter for the Minister"
That means they can present false facts then?

"It's a matter of interpretation of statistics"
That means lies can be told in the Chamber then? Yvette Cooper was very clear why what had been stated was wrong.

The whole “inadvertently” misled by Ministers is such nonsense, they prepare their questions and answers.