Upset friend over the use of 'rainbow baby' - was I wrong? *TW* childloss

[WasIInsensitive]

For context - my beautiful daughter died 16 years ago, I got unexpectedly pregnant shortly afterwards and have an amazing 15yo dd too.

Friend had an early miscarriage (not diminishing her experience, I've also miscarried early on and I know its heartbreaking) 20 years ago and has a lovely little 1yo now.

Friend was over earlier and kept on referring to my dd as my 'rainbow baby/child/daughter', she also calls her child this.

I fully understand the term, and know lots of bereaved parents who find comfort in it, however it's not a term I'm comfortable with in relation to my family.

Every time she used this term for my dd I asked her to use dds name, she slipped back into it after one use again.

After, maybe, 5 times telling her she snapped at me, saying she was correct with her use of the word and its natural to use it.

PLEASE DONT READ THIS NEXT PART IF YOU USE THE TERM, AND WOULD BE UPSET BY MY EXPLANATION OF WHY I DISLIKE IT

I explained that I dislike using that term for my dd as I feel it makes her sound as though her importance in my life is based on her sisters place, rather than her being important in her own right.

I don't like thinking of dd as my daughter after my loss, she is simply my daughter. She knows about her sister, and I occasionally use the terms 'little sister' or 'big sister' but never 'rainbow', I actually find it really upsetting to think of her like that, and I find it upsetting to think of my older daughter as 'rain' as well, her life was short, but she was here, she is loved, and she is important in her own right too.

Friend said I was being insensitive to her loss and her use of the term, again I explained that I would never mention/judge/comment or even think anything of someone else using that term about their own situation, however I don't want the term used about my daughter, a couple more words were exchanged and she left, told me to message when I was ready to apologise.

I don't feel like I have anything to apologise for at this moment, but all opinions are welcome. I could have definitely handled it better, but I feel like my point about not feeling comfortable using the term about my family was valid, and I would never have explained my stance had she not pushed it.

(NC just in case friend is on here, I don't think she is but you never know).

🙄

Agree. Someone else calling my child a rainbow baby wouldn’t fly in my house. That child is very much her own person.

Your friend is crossing boundaries applying her feelings and her grief to your daughter.

I think you're absolutely right. I wonder what my son, born after two miscarriages, would be called if he had been born today - a double rainbow? It's never one occurred to me to refer to him as anything other than my son, and to suggest he has to be described only in terms of two previous miscarriages is really quite offensive.

It just occurred to me a little while ago that I’m a “rainbow baby”. My mother had a son before me that died at a few weeks. I was aware of this as a fact but not in relationship to me.

I’m sure it would have seemed uncomfortable if my life was forever linked to a baby that died before I was born.

if miscarriages count, then my granddaughter is also a rainbow baby, the term once again would always be linking her to another child, and somehow diminishing her as a person in her own right.

I don't think you were wrong. She wants to use it for her kid that's fine. But has no right to Label your child with it. That's called respect. FYI, I don't use that term either. My baby is my baby my miscarried baby is my baby too.

Your friend was being an asshole.

Personally I think ‘rainbow baby’ is a horrible term, but my opinion of it is irrelevant, what matters is that you told her that her language was upsetting to you and instead of apologising or moderating her language she became aggressive at you. She doesn’t sound like much of a friend 😔

I agree with you, and if anyone owes an apology it’s her. It’s awful that she referred to your daughter in that way instead of using her name, and even worse that she said it in front of her. She sounds unhealthily obsessed with the “rainbow” concept and in danger of this affecting her child.

I agree

It's a personal choice over what words to use. For me rainbow baby refers to a baby after a miscarriage. And then more of a during the successful pregnancy phase. But god knows who gets to define that.

I wouldn't use it for a still born baby or a baby that survived after the birth.

To me though the main thing is that there is obviously some negativity going on in her mind about you and it sounds toxic. As I get older I find I have less time and inclination to find out why someone feels negatively about me. Obviously I try to be self aware and make changes when I have upset someone. But if it comes from their own projections and insecurities, I leave them to it.

So what? Have you even read the thread?

the term... would always be linking her to another child, and somehow diminishing her as a person in her own right.

That's exactly why I dislike the term so much. The living child isn't enhanced by the term, they're diminished. And as I said earlier, I expect a lot of those children who hear their mothers calling them 'rainbows' to need therapy when they're older, after being made to carry the burden of their unborn or lost sibling with them. It's almost abusive.

So no I'm not going to say that it's fine for other mothers to use it for their children. I don't think it is

OP you have been more than supportive and more than gracious in tolerating this woman's behaviour. It's totally reasonable that you look after yourself in this situation now.

My heart breaks reading your situation and update.

You deserve more than someone who is trying to turn the loss of your much-loved child into a sick competition.

OP I am so sorry for your loss. I think you have to cut this friend off, her attitude is so shocking and you have to protect yourself, you are not the person to help with whatever twisted mindset she is in.

@WasIInsensitive I think you have been incredibly gracious given the situation. Grief hits us all differently and you have given her ( undeservedly ) the benefit of the doubt, but she has no right to tell you what language she will be using around your first born.

I’ve suffered two pregnancy losses one early and one late, and while grief is not a competition, I cannot compare my experience to yours (and I was devastated), my heart aches for you (and the vultures that gathered may they rot in hell).

cut her loose. It’s sad to end long friendships, I’ve had to do something similar recently during my recent pregnancy , but she is not worth your energy or headspace.

Much aroha to you, I’m sorry for the loss of your child.

I know what you mean , your younger daughter will never replace the child you lost. They are both separate human beings and you will always love both.

@beamout thiiiiisss in spades

“As I get older I find I have less time and inclination to find out why someone feels negatively about me. Obviously I try to be self aware and make changes when I have upset someone. But if it comes from their own projections and insecurities, I leave them to it”

Please can those who are just coming to the thread read ALL of the OP's posts before commenting. You can do this by clicking on "see all" on the first post

You do not need to apologize.

My twins were born on my third pregnancy (so two prior losses).
It would never enter my head to use the term "rainbow baby".
I don't even know the"rules" of using it:

• is it solely used after a still-born/full-term baby, or also after an early miscarriage?
• is the term only used during pregnancy?
• at what age do you stop referring to the baby as a "rainbow"? (at 15, it seems a bit strange).

Having says that, it seems it's important to her. She lost a baby 20 years ago and now has a 1-year old. Maybe she spent the last 20 years wishing for a baby, and can't let go of the first loss. You don't need to apologize, but it sounds like this can be worked through, to save the friendship.

I'm sorry. I didn't see your update.
She's causing you pain, so you're completely right to cut her off if that's what's best for you.

Hi @WasIInsensitive I am so sorry for your loss.
I am a regular lurker and hardly ever comment but your thread has resonated with me a lot tonight. My situation different, I seem to have lost a friend as we both got pregnant in January last year, I had a MMC at 10 weeks which for me personally was very very difficult and one of the hardest things I've been through including a suicide of a cousin and other family tragedies. My friend continued her pregnancy but then devastatingly lost her baby three weeks after they were born at 27 weeks.

I have posted about the pain of the damage these events caused to this friendship (not seen each other for over a year and not in contact) and had some help from others on here who advised me to mourn the friendship as it may be that things cannot be repaired.

I am now about to give birth to a "rainbow baby" and personally it's a term I've found helpful in early pregnancy when I was scared about miscarrying again but not a term I would refer to baby once born. But like you said, that's just me- others can and should do what they please to help with their individual grief.

What strikes me is your kindness to your friend who's journey of loss was different to yours. It never helps to compare but I've had to accept that my friend may never want to see me again or meet my baby as all these events are so closely tied up. Grief is NOT a competition and definitely everybody deals with things differently and your friend is not respecting that at all. I feel sad for her that she can't see this and may loose an amazing friend like you.

But your bravery and kindness has inspired me. I'm hurt my friend has never acknowledged my loss or my new baby (though I have hers) but I also respect her right to deal with her devastating loss in her own way- I feel sometimes these things can mean the break down of precious friendships and for me it's been so hard to accept. But knowing there's people who's been through what you have but still have empathy and kindness to say "let's not compare" has brought me a lot of closure. Thank you OP xxx

Considering how incredibly sensitive and thoughtful your posts have been @WasIInsensitive, I have no doubt at all that you are a very caring person, and you certainly do not owe this woman - or anyone else - an apology.

I am sorry for your loss. I agree completely that however you choose to describe your child is entirely your choice. I am shocked that this woman appears to be attempting to "compete" with you over your grief, and how she actually brought your 15 year old DD directly into the conversation was wholly inappropriate.

In your shoes, I too would write off this "friendship", she sounds mean and manipulative - totally the opposite of how you come across, it's hard to believe you were friends at all!

There is a real danger that the more you analyse the conversations (we're up to page 10 here, and she is probably doing it too), the more you both disappear down your own separate rabbit holes and the harder it is for you both to come back from them. You don't know what was in her head and she doesn't know what was in yours. Stewing and trying to second guess it is only going to upset you further and it isn't going to help.

I think @SleepingStandingUp 's suggestion here is superb. Often what's needed is a third way out, without anyone having to step down, and that's exactly what this offers.

ive always found the term odd but just thought it was me. I’ve had a mc and never connected with the term with my next pregnancy. Your friend in my opinion has been extremely disrespectful towards you and your family. Sorry for your loss 💐

I have to be honest, it's a term I despise. If someone wants to refer to their own child as a "rainbow baby" that's fine, that's what they're comfortable with. I would never ever call anyone's child, or my own a rainbow baby.

It almost feels like the child who is here is secondary to the baby who was lost. They're their own person, loved and cherished, not a label due to circumstances which happened before their birth.