We want our evenings back

[IvanaB]

Does anyone have any tips on how to get a toddler to go to sleep alone?

My DS is 31 months. Since birth he was rocked to sleep. When he became too big to be rocked he had to be bounced (we had to be standing, not sitting). Our backs were breaking as he's a big boy.

He's now 31 months and moved from his cot to a single bed a couple of months ago. Since then, he can fall asleep in his bed but either DH or I have to be sitting beside his bed singing to him. We wouldn't have an issue with this if it didn't take, on average, 1.5 - 2hrs for him to fall asleep. Some nights it can take longer. He's in bed for 7.30/8 but often doesn't go to sleep until 9/9.30pm by which time, we are shattered and good for nothing.

He still gets up during the night too and needs us to repeat the process (thankfully it usually doesn't take anywhere near as long). We're just lucky that our 10 month old sleeps fairly well.

I'd love to be able to tuck him into bed, read him a story, sing him a lullaby and then leave him to drift off.

No it's not easier said than done. I've walked this road thank you.

I am speaking from experience. MY experience. If you don't like that then scroll on. But don't try and belittle me. This is what worked for me.
OP asked for advice. I gave mine. I found this worked for me.
Glad you have parenting perfect for you. You should write a book

A friend of mine has to lay next to her 3 year olds cot on the floor holding her hand until she falls asleep. Every single night

I can't help but think fuck that there's more to life surely

There's your problem. You rocked him to sleep since birth. WHYYY

Iv rocked and cuddled my almost 2 year old to sleep every night and he goes to bed fine and sleeps through 🤷🏻‍♀️

Haven't RTFT but when he's been in bed a short while, have you tried saying to him you just need to pop downstairs to empty the washing machine (or some other random household task), and you'll be back in a minute?

Give that a go a few times, and you might find that he starts to get used to lying in bed by himself. You can then gradually increase the time you spend out of the room and eventually you might find that when you go back he has nodded off on his own.

He probably still needs the daytime nap because he isn't sleeping for long enough at night.

I did this with my pfb though he was a little younger. We were sitting with him to fall asleep losing the will to live for 2+ hours and one day my DH was putting him down and he said 'OK daddy is just outside' and left the room and he actually fell asleep within 5 minutes. Turns out our eldest is easily overstimulated and the presence of me frustratingly looking at my phone with a blanket over it or trying to sneak out every half hour was keeping him awake.

If your boy was my boy I would
Wake at 7.30, drop nap (if he's cutting it some days sounds like he's getting ready to skip it).
Get outside or go swimming in the afternoon..mine always sleep better after swimming.
Bed with his favourite pjs and if he's a cuddly boy I'd give him something of yours to cuddle. My DS loved taking a scarf of mine to bed.
If he's tired after skipping nap and afternoon activity I'd try and start evening routine at 1830.
If he's a mummy's boy or you get upset with him upset may be better for DF to do it.
Make sure room is all set up and mine like use this works sleep spray (they spray it on to their pillows themselves) then they puy alexa audiobools on themselves.
I would then make an excuse to leave the room (mummy needs to go to the toilet now, cuddle kiss and good night). If he does come downstairs be super boring, no long cuddles, just make it clear he's going back to bed.

Good luck

Exhausting OP, you've got my sympathies. We all make parenting mistakes and try different things on subsequent DC - mine were the reverse to yours.

DC1 was sleep trained early. This meant putting her down awake (and content) from tiny.
Then laying her back down repeatedly once she learned to stand in her cot.
Then putting her back repeatedly once the cot side was removed. Heavily pregnant-laying next to her bed with my hand resting on her. Crawling out on my hands and knees and holding my breath 🙈.
Sitting on the landing reading a book and making sure she didn't get out of bed. Gradual retreat. Etc, etc.
She also would appear in our bed at some point in the night until she was around 7.
DC2 arrived when eldest was 17 months old.

With DC2 I thought fuck that. She fell asleep in my/DH's arms whilst we sat on the sofa with the TV on, until she was 3 years old!
Then she slipped easily into the same much more manageable routine as DC1.

Now they're 12 & 13 they take themselves to bed, that bit is easy! Getting them out of bed in the mornings though - that is now the bane of my life!

On this planet….

31 months is 2 years 7 months so in less than 5 months he will be 3

Tart cherry juice diluted!!!

Parenthood! It’s very hard to have anytime to yourselves with a toddler. The nights are long but the years are fast. I have no advice except to say it will pass.

Consistency is the answer. Fix on a bedtime routine and stick to it and make it much shorter than the current one. He now needs you to stay with him to sleep and that cannot continue as eventually he needs to learn to fall asleep on his own. I would just keep coming back to reassure him you are around but no singing etc. Does he have a comfort toy? Eventually he will get the message but it may take a while and there may be some disruption in the meantime. If he needs noise to drift off to sleep there are things around which will help.

I went for a couple of years of singing DD to sleep. I learnt a lot of songs!
Then we discovered audio books

This is a transition from napping to going all day without one. In between it’s too difficult to get to sleep so I wouldn’t be trying to do anything until the midday nap is dropped. Just put him to be later if you don’t want to drop the midday nap.

Fortunately my two have always been quite good with bedtime generally. However if we do have a wobbly evening we have 'magic sleepy spray' which is just a lavender pillow spray which works well. I also use 'Sleepy Paws' on YouTube. It's a 15min calming story on a 9 hour loop which I play on a phone out of view. It's very soothing we use it ourselves sometimes 🤣 Good luck!

Totally agree with this advice - also an old timer so my methods will seem old fashioned! I never rocked my babies to sleep after the first few weeks, it was always put them down in crib or cot after a feed and leave the room. As they got older, baths and stories became part of the bedtime routine which always ended with them being left to fall asleep on their own. I honestly don’t remember any crying, I would not have left them to cry for more than a few seconds anyway, I hated that sound.

My daughter was a bit of a madam when she first went into a bed at around 18 months ( baby brother needed the cot!) and did try coming out of her bedroom. One of us used to sit outside her room to turn her around immediately and pop her back in bed, no talking to her or anything to reward her like cuddles. I think she might have ventured out a couple of times for a few nights but that was all.

We were told by our HV to let them cry in the night if they woke up but I could not do that but again, I would sort out a feed or change nappy without talking to them in very dim light - it seemed to calm them and convince them that it was still time to sleep.

I think all you can do now your child is almost 3 is try going through a short routine, maybe ending with a story or a lullaby then a quick good night kiss and leave the room. Your child might cry or get out of bed but don’t say anything, just pop them back in bed with another kiss and leave. You might need to do this many times but hopefully it will be come easier and you will get your much needed time in the evenings.

Have you tried a projector OP? Gives some light and gives them something to watch while falling asleep, we’ve got the VTECH polar bear and it has stories, lullaby’s and white noise and projects different coloured stars on the ceiling that change colour, different settings and our LG loves it. I know you can get different ones.

OP I don't know people are being nasty about this, but just ignore.

I have a son the same age (he's my second). He is very similar. He doesn't need singing to, but he wants his dad to sit there next to him while he goes to sleep and if he leaves he will kick off and howl - and I mean howl - for as long as he's left for. Weve always caved because it's awful listening to him cry like that for 20-30 mins (he is very persistent) and also it means his big brother (4) can't sleep either and he then gets upset too. Chaos. It is getting better though (but only because he's falling asleep more quickly). We had the same thing with his big brother and we tried a gradual approach. We got there in the end.

One thing we noticed, however, was that if he wasn't tired enough we had no chance. 90 mins is quite a long time for a 2 and a half year old to nap isn't it? Our son has one hour. Reducing native might help.

Following! You’re not alone!

Christ, what a bunch of twats on this thread. There's a big difference between just turned two and nearly three, so OP was trying to be clear about her son's age.
OP, @Ilovetocrochet 's advice is very good and pretty much what I did myself with my 5 DC. But whatever approach you take now you will have to be firm, patient and consistent. Change won't come overnight, but with firmness and consistence it will come.

In the same boat as you OP so following with interest.

There are some really horrible, catty people on here. Yes she could have just said ‘2’ but maybe OP put the months in to be specific and give us detail as I suspect many people here are parents of little ones and know there’s often a huge difference in toddler development between when they’ve just turned 2 and when they’re almost 3. I took my toddler to a check up recently and kept referring to him as a 1 year old to which they doctor said ‘how many months old is he exactly’? Such a nasty place to be on here at times.

I wouldn’t be so quick to drop the nap although making sure it doesn’t go too long makes sense. The reason why I would not start by dropping the nap is because it seems clear that your child has a problem falling asleep independently at night - it’s not that they used to be able to do it and now something is getting in the way (like not being tired enough, which is a sign of being ready to drop the nap). The issue is that they have never learned how to fall asleep independently at night. Since naps are still the norm for most 2.5 year olds, chances are that it still belongs there.

I agree with PPs that gradual retreat makes sense in this situation.

I am surprised that so many PPs have been rude about your situation. Mumsnet is normally very anti-sleep training but your situation seems like a logical outcome of never sleep training.

Good luck and hang in there!

It your call and your choice. I vividly remember being scared (petrified actually) at bedtime for most of my early years. Usual stuff (the dark, noise, and watching news or reading newspapers, over hearing grown-up conversations about topical horrors) My parents clearly didn’t /couldn’t /wouldn’t sit through it with me. I coped by staying awake as long as could and facing the window interpreting shadows of the trees. Fell asleep mostly way too late for my age, lots of dreams where I screamed but no sound came out. Continued nightly through mount my young childhood until aged around 12 (at a guess) . quite sure I was over tired and affected at school most days.
My approach with my kids ..I went with my learnt experience annd my instinct. I encouraged independent sleep, judged when they were genuinely distressed. I have 2DS, one is now 11 and is secure, independent and sleeps well. My youngest is 9, he still wakes us in the night 50% of the time. We let him sleep with us or 1 of us sleep with him. Can see a gradual decrease in this. This is around the time that DS1 ceased the bedtime and nighttime terrors.
There is no “right way” just your way. What is acceptable to you and your family. I know this is said all the time but genuinely they need you less and less (and push you away) as they get older, then slowly revert back I. Teens and 20’s. For me I suck it up and appreciate that they seeking us out as the centre of their earth and knowing that we will be there. This doesn’t mean being a wet blanket and at time it really exhausts/annoys/wrecks intimacy. My (.limited ) experience and theory is that if they feel secure it will tail off, or you go in with a regime and it will also tail off but they may not feel secure. I know that It may feel like forever but this time is fleeting and you will remember how wonderful it was when they looked and came to you in the night because you were their world and made everything feel safe. Xx hang in. Xx

You have made a rod for your own back! Bath, story, bed is all he needs

Very tricky situation as the child is quite old for sleep training without it being upsetting for them and you.
We never rocked ours to sleep, held them until they dropped off etc as when they wake up they are shocked you’re not there and that’s upsetting for them.

we always put ours to bed awake, read a story and closed the black out blinds, but we did this almost from birth.
Have you tried black out blinds and either soft music or a tape of you telling a story.

It’s important you leave the room when they are awake though.

You must be exhausted so I hope this, or a combination of advice works.
PS. I know this author/ book gets bad press,( I’m guessing from people who haven’t used it) but we and so many of our friends used it and had happy non sleep deprived kids and parents. We have 3 kids ( including twins ) It was even mentioned on ‘The Detectorists ‘ so I’m guessing Mackenzie Crook used it with his kids too. It was our life saver. Author Gina Ford.