Ukraine invasion discussion thread part 11

[ScatteredMama82]

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/_chat/4499310-Ukraine-invasion-discussion-thread-part-10?pg=40

There's talk of Russia getting ready to use chemical weapons now

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/mar/09/britain-fears-russia-could-be-setting-stage-to-use-chemical-weapons?CMP=ShareiOSAppp_Other

I don’t want to sacrifice my life or my child’s life for Ukraine

Where do you live? If it's in the UK you won't be sacrificing your child.

Walking away is not an option.

@newhomenewlife47 that’s unbelievable. You’re not selfish. You’re thinking of your child and your family first. There’s nothing wrong with that.

@RedToothBrush

And as if by magic....

Nigel Farage @nigelfarage
I am launching a new campaign to kill of Boris Johnson’s ruinous green agenda.

We demand a referendum on Net Zero.

Surely less renewables would mean more reliance on gas (and indirectly, Russia)? I'm starting to think that he is working for Putin, not the UK's best interests.

Tiddy that's the gamble though.
How long would Putin repel NATO before collapse.
As a lay arm chair observer, I'd say, not long at all.

However, who would rush to his side? This is the unknown.
If there isn't enough oil for NATO to fight Putin, then what?

@Roussette

I don’t want to sacrifice my life or my child’s life for Ukraine

Where do you live? If it's in the UK you won't be sacrificing your child.

Walking away is not an option.

Will be if it goes nuclear.

If I had the certainty that some of you did I would be more for intervention

I don’t though. It’s a high stake gamble, one that I really don’t want anyone to get wrong.

@Roussette if he used nuclear weapons then yes that will happen. And I want my child to grow up.

We’re not walking away, we’re proving military equipment, imposing sanctions that will hit us as well as them. We’ve given money, people are donating clothes, toys, food etc.
Everything short of a full world war.

..

Newhome - I felt awful but the same thought popped into my head earlier. If Ukraine hadn’t resisted and we hadn’t imposed sanctions this would be old news by now. I still think we (ie Nato) are doing the right thing - once the Ukrainians showed such courage we had little choice. But I hope it’s worth it, only History will tell us that.

@CurryandSnuggle

The latest attack on a maternity unit and children’s hospital makes me sick. This is so disgraceful.

And the footage I saw the other day of a Russian tank deliberately driving over a civilian car (with civilian inside).

These are war crimes!!!

They are war crimes. The horrific attack on the maternity and children's hospital reminds me of the Taliban attack on a maternity hospital a few years ago. It is horrifying.

I'm starting to think that he is working for Putin, not the UK's best interests.

Just starting to think that? Surely not. It’s been clear for years now who Farage has been working for.

HappyWinter
Farage has never, ever had the UK's interests at heart. And, yes, his strings are being pulled by Putin. cf also Bannon, Le Pen, etc.
RT once called him their favourite UK politician, after all.

TiddyTidTwo, do you not think your military background is influencing your view here. I am not from that background and I don't agree. I went with my Grandad to Normandy to collect a medal for his part in the D-day landings. He didn't want to collect the medal on the 50th anniversary ceremony, he was persuaded to collect it by my Dad a couple of months later, this was because after the war he wanted to forget it, have nothing to do with it. He was a strong man, mentally and physically but we went to Gold beach where he had landed and for the first and last time my 15 year old self saw my Grandad cry, it was awful and it was just wrong. He even said to me that he never felt hate or malice towards the German young men he was fighting as they were instructed like him to do what they had to do. This confrontation is not to be stepped in to without thinking about this with the long view in mind.

@AgnesWestern

I don’t want to sacrifice my life or my child’s life for Ukraine.

There I’ve said it. I guess I’m not supposed to say that but I have.

So therefore I don’t want us to get involved.

Conflicts and wars are happening all over the world right now but apparently this one is the most important. And the one that we must end up in world war three (possibly nuclear) for.

You think people who end up in a warzone want to have a war?

The idea of 'not wanting to get involved' isn't one you get a choice in. It will be decided for you. And not by NATO.

Its a decision in the hands of one man at this point. Thats the scariest bit of all.

@Sittinginthesand

Newhome - I felt awful but the same thought popped into my head earlier. If Ukraine hadn’t resisted and we hadn’t imposed sanctions this would be old news by now. I still think we (ie Nato) are doing the right thing - once the Ukrainians showed such courage we had little choice. But I hope it’s worth it, only History will tell us that.

If Russia hadn’t invaded Ukraine it would never have been news. But here we are.

I agree, without the Ukrainian resistance this wouldn't have got the same media coverage, our politicians would have made a few objections to it and then the world would have proceeded with a very realpolitik attitude to the whole situation.

@Roussette

I don’t want to sacrifice my life or my child’s life for Ukraine

Where do you live? If it's in the UK you won't be sacrificing your child.

Walking away is not an option.

If a no fly zone is implemented that would possible cause www3 and then the U.K./ our children would become involved

We’re not walking away, we’re proving military equipment, imposing sanctions that will hit us as well as them. We’ve given money, people are donating clothes, toys, food etc.Everything short of a full world war.

Exactly! And we should carry on doing that. Not stop and walk away. Because you said you don't want us to involved.
That ship has sailed.

Putin won't stop until he's taken Ukraine. He will kill thousands of civilians to achieve that.

And after that, what country will he invade?

Where do we draw the line?

There are so many ethical dilemmas associated with this conflict.

At first I thought ‘my city in Australia should definitely take as many refugees as possible’. I know I’m not in Europe but the refugee numbers are so huge I think it’s going to need many countries outside Europe to take in refugees.

Then I thought to myself that rental vacancies in my city are at record lows and families are unable to find places to live and sofa surfing or living in tents. In other parts of Australia thousands of people have just been made homeless by massive floods.

I want to help Ukrainians but my country is struggling to House it’s own people at the moment. Some of it is due to government policies encouraging crazy house price growth but it doesn’t change the fact that people can’t find housing they can afford.

Despite this I still think Australia should take Ukrainian refugees but how many is a difficult question.

newhome And that is not happening unless I've missed something in the last 10 minutes.

If Ukraine hadn’t resisted and we hadn’t imposed sanctions this would be old news by now

So they should've rolled over?

If Russia hadn’t invaded Ukraine it would never have been news. But here we are.

www.theguardian.com/world/2021/dec/02/ukraine-border-russia-west-troop-buildup

www.economist.com/interactive/2022/02/11/russias-military-build-up-enters-a-more-dangerous-phase

www.aljazeera.com/news/2022/1/24/uk-pulls-staff-from-ukraine-as-fears-of-war-rise-liveblog

All articles written from prior to invasion.

@Roussette

newhome And that is not happening unless I've missed something in the last 10 minutes.

No it's not happening but it was in response to a poster further down saying nato should implement a no fly zone