6 year old DS weeping non stop for up to an hour

[Eastie77Returns]

I’m starting to wonder if something is wrong. DS (6) is bright, generally a happy lovely boy. However he frequently - I would say 2/3 times a week - dissolves into tears, cries uncontrollably for anything up to an hour and refuses point blank to communicate and say what is wrong. This has been going on for a while and my patience is now really wearing thin.

He is currently in the kitchen with DP and has been crying for about 45 mins but will not speak. In fairness I suppose there was a ‘trigger’ this evening. DP picked him up from the childminder and DS then fell asleep soon after arriving home. DP then woke him up when dinner was ready and he has been crying since so I get that he may be tired. However he is not a toddler and is capable of speaking and instead is just hysterically crying. It’s so wearing. He must be exhausted (we tried to put him back to bed) and I’m just pissed off now. I was out with DD at Brownies and if I was here I would have kept him awake to eat dinner but DP parents differently so here we are…

Anyway, there are plenty of other times when tiredness is not a factor and we get the same behaviour. Sometimes after crying for an hour he will suddenly stop and reveal what’s wrong. It’s usually something like his fork fell on the floor, I gave him the wrong coloured socks.

Thank you if you’ve got this far. Does anyone with an older child recognise this behaviour? Fully expect this with a toddler but I find it frustrating with a 6 year old! He has never behaved like this with his CM or at school (both describe him as an angel)

Sounds like he needs to go to bed earlier. Also if he’s crying like that he’s flipped his lid. He can’t tell you what’s wrong and he surely isn’t going to realise he’s just tired and hungry.

I have a child that does hangry to the extreme and is emotionally disregulated a lot, though we have made a lot of progress with that just in the last few months (she is 5.5).
With her I don’t ask i literally do anything I can to get a mouth full of food into her when I know she needs to eat. I also find just sitting there with her in a bear hug can be good for calming down.

There are numerous parenting courses out there to help deal with kids who need a bit of extra help with everything - good ones we have done were cool little kids, circle of security, an emotional well being one and one on sensory processing. The best help though has been the occupational therapist. She had good insight into what we were missing (in what was going on) and it was a few tweaks to our existing routine and suggestions from her that meant by the time we got to the developmental paediatrician we felt a bit silly being there… though I do suspect with the next big leap we will need to do it all again

My 6-year-old (Y2) is very emotional and can cry several times a week.

She's knackered. 3 after school clubs, but home at the latest 5 pm.
Dinner at 6, bed at 7 reading until lights out at 7.30. With earlier nights as needed.

My 4yo DS does this occasionally at home if he's fallen asleep and wakes up suddenly. It's very hard to comfort him. The thing we've found that works for us is to pop him immediately in a warm bath, which calms him down. If he hasn't had dinner, I just give him a cheese sandwich in or after the bath, but no sitting at table. Straight from bath to pyjamas to bed.

Is it angry tears or sad tears? My ds used to hold everything in at school & then it all used to come flooding out when he came out of school. He was diagnosed Asd when he was 9. I used to take him a drink & a snack when I picked him up, I used to drive to the supermarket, park up & give him something like a sausage roll & a smoothie & just sit quietly for 10 minutes, then once he had relaxed go for a walk round the shop or park in the local park, snack & 10 minutes walk, then go home.

I know you are both working parents but maybe you will have to reformulate a bit; can one of you start earlier and leave earlier? If needed, can one of you change jobs where there is a bit more flexibility? It sounds drastic but your child is unhappy, exhausted and you sound overworked (repeating several times you don’t expect this behaviour from a non-toddler). It sounds a bit like you checked out from hands-on parenting. This is the age where kids need less physical things doing for them but they need a lot of emotional support and attention. He spends each day, every day, learning new things at school. He is a shy and introverted boy so this will be even more exhausting for him but it is exhausting for any kid anyway. You’re not prioritising his well-being enough.

This little lad sounds exhausted and overwhelmed. And so do you OP. I think you need to adjust your expectations a bit here, and parent the child you have , not the child you think he should be.

My child has ASD and it’s impossible for us to say if your son is or not, but there is certainly no harm in mentioning this to school, however, this will not magically change how things are at home -

Improving this situation is going to mean change one way or another - can you and /or DP afford to lose some hours at work? Or could you afford 1 to 1 childcare (pt nanny arrangement would work well) ?

I would speak to the childminder about what he eats there. Does he have a packed lunch or hot food at school? The school portions are usually tiny and it could be the childminders are too. Perhaps being less hungry would help. My 6 year old (yr2) is in bed 8.30/9 and from speaking to other parents that is fairly typical. They aren't necessarily ready for bed at 7. I don't think your working and the length of the day needs to be a issue as long as he has enough to eat and enough time to unwind

My DS used to be like this. Years later he has been diagnosed with ASD and has anxiety (not saying your son has those).
One thing I've learned is that children's brains work completely differently - the emotional part of the brain can block the rational part so there's no point trying to reason with them or find out what's wrong when they're upset like that. There's a much more scientific explanation but learning this was a turning point for us. Instead of asking what's wrong we just started to distract him. Put something funny on the TV or start doing something that you "need help" with (my DS still loves fixing things that he thinks I can't do!). Distraction always helped him snap out of it much quicker.

My eldest was like that, 1/2 hour "tantrums" every night at one point. He found a busy school with many children overwhelming, even now needs to de compress, when he s being in a group of people for a while he'll then go spend some time alone in his room

I'd ask the childminder to give an evening 'meal', even if it is only beans on toast or whatever at 5pm and then aim to get the poor child to bed considerably earlier.

If you are erring towards thinking there might be a diagnosis on the cards:

• speak to your GP about a referral to CAMHS, primary schools can be a bit rubbish in that respect.
• but still speak to the SENCO at school about his home behaviour, not just his teacher

With regards to calming him, don't ask him questions at the time as he probably doesn't know why he's crying and this will just stress him out more. Maybe afterwards when he's calm speak to him about what would he like you to do when he feels like that. A hug? A favourite toy? To lie down, back rub?

I was also going to make the point about siestas. In countries where dinner and bed time is late, a sleep after lunch is the norm. This little boy is clearly beside himself with tiredness.

HandfordParishCouncilClerk
“the release of being able to stop once he’s home”

Adults release when they are home/ take off their day’s mask. Are they autistic?

Sorry woke up to 3 more pages of comments so trying to answer all. V grateful for the suggestions.

To clarify re. wake up time, this is the time DS gets up. In fact this morning it was 6.30am. He just leapt out of bed at that time and doesn’t seem tired. He plays quietly with his toys or reads.

I’m reluctant to stop the swimming class because he can’t swim but I’ll look into moving to the weekend. However he has football on Saturdays and I don’t want our weekends to be over-run with activities.

I accept 8.30 is too late. I have always thought this but it’s hard to get them both into bed for 7pm. They are often very hyper. DP doesn’t really help, he likes to play boisterous games with them and when he makes their dinner it’s a drawn out affair. There are issues with his parenting in general tbh (if you ever read my old thread about him taking 1 hour to remove DD from a playdate you'll get the gist..) and I do think last night's episode was partly his fault. I left a batch cooked shepherds pie which just had to go into the oven when they got in at 5.30 but DP decided in his wisdom to wait until I returned home with DD from Brownies before warming it up by which time DS was fast asleep and when he was woken up the crying began.

I will have to adjust work hours which will hopefully be easier now I’m WFH but if I stop work earlier I will have to work late into the evening to catch up which is tricky but doable.

CM reports no problems but again says he can be very quiet. She also says on occasion he can be very loud and screechy. She gives mindees a snack usually fruit, cheese, homemade pizzas, sandwiches. He seems to love it there but given a choice I know he’d prefer to be at home. When she had Covid I picked him up every day from school and I can’t recall any crying episodes.

I am beginning to understand from the responses here that DS actually has very little time to just chill and relax. The CM has 5-6 other mindees with parents coming and going so it's a busy environment. DD has always thrived there and loves the hustle and bustle but DS obviously needs something different.

I have mentioned my concerns to CM btw. She rolled her eyes and said she knows a child on the spectrum when she sees one and DS is fine.

I will look into bullying. When he was playing at home with his toys recently I overheard him role playing and saying “you’re so weird [DS name]” and I’m wondering if kids are saying this to him at school? He doesn’t get party invites whereas DD had a lot at his age (I may be overthinking as Covid has reduced parties).

Right so you have a partner who winds up a hungry, overstressed and overtired child.

You need to work together as a team to resolve this issue. Men who play boisterous games with children really fuck me off. He's a parent and he needs to grow up.

Your children need to be in bed earlier and they need a good routine that you both stick to.

It is nice you feel you can definitely pick out some new approaches and adjustments to adopt so as to try to help your DS.

Good luck. He is probably just a quiet, contemplative sort of person who has too much going on.

Op "CM reports no problems but again says he can be very quiet"

This little chap definitely needs more quiet time.

I appreciate your DP is being a nuisance here. Just a suggestion though - dinners should be easier than, if I've got this right, a shpherd's pie that's been prepped but not cooked?

Can swimming be sorted in school holidays?

DP "waiting" for you sounds like he just cba.

6 is still little IMHO. Some kids, just like adults, thrive in being busy.,others don't.

I admit I am probably more sympathetic as I was the quiet child and many weekends my parents changed plans so one could be quiet with me and the other ferry my sister to all her things that she liked.

If you're working from home, would it make sense for DS to come home instead of the CM, and go to bed for a couple of hours sleep? That way you could still work and he would get the wind down time he needs, and you could continue the family routine of dinner and bed quite late.

OP it sound like DS leans more towards introverted while DD may be more extroverted?

I'm an introvert, I find the act of just being around other people tiring/draining. As I've aged I've found ways to enjoy being around people and to recognise for myself when I'm reaching my limit and need to find a quiet place for a few minutes to just breathe and rest my brain.

It may be worth taking some time to work with your DS on this, there's a book called Mind Hug that I got for my DD when she was 5 which talks about having a few minutes of quiet to listen to your thoughts and calm down if you're feeling over whelmed. When we were reading it she didn't seem that into it 😂 but every now and then afterwards she'd say something like, my brain's feeling busy and loud and I just want to sit down somewhere quiet for a minute, so it clearly went in.

You need to work, so that's just that, it's about making the most of the time you do have and recognising that things like an early bedtime and reduced evening time for the family are short term issues, as he gets a bit older he'll get less tired.

Also year 1 is a bugger of a transition. DD was completely cream crackered after school in year 1, there was a big improvement in year 2 as the transition in learning style and expectations was much less drastic.

@Clymene

Right so you have a partner who winds up a hungry, overstressed and overtired child.

You need to work together as a team to resolve this issue. Men who play boisterous games with children really fuck me off. He's a parent and he needs to grow up.

Your children need to be in bed earlier and they need a good routine that you both stick to.

Or the DH spends time interacting with the children and having fun with them. Nothing wrong with that. When else does it happen if not during that short time? You don’t like fathers being boisterous with their sons?

CoronaWireless
“You don’t like fathers being boisterous with their sons?”

It whips up adrenaline, so the end of a long day, before bed is the wrong time.

@ScrollingLeaves

CoronaWireless “You don’t like fathers being boisterous with their sons?”

It whips up adrenaline, so the end of a long day, before bed is the wrong time.

Quite. Not because I'm a horrid feminist

My 10yo sounds similar (now diagnosed with ADHD but a bunch of other stuff in the background). He needs time to play by himself, tell himself stories, fence with his own reflection, sit in his own bedroom, etc about as much as he needs to breathe.

My MIL was in town earlier in the month so he didn't get as much down time (and she kept trying to keep him up late). He was visibly struggling, and yes, sometimes it will come out as an almighty explosion.
Basically he needs a rigid routine winding down from about 7.15, with lots of built in time to himself, otherwise the demands of his life just overwhelm him.

We both worked FT and 6pm pick up from nursery as well. I remember DS being shattered tired and cranky at that time. It was a long day away from home.

Then when he started school it was a bit better as he went to his cousins house after school so it was more of a homely environment but very often he would have flaked out after school - I think the whole social change from nursery into school was tiring for him emotionally. We would just cuddle on the sofa those days and he knew he was allowed to feel sad and process it without having to have a reason or explanation. And once the pressure was off for him to explain it, he would snuggle up for Mummy cuddles and would calm down very quickly after that. Sometimes he was just 'sad' but other days he was able to identify what set him off and it was good for him to learn to identify feelings like that.

My lad is also a quiet boy and often needed space. He's still a little introverted but absolutely fine.

So I would say probably if I were you, just settle down with cuddles letting DP crack on with dinner, let him bawl it out of his system for a few minutes and then maybe distraction via his favourite tv show - still snuggled up to you. It won't be forever and you won't be forming bad habits.

It's also the time of year - darker evenings don't help and also with very young children you can see them getting exhausted towards the end of term. Add in to that the excitement /stress of Christmas it's probably just all adding up to a perfect but temporary storm.

Just to add on to everything that has already been said, there is such a jump of expectation from Yr to y1, couple that with late nights and 2 really long terms he must be mentally exhausted. I think he needs much more rest.