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Original poster

Can't find the thread on missing Madeleine (hope I have spelt her name correct)

210 replies

notsodimwit · 17/06/2020 17:24

Can't find the tread Sad

OP posts:
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6
Original poster
notsodimwit · 17/06/2020 17:26

Thread not tread Blush

OP posts:
Angelnix · 17/06/2020 17:45

It was deleted overnight/this morning due to speculation. Shame that a few felt the need to do that on what was an interesting thread

Original poster
notsodimwit · 17/06/2020 17:51

It was 🙁

OP posts:
SouthWestmom · 17/06/2020 19:30

On Madeleine McCann? I was hoping to read an update on here. Reddit is full of gruesome speculation.

Blackbear19 · 18/06/2020 15:29

It was deleted but CB has been linked with another disappearance 23 years ago.

Frownette · 18/06/2020 15:45

I can't understand why all these details are in the press, surely nothing should be put out yet

BernadetteRostankowskiWolowitz · 18/06/2020 15:47

If he ends up at trial, it will be nigh on impossible to find a suitable jury. How the hell can anyone serve on a Jury for this? There's been so so much info/false leads/speculation/suspects. Everyone I know has a preconceived idea of what happened to her.

Blackbear19 · 18/06/2020 15:54

People may have preconceived ideas but they have to judge on the evidence that is presented to them.

Heygirlheyboy · 18/06/2020 15:56

Apparently in Germany it would not be in front of a jury. Such a pity the whole thread went.

deepwatersolo · 18/06/2020 17:55

Yeah, I was also looking for the thread. And, yes, Frownette, I do wonder why so much has been leaked about 'new evidence'. I hope German police know what they are doing, but I am not at all sure.

Dominicgoings · 18/06/2020 18:04

Thankfully it was deleted. The macabre speculation and armchair detectives obsessed with this case and adamant that they know MUCH more that the actual police holding the actual evidence will hopefully find threads elsewhere on the internet to entertain them.
Hoping for resolution for the McCanns soon.

deepwatersolo · 18/06/2020 18:06

And yeah, as I understand it, for a trial by jury in Germany, you'd need a case where the expected penalty is no more that 4 years. So, I guess it is safe to say that CB will not be tried in front of a jury, if he is ever tried for MM or some other disappeared kid.

In the Spielgel TV clip one of his acquaintances relates that CB had a garden with a shed at one point, and the shed had a cellar (part of the floor/ceiling missing), and CB apparently had this dream of remodelling it to get some kind of dungeon there, the way Fritzl had it.
(Fritzl is the guy who had his daughter in the cellar for 20 years or so.)

How on Earth can you have anyone tell you something like that and not go to police!?!?

Cheesecake53 · 18/06/2020 18:20

There is no trial by Jury in Germany.

deepwatersolo · 18/06/2020 18:25

There is no trial by Jury in Germany.

There are, actually, trials by jury (Schöffengerichte) in Germany, but not for offences that carry heavy sentences.

Arewedone · 18/06/2020 18:41

Ooo glad I’ve found this. The last thread went awry

Blackbear19 · 18/06/2020 19:15

Deepwater well everyday is a school day! I did assumed everywhere had trial by jury.

I can't decide if that is a good thing or not. But I guess the very nature of an amature jury is they may not pick up on the significance of some evidence.

Daft question, Germany doesn't have "Not Proven" does it? ie not enough evidence to prove guilt beyond doubt and nor is their enough to clear the person completely?

About 15 years ago, a man got off with Not Proven in a horrible rape / murder case in Scotland. I'm half convinced members of the jury were intimidated or were completely convinced by the defence lawyer in a way that a panel of judges wouldn't have been.

deepwatersolo · 18/06/2020 19:48

I do hope that Portuguese authorities will cooperate with German police. Some news articles suggest they don't want to let them retest samples for DNA, because they already did it...

Which would be silly, after all DNA testing has made great advances, this is not about 'the Portuguese didn't do it right'. I hope this is not an issue and papers are just playing it up for lack of other news.

deepwatersolo · 18/06/2020 20:06

I guess 'not proven' is the same as 'aus Mangel an Beweisen ' - basically, not guilty 'for not enough evidence' (I am not an expert on this). This was a thing, I believe, but they don't use it any more.

I like the idea of a jury, it feels less authoritarian and more democratic, in practice beside advantages it can have disadvantages, I guess (like impressionable juries).

Germany does have the rule that once you get a 'not guilty' verdict, you can't be tried again. There is a case of a guy who got a non guilty verdict on a murder, later was proven to be the murderer via DNA but then could not be prosecuted. (I got aware of that only recently, always thought this was a US (and UK?) thing).

So, I sure hope the case against CB will be water tight.

Blackbear19 · 18/06/2020 21:24

I really hope the case against CB will be water tight too. There seem to be so many parents and families involve.

Deepwater that sounds exactly like Not Proven in Scotland, its quite controversial in that the accused name is never completely clear.
I just looked up the case of the girl I was thinking about I was wrong about the rape but she was found half naked. And as ywe have the same rule you can't be tried again for murder.
Basically they know it was him, but they couldn't prove beyond reasonable doubt he killed her.

SouthWestmom · 18/06/2020 23:46

I'm interested in developments and other cases so was looking for an update. I dropped out of one of the threads here because it was getting a bit weird.

xsquared · 19/06/2020 00:01

Probably the right decision to delete it tbh. I commented on the first thread, when a new suspect was announced, but I was surprised to see a third thread still standing after increasing speculation.

LaurieFairyCake · 19/06/2020 00:03

Have they found a body?

Frownette · 19/06/2020 00:48

Not that I know of...last I heard Portuguese authorities were refusing to cooperate with the German ones.

I wish the press hadn't whipped themselves up into a frenzy about this, they have a lot to answer for because it encourages wild speculation

XDownwiththissortofthingX · 19/06/2020 03:11

'Not Proven' is a hangover from the days when there were only two verdicts in Scots law, 'Proven', and 'Not Proven'.

It's a complete fallacy that juries returning 'Not Proven' means the accused is somehow less innocent than if they had returned 'Not Guilty', and indeed, many people, myself included, believe the problem with the three verdict system lies with 'Not Guilty' and it's that verdict which should be dispensed with altogether.

The task of a jury in Scotland is not to decide guilt, but to decide whether or not the prosecution has proven their case beyond all reasonable doubt. To that end, the sensible thing to do would be to return to a system of simple 'Proven' and 'Not Proven' verdicts exclusively.

KatherineJaneway · 19/06/2020 04:19

It was unfortunate it was deleted. I started the original thread of the series to discuss the new suspect as I felt this was the first credible lead in the case.