What would put you off becoming close friends with another woman?

[JungleRaisin]

I’ve never been able to manage to have a close friendship with another woman. Not in primary school, high school, sixth form, uni, or work.

They always see ‘be yourself’ but that clearly isn’t working for me. Makes me sad thinking I’m always going to have to put on a fake persona of normality if I am ever to make any female friends :(. I don’t know exactly what I’m doing wrong,

Please tell me your pet peeves in other women during the first convos that would put you off pursuing a close friendship with them? It seems faulty universal among women so any pounders would help.

I don’t massively struggle with getting male friends but I guess they don’t spot the social faux pas as much as women do.

I’m described as chatty, witty, always friendly, too nice (I.e everyone thinks I’d never lose my temper) but also a little cold so if I’ve any real bad traits, people clearly aren’t telling me about them. I think I am fairly intense and ask a lot of questions about someone’s life even on day 1 but also over-share about myself a bit.

Any tips?

The things that put me off getting to know a potential new friend are:

If they ask for favours.

If they moan a lot.

If they talk 'at' me about themselves constantly and don't let me get a single word in.

Do you get on well with women when you first meet them but can’t start up a friendship or are you saying you get rejection vibes even in the first meeting with other women? X

I only know one woman who doesn’t seem to have female friends. She has this vibe of insincerity and seems to be only interested in people insofar as they can help her get ahead. Women seem able to spot this more.

Neediness! If a female is coming across as quite needy and intense I back off as I find it draining.

@CuriousPixie
Could you elaborate on examples of behaviour/speech in a woman in the first few convos that would suggest neediness and intensity that would put you off?

Thanks everyone for your responses so far. It’s hard to tell when the woman starts rejecting me - as everyone is fairly diplomatic but I can definitely sense it in the early stages. I never have the situation of establishing a lengthy friendship and then it ending because of a row - it never gets that far.

I'm not CuriousPixie, but for me, I would define neediness from a potential friend as someone who wants constant contact, whether that's in the form of meeting up, texting, FB message, phone calls, etc. When my DS first started school the mum of one of his new friends instantly tried to become friends with me and literally wanted to spend every hour possible with me. She would also text constantly and got stroppy if I didn't reply immediately. It was all just too intense and too much hard work.

I'd also define someone who seems to have a large myriad of problems as needy, especially when they talk about said problems constantly but won't do a thing to help themselves. I became friends with a neighbour but had to distance myself from her after a few weeks as she seemed to have problem after problem, and got her knickers in a twist about every little thing, whilst expecting me to be her sounding board.

This really applies to men and women for me.

Asking too many intrusive, nosey questions straight off the bat. Equally, too much personal disclosure early on and using me as a therapist rather than working towards a balanced friendship.

Loud, dominant personality. I avoid attention seekers at all costs. Cannot stand anyone who boasts and brags, its really off putting.

Putting down other people, gossipy, judgemental.

I don’t like an abrupt, sweary, shock factor type of sense of humour or the type of humour where you always end up as the butt of the other persons humour. I had an acquaintance who would always call people “you stupid twat” or “you big fat wanker” as a term of endearment and always had to give put downs disguised as a joke. So that’s the kind of person I personally find it difficult to warm to but other people I’d imagine would be very different and find me too reserved.

Emotionally tone deaf.

I’m sure you aren’t any of those things!

Reasons I’ve been shunned; too “nice”, too “reserved”, too “ladylike”, too posh, too sensitive, “can’t let go”, because I wouldn’t get drawn into gossip, too dramatic, too desperate to be liked, too much of a goodie two shoes. Some true, some not, some due to just not knowing me well enough to know that there are other sides to me too. As there are to everyone.

From my own POV, trying to be liked by everyone made me less likeable. I’ve been more popular since I stopped trying to impress people. If someone doesn’t like me I just don’t care anymore. I don’t like everyone, why should everyone like me?

Good luck. I know it can be horrible to feel like you are being shunned all the time.

Thanks @NameChange84
Those are some very good points and I appreciate the detail! What kind of things would you consider being asked too intrusive in the first few convos? What kinda things are too much personal disclosure?

Over sharing in the early stages would definitely put me off. I met a woman once at work who told me pretty much her whole life story on her first day and then decided we were now best friends and wouldn't leave me alone. Following others social cues may work better for you. No problem sharing lots with someone who is also comfortable sharing, but if someone is more reserved start with friendly casual conversations

Are you really attractive, op?

@Blessed2496 what kind of topics would you consider casual yet interesting enough personally? How well would you want to know someone before you delve into more personal things?

@managedmis haha it totally varies. Some days I can be a 8 on the hotness scale and at other times I can be a 2. Totally depends on hormones, diet, how much effort I make..!

I’m guessing you are probably quite, if not very, physically attractive. So women will think with the oversharing... why? What’s this in aid of? And so on.
Men would just be happy to be around you.
I’m ready to be told I’m wrong..
Asking very or seemingly personal questions would make me clam up and think “oh fuck off”.
So, I suppose it’s finding a middle ground.
Trying not to do too much to make something happen.
Talk about neutral things or listen to them (not saying you don’t) but pick up on things. If someone says they are tired, say something generic and follow it up.
It’s hard for me to give advice tbh- I don’t automatically make female friends (unless they drink as much as me - not good)

I don’t have any tips for you, but I’m in the same boat. I really want a close friendship but I am similar in that I’m happy to skip the small talk and go straight for life stuff, I think a lot of people aren’t as comfortable being open and find that hard.

I’m 30 with no kids and feel like I’ve missed the boat! Feel free to dm if you want to

Neediness but also being too cold.

It's a hard balance if you're not naturally outgoing.

People always say to ask questions and listen a lot but some people take that advice way too far and just fire question after question at you while never revealing anything about themselves and I find that quite draining.

Likewise doing stuff like offering to help with things or buying little gifts - it just makes people feel indebted.

People always like me but I find it hard to let them get close.

I’m sorry you’re feeling this right now, OP. I don’t form many female friendships, and tend to get “talked about” by people I have never met or have barely been introduced to. Do you work in a male dominated industry? I tore myself apart about this when I was in university, and just came to accept that I have many, close male friends who love spending time with me simply because we think more alike. I think it’s a “in the wiring” thing unless you genuinely have bad traits that you haven’t recognised/been told about.

I struggle at listening to problems without providing solutions: so, I will sympathise and troubleshoot rather than just the former. I’ve been told that is quite irritating as that’s not what is wanted, and makes some people feel like they “owe me”. I get the “cold”/“bitch” description too but only from women and generally those who have never met me before, but get described as outgoing by my friends (including the few women!)

I guess the question is, why does the gender of friends matter? I basically came to believe it doesn’t really, and eventually weaned myself off worrying about it and devoting my energy into the great friendships I already had.

I don't really do close female friendships any more. Fell out with my last one seven years ago. She was too intense.
A few women have tried to get really friendly with me over the last few years and I've shut it down.
Things that put me off are
lots of texts
Lots of tagging on Facebook
People who overshare too soon
Equally people who don't give a little of their problems/ lives at the right time.
People pushing me into nights out.
People who don't value my time/ are late a lot.

I feel for you tbh because it's difficult to learn how to have female friendships. Just like it's difficult to hit it off with the right guy.

The kind of woman who says she can never make friends with other women, as though other women are some kind of alien species, and men are kind, lumbering, basic types who’re oh so much easier to befriend.

@dromberg Right??? "women are so catty and gossipy and I like computer games so I can only get on with men."

Someone who only wants to chat about superficial things. I find this kind of chat very mundane. I need more than that to feel bonded to someone.

Someone who overshares but equally, someone who holds back and doesn't give anything away. It's impossible to get close to someone who simply doesn't talk about their lives, or if they do, it's always in the most glowing terms as if they are afraid to show any vulnerability. Don't get me wrong, I have a lovely life, but I have found that when I am willing to chat about the less sparkly aspects of my life, people seem to relax and warm to me, as I'm being 'real'. I'm always drawn to people who are willing to give a little away about themselves, nothing too personal, but I think it makes me feel like they are confiding in me, which makes me feel more bonded and closer to someone.

If people dislike you at a very early stage of meeting you then yes something is wrong. Can you give some examples?

@BossAssBitch You've just described why I can't warm to this woman I work with.

She's very lovely but like...TOO lovely. Everything in her life is perfect and great all the time and she never ever complains about anything.

It just always seems a bit false.

Examples of real people I avoid (men and women, both at work and on the school run)

Seems desperate for friends. Calls us her family, says she loves us etc. Generally trying to advance past acquaintance and friendship too quickly in order to find a "squad" for herself. We just have children in the same class, we're not sisters. Basically people who want to skip all the steps.

Immediate neediness where I worry the person is going to want a lot of my time. Again, it's skipping steps. I give my close friends a lot of my time and vice versa but there's a foundation there.

People who add me to Facebook after one chat and then I see all their posts about "knowing who your friends are...." and various passive aggressive, attention seeking shite. Vaguebooking and fishing for likes etc. I'll never be able to do enough for them. Hide and avoid.

The ones who talk at me. Not in a nervous way, I don't mind that, but constant, overly-confident, boastful monologues. I get nothing from the interaction, I'm just a pair of eyes to them.

If they look mean.

If they are inane.

If they look me up and down.

If I'm nice and they're reticent.

If they ask questions about work, husband, house location, etc.

Biggest flag: if they immediately bitch about someone/something.

It’s too hard listing stuff it’s like a chemistry really if you click or not

Re the questioning...it’s when you have questions constantly fired at you and some of them very personal. Are you married? Why not? Do you have a boyfriend? Why not? Do you have children? Don’t you want children? Asking where exactly I live. Wanting to know too many details about my work. If we know someone in common asking probing questions about them via me.

Some things that are actually recommended to ask in shitty self help books like “what hobbies do you do?” “Doing anything fun this weekend?” “Have you got any holidays planned?” etc can actually be horribly awkward to be on the receiving end of. It’s forced conversation and sometimes you have accept that the other person might not want to take part. Maybe they find the weekends really lonely. Or they don’t have the time or confidence for hobbies or the money for a holiday. And you are the person drawing attention to all of that whilst they think, “ffs, please go away and stop asking me about my shitty life”. Or maybe they are terrified this complete stranger who seems to be latching on to them will turn up at their favourite hobby where they go for a bit of peace.

Yes, yes, yes to the “looking me up and down”.

Anything basically that makes you feel you are being scrutinised or judged.

Please if we’ve literally just met, don’t tell me about your ex or your health problems or your deepest, darkest needs and wants. It comes across as needy and like you will sap my energy levels which already aren’t that great.

Some people are private.

Maybe its the setting you are in Op. Some hobbies naturally lend themselves to free and easy conversations. Yoga, no. Choir maybe. Volunteering at a soup kitchen or “Knit and Knatter”, definitely.