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to ask why people still do not believe that Islamophobia doesn’t exist and therefore doesn’t need an official definition?

332 replies

AdvicePleas · 02/08/2024 00:43

This is a question for the general public , After the recent events , where a horrific unimaginable event that has left a community and parents shattered , reeling from the loss of their babies - the first thing that a significant group did was to attack who they thought were to blame.
and it was the Muslim community.
without verification , confirmation , the hatred was palpable -it was always there.

As a muslim ; every time something like this happens, I know all of us pause and are frightened whether the perpetrators are Muslim and - when they are not - then there are no fingers pointed to whether their religion is to blame for their actions.
the entire community isn’t put to trial.
I am so sad for the senseless loss that the parents and families are going through.
My heart goes our to them,
as my friend who is a hijab wearing Muslim said earlier today -thank god he wasn’t Muslim otherwise they would have come and killed us in our sleep. It hit me to the core how much some people hate us?
I feel this is an injustice to my 70 year old mother who prays 5 times a day, loves her god and has not harmed a single person in her life , my sister who is a confidant professional woman but will not travel out of multi cultural areas for fear of being attacked.

still the government refused to put an official definition for Islamophobia?
having grown experiencing huge levels of it in the early 90/ , I feel that those that do not believe that the Muslim community are hated by other for simply being Muslim are just ignoring it or are part of the problem .
I feel sad for my children , who don’t speak the language their parents speak, only belong to this country but look visibly different and belong to a religion that is hated so much and the government can’t protect them.

OP posts:
Humdingerydoo · 05/08/2024 07:52

AdvicePleas · 05/08/2024 04:53

Thank you for your comments calling this out - it is appreciated.
Especially on a thread quite literally designed to ask how to tackle this - it is very telling isn’t jt?

Do you not think having a clear definition of what antisemitism has helped?

No, it really doesn't seem to have helped. People spend an awful lot of time saying they don't care what the the definition says because they disagree with it and they're not being antisemitic when they say X Y and Z because they have a Jewish friend, don'tcha know, so it's impossible for them to be antisemitic.

AdvicePleas · 05/08/2024 09:44

Humdingerydoo · 05/08/2024 07:52

No, it really doesn't seem to have helped. People spend an awful lot of time saying they don't care what the the definition says because they disagree with it and they're not being antisemitic when they say X Y and Z because they have a Jewish friend, don'tcha know, so it's impossible for them to be antisemitic.

But the guidelines means you can see still think
hmm… If it looks like a duck, swims like a duck, and quacks like a duck, then it probably is a duck..’’ even if it denies it’s not one 🙃

there seems to a be a lot of posters here who know a Muslim woman- very well that is either being forced to wear a hijab, in an awful marriage , being controlled or friends with Muslims but they sill hate everything Islam represents?
hmmm.
again the above information wasn’t relevant to this post l.

Don’t get me wrong , I do think prejudice can sometimes be nuanced and we do need to sometimes look inwardly and reflect and if you can do that when someone’s calls you out , then that’s helpful. A lot of work , but many would rather create camps that we sit in.

OP posts:
Humdingerydoo · 05/08/2024 11:05

AdvicePleas · 05/08/2024 09:44

But the guidelines means you can see still think
hmm… If it looks like a duck, swims like a duck, and quacks like a duck, then it probably is a duck..’’ even if it denies it’s not one 🙃

there seems to a be a lot of posters here who know a Muslim woman- very well that is either being forced to wear a hijab, in an awful marriage , being controlled or friends with Muslims but they sill hate everything Islam represents?
hmmm.
again the above information wasn’t relevant to this post l.

Don’t get me wrong , I do think prejudice can sometimes be nuanced and we do need to sometimes look inwardly and reflect and if you can do that when someone’s calls you out , then that’s helpful. A lot of work , but many would rather create camps that we sit in.

Even when identified as a duck they usually have a lot of other people quacking their support right behind them, spurring them on and defending them and quacking on about how it's actually my fault as I'm hearing the words and not the supposed intent or meaning. Gaslighting is a big issue with racists. Having a definition genuinely doesn't seem to have helped, at least not in my experience. That's not to say there shouldn't be one, I'm just saying it doesn't seem to have made a difference to individuals affected by antisemitism, so I'm assuming it would be the same for those suffering at the hands of Islamophobes.

Mumandcarer80 · 06/08/2024 09:00

AdvicePleas · 02/08/2024 18:35

Thank you for those that actually responded to the original question .

Looking at the thread, it seems it has been derailed and monopolised into an opportunity to bash women that wear hijabs with a thinly disguised veil of ‘concern’.
And that is a form of Islamophobia that I am talking about -
Those that have discussed why women are being controlled , being made to cover up would never care about women’s rights in other context, why other religions have head covering, turbans , clothing etc etc but it’s an issue if it’s Muslims .

muslim women as all women are not one homogeneous group, we do not represent anyone but ourselves , however this is not the topic of the thread.

If there was a working definition of islamaphobia ot whatever you want to call it , what do you think it should include?

It's ignorance nobody says anything about a church priest or the pope.

There's a local Buddhist centre in a town close to where I live. There's a woods on site that the public are allowed to access. We often see the monks in the grounds they run a cafe in the centre. Also see them out in the community in their marroon robes.

NewGreenDuck · 06/08/2024 13:49

Actually I don't mind criticising any religion, but this thread was about Islamophobia, not a general thread about religion and whether it's good, whether criticism is OK, how far that should go, if there should be blasphemy laws etc. If a thread on that is started I would contribute.

EilonwyWithRedGoldHair · 06/08/2024 14:39

AdvicePleas · 05/08/2024 09:44

But the guidelines means you can see still think
hmm… If it looks like a duck, swims like a duck, and quacks like a duck, then it probably is a duck..’’ even if it denies it’s not one 🙃

there seems to a be a lot of posters here who know a Muslim woman- very well that is either being forced to wear a hijab, in an awful marriage , being controlled or friends with Muslims but they sill hate everything Islam represents?
hmmm.
again the above information wasn’t relevant to this post l.

Don’t get me wrong , I do think prejudice can sometimes be nuanced and we do need to sometimes look inwardly and reflect and if you can do that when someone’s calls you out , then that’s helpful. A lot of work , but many would rather create camps that we sit in.

On the other side of that, I had a Muslim friend for a number of years who didn't wear a head scarf because she was too scared of receiving abuse from Islamophobic/racist twats on the street.

I don't think people should be forced to dress in a certain way no matter which side the pressure is coming from.

mummytelling · 07/08/2024 16:29

I went to an inner city London school. Lots of my good friends were from the Middle East / Muslim. I am white British (not ethnically English tho). Muslims are some of the nicest hospitable people you could meet. however I think of late the religion doesn't help itself. There are elements within it that are extremely non-compromising and not accepting of other religions either. Not individuals as such but the religion as a whole. I think recently in Iraq, under principles of sharia, they will also reduce age a girl can marry from 15 to 9, and it's these kind of actions in Muslim countries under the principles of Islam, which make some people very apprehensive of what the religion means to people here in Britain. I'm not criticising, I'm just saying many things done in the name of Islam, make some people fearful of it.

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