to ask why people still do not believe that Islamophobia doesn’t exist and therefore doesn’t need an official definition?

Solidarity with you sis. I hope this thread doesn't get derailed.

How could the hijab possibly have anything to do with the attitudes of the Southport killer when he wasn't even a Muslim?

OP, I hear you. Islamophobia is real and it seems to be getting worse. I hope that you and your loved ones are OK.

FFS, he was not Muslim. How many times do you have to be told.

OP I agree with you. I hope you and your family are okay. I'm sorry you have to live like this.

I don't suppose that anyone can really disagree with the OP when the first response illustrates the nature of the problem so effectively.

I think the UK is a pretty tolerant country tbh. We accept people for who they are on the whole. We have equality laws, hate crime legislation and always promote diversity and inclusion. Just like there are extremists within the Muslim community, there are extremists in other communities. However, these are the minority. Most people are pretty accepting and tolerant, otherwise we wouldn’t have such diverse ethnic groups, races, religions and events like pride, etc. No-ones holding pride events in Saudi or Russia. Catholics are being killed by Boko haram in Nigeria. We don’t stone women to death in this country for being raped and calling it adultery. There are far more dangerous places to be a minority in the world than the UK. I’m not blaming an entire community/race or religion for the actions of an extreme minority and I don’t think the majority of British people are either.

He could be an incel. The choosing of that event and the choosing of the Women's hospital hasn't been decided based on nothing.
During Covid the Mosques were still providing prayer for men. The women were protesting and trying to raise public awareness. But they were beaten down by the Equality act and sex not being protected. But not really beaten down as such, more just mumbled about and ignored until it went away. Life across many countries is appalling for women. Which is why religion and culture needs to be seperate and then education about Islam started. I think that education on what Jewish people have contributed was always the way to govto remove the hatred. However I will never accept a religion that tells me that I'm a second class citizen.

I think it depends on the definition really and whether thats expanded to other religions. People must be free to criticise and mock religion, it’s a fundamental part of freedom of speech. What I worry about is blasphemy laws through the back door or only one religion having protection from mockery and criticism.

Harm and abuse to an individual person is already covered by hate speech law and other legislation.

I’m an atheist and I’d rather have less protection for religion than more to be frank. I’m asian and can completely understand how it’s a mix of racism and religious prejudice that people face. But I am extremely wary of any law which can be used to make valid criticism an offence.

He might have been an incel but what the fuck does that have to do with two little girls on a swing wearing hijabs?

You have no idea why they were wearing what they were wearing. For all you know, they weren't doing it for reasons of "modesty" but because they wanted to dress like their mum!

And their mum wasn't necessarily wearing the hijab because she is a second class citizen either... maybe she actually wants to wear it and has her own reasons for that?

There are so many assumptions in your post, it's hard to know where to start.

How was their play being hampered?

Simple truth is that little kids like to copy older people. They see their older sisters and cousins wearing head scarves and they want to copy to feel grown up. It’s difficult to stop even if you wanted to. I can’t see how it hampers play though, it’s just a piece of cloth.

I am extremely wary of any law which can be used to make valid criticism an offence.

Me, too. Thank you for your perfectly expressed post.

I don't doubt that Islamophobia exists, just as bigotry against eastern Europeans or West Africans exists, as it exists against women and homosexuals and trans.

We already have anti-hate and anti-discrimination legislation. Why do we need something specific for Islam?

As an aside, I wish we could come up with a different descriptive word to describe hijab wearing other than ' modest' clothing. Who defines modesty? What on earth does it really mean? Someone helpfully pointed out on another thread that it's far better than choosing ' indecent ' dress which attracts the male gaze. Perhaps she was being clumsy with her choice of words, but it felt unsettling to suggest that a woman's character could be determined by their choice of dress. So yes I agree, women should be able to wear what they bloody well want without judgement. Bikinis/ hijabs/ abaya/ boob tubes all absolutely acceptable!

I think people are confused with regards to Muslims

There are so many different off shoots doing devastating things

There is conflict within families who when members don't tie the line as it were

We are culturally at odds with the nature of this religion at times

It's hard to see women being treated badly re arranged marriages and honour killings when they refuse

It's difficult to get your head around at times

The anti Muslim backlash was sparked because social media made a bunch of assumptions. In the hours after the attack it was rife with posts that the attacker was man named Ali who came over on a boat last year. Even good old Laurence Fox posted that before the police confirmed otherwise. And that alone shows what Muslims have to face.

A white man killed 3 people in Bushey and no one protested. A non white man killed 3 people in Southport and the rumours and false allegations started culminating in the hate riots.

That’s culture, not religion. The very fact that it happens amongst Hindus and Sikhs tells you that…

Hope that helps you get your head around it.