As a woman, you can’t just go to work and go home 🙄.

[joseline]

i recently got my graphic design job months ago and I really like the job so far.

i have been working for 8 months.

but a week ago, I got called out by my manager who is also a woman because I don’t interact with other coworkers other then good morning or have a good evening. I only talk to them about the work at hand but I never have small talks, I never have lunch with them. I do my job and go home.

my boss called me out because, a woman coworker recently came out after being on leave. I don’t know why and I do not care. It’s not my business. When she came back I didn’t welcome her cheerfully. I said good morning to her like everyone else. And it’s not like this coworker has no work friends, I basically got called out because I am not kissing her ass.

i am not the only one who have gone through those petty dramas over nothing.

my women cousins told me stories of other women at various jobs they worked at starting ridiculous conflicts because they just did their job and went home and didn’t wanna be buddy buddy with their women coworkers.

I am starting to think that there is a ridiculous unspoken rule of being a girl’s girl and you’ll a social outcast when you refuse to be in a clique.

I understand there are cases of women getting harassed by men at work but in my personal experience whenever I’ve had any sort of beef with coworkers, it’s always been other women. The men always left me alone.

are me and my cousins the only ones who experienced those phenomenons ?

The other thread was a year ago

predict a deletion coming up…

Both men and women are expected to smile and nod appropriately at work.

For women that can involve feigning interest in other women’s personal drama and an interest in [insert latest reality TV thing]. But women are tricky in that you have to seem ‘genuine’ or they will bad mouth you.

Men get a better time of it in many ways because they just choose ‘their’ sport or music genre or acceptable hobby (gaming, fishing etc etc) and take it in turns talking AT each other about their interest. They then just have to laugh along at the rude/cheesy jokes made about their interest and everyone is happy.

This is adult life. You don’t HAVE to get on board but if you don’t you may struggle to ‘get on’ in the workplace- depending on career.

Unnecessary. You do not even know the OP.

I'd say it's a workplace culture issue. Some people see work as an extension of their social life. Others see it as a means to an end and have pressing issues at home to deal with.

I've been at both ends of the spectrum, when younger I went out for after works drinks and all sorts. With a young family I got my work done and was gone.

The work place culture should all types and not expect only one type of behaviour.

The fact that you’re polite and diligent in doing your job should be enough,

What was the requested outcome from this manager - what does she want to change exactly ?

It's really tricky to maintain the boundary between what is professional and what is friendly so I get why people might rather just not engage.

There has been a definite shift imo since social media has gained in popularity and also since COVID it feels as though people are keener to maintain those personal/professional boundaries. I have to admit, whilst I'm busy and have less time, I really miss having work friends who want to go for lunch etc. It's the main adult company that isn't associated with my kids in any respect so it'd be nice if people were up for it, but you can't force it, especially if nobody is actually willing to commit budget for team building 😂

It's really tricky to maintain the boundary between what is professional and what is friendly so I get why people might rather just not engage.

Difficult in what way ?
It's not something most people find difficult.
The OP isn't being asked to go out socialising with her colleague over the weekend, just interact occasionally with people she presumably is spending at least 35 hours a week with, month after month.

It costs nothing to have a bit of chit chat. That’s how you get to know each other, build a bit of rapport, otherwise you spend 37 hours together a week with strangers. It makes for a nice environment. Unless they’re just not your kind of people. But a little chit chat won’t hurt. I know what you mean about women though! Some women (school mums for eg can be real bitches), I’m lucky, I work with really nice people.

I think perhaps you're not seeing it from others perspectives. Coming back from maternity is nerve wracking, this poor woman was probably anxious and it's kind and better for team working to be supportive, ask how she's finding things etc. I'd expect anyone in an office to do that, not just women. I wonder if you need to discuss and be more open with your manager, explain that you've dealt with work place bullying and you're nervous of socialising now. They might be more sympathetic if they understand where you're coming from. If people are finding you somewhat cold and unfriendly, it does impact work, they're less likely to ask questions/approach you if they need to, and you're all less likely to trust one another as Co workers and be able to support/advise/liaise with one another informally. As others have said, "How are things going" and smiling is hardly a chore. If you genuinely are very uncomfortable doing just that, then I wonder if you need to speak to a professional about it.

Equally, if it's just "you should've had a coffee with her and why aren't you going on nights out" then no, they're asking too much!

I think you are missing social cues Op. Day to day conversations at work are normal, usual and to some degree, expected. What does it cost to ask someone returning from leave if they've had a good break, or returning from sick leave if they are feeling better, you don't even need to be interested in their replies, but it makes for a much more pleasant atmosphere. Conversely, by being unwilling to exchange pleasantries you could be causing a bit of a negative atmosphere in your office

I think you are missing social cues OP

I think you have hit the nail on the head @MMUmum
Since lockdown too many people have isolated themselves and have just forgotten how to socialise with people.

I totally get that ND people find it difficult, but they can't all be on mumsnet, surely?

I am beginning to wonder whether the OP actually got "called out" rather than given a gentle nudge to say that silo working and never, ever talking to colleagues can create a bit of an atmosphere. I would love to hear the manager's side of it.

Op your prob right. I temped a few years ago. Cliques and niceness til they fall out. I do school bus now. They v nice (women) but my friend was saying keep your boundaries. Im polite. Its hard at work as we spend so much time there

I see absolutely nothing wrong with this. You are paid to do a job not socialise. Sure it would be nice (to SOME) if you asked about their holiday/day/evening but really does it matter? Live and let live. You shouldn’t be forced to interact with people. I am outgoing and chat to anyone and everyone in office environments btw, but think it’s unfair that this should be expected. You are paid to do a job, as long as you do the job then I don’t see the issue. Sorry you’re getting so much stick for this, I don’t even think you’re particularly cold from your post. I think you want to do your job and leave and not chat to people you can’t be arsed chatting to - faking niceties etc. and I think that’s totally fair enough!

Men are not expected to smile. Only women. And dress pleasantly. And smell
nice. And make stupid small talk about nothing at all while men look on indulgently and get on with running the world.

You're not wrong for doing what you are but I personally find being mates or at the very least friendly/interested in your co workers makes work easier and more fun. As well as making friends that are easy to keep due to proximity. I had a manager who took the line of "I don't want to see anyone on the weekend, I see enough of you all week" and didn't like colleagues being friends or meeting out of work either. I remember just thinking it was a really sad way to be. Just go for lunch, you never know. Also getting to know people at work introduced me to other cultures/identities/nationalities/religions (I went to a country school where everyone was a white brit) and broadened my understanding of others. I can now make acquaintances with pretty much anyone after being really shy as a teen.

I totally get what you're saying. I honestly can't think of anything worse than to play games, go on outings, team events etc. Enforced fun is never fun.
They are your colleagues and not your friends.
That being said, part of working for a company/your role is engaging with other people. So you have to play the game. Ask about people's holidays, weekends, kids, pets etc. Do you have to give a shit what the answer is? No. But engage, ask follow up questions, fein interest.
Showing a little bit of interest will go a long way.
Alternatively, if you really hate the small talk that much, remote or working for yourself may be the way to go.

I'm not friends with everyone I work with but I am friendly. When I go into the kitchen to make a cup of tea I usually pass the time of day with anyone who is in there. I don't socialise with them at lunchtime or outside of work, but I don't ignore them either.

There's two issues:

1. You are displaying internalised misogyny in the form of "I'm not like the other girls (and hence I'm better than them)" on this thread. If you treat other women the way you are talking about them here, you will get into trouble. Plus it's not very nice anyway and it's counterproductive. If you assume that other women are all like the characters of Mean Girls, you'll never give yourself the chance to meet the quiet ones who like steam trains and board games and don't want to bare their souls at work.
2. "I am starting to think that there is a ridiculous unspoken rule" is a description of an expectation trap. That link explaining expectation traps does so in the context of autistic people being "trapped" by neurotypical expectations, which may not apply in your case, but the argument that "unwritten rules" aren't rules by definition and people shouldn't expect others to be mindreaders does apply to your situation.

You are within your rights to ask your boss what the expectations are when it comes to socialising with your colleagues and you are within your rights to question those expectations and state that you value your privacy and you respect the privacy of others by not asking intrusive questions.

Some other posters have made the point that women are disproportionately expected to be nice and smile and ask the social questions and generally do what someone cleverer than me called "emotional labour", which isn't in your job description but nonetheless we are expected to do and the men aren't, along with washing mugs. This double standard absolutely exists and that's why you are entitled to question those expectations.

If it isn’t in her contract that she has to socialise with her colleagues he shouldn’t call her out on it.

I don't think it needs to be stated in your contract to be pleasant to your colleagues. It doesn't mean you have to chat all day, just don't ignore them all day long.

She is pleasant. She doesn’t hurt them. They just want her to conform while she just wants to get on with her work. I imagine that a graphic artist probably lives in her head a bit but has to really focus during the working day.

I totally get that ND people find it difficult, but they can't all be on mumsnet, surely?

The female ones, yes, many of us are on Mumsnet if we are too old for Tumblr. If you hide Chat and AIBU, Mumsnet is a pretty decent forum. The male ones are largely on Reddit.

Shit-tons of autistic women are undiagnosed and have struggled through life not even knowing why we struggle, unlike our diagnosed male peers who at least know why and were given some coping skills. Lockdown meant that we didn't have to mask anything like as much. It is like having to wear four inch stilettos every day, then wearing Birkenstocks daily for six months; you'd struggle to go back to stilettos, and why should you when they hurt you and damage your feet? Masking is not without physical and mental ill effects. I'm not saying we should never do it, I'm saying that, like wearing stilettos, it should be reserved for when strictly needed.

Get a job in the NHS, I asked after a colleague who was off sick, out of genuine concern, and got told off for 'gossiping'.
Seriously no small talk, no interaction, no eye contact and behaviours which wouldn't be tolerated elsewhere are encouraged.
It is the weirdest working environment I have ever known but great for those who don't like people or their co-workers!

Are you autistic? Someone I know who has been diagnosed comes across ‘shy’ and cannot stand small talk and office chit chat. If you are then your boss is discriminating against you.

I got to work to earn a living not make friends couldn't care whether people like it/me or not I'm not there for them I'm there for me and my pay packet at end of the month

It's not you, I've had this exact same thing. I worked in fashion and sat opposite my boss. I was good at the job and friendly/polite and responsive but didn't go out of my way to make friends.
Meanwhile she had an endless stream of girls coming through the office bringing her Starbucks 'nono don't pay me for that you've so much stresssss omg' to slapping her on the arse when they walked through shouting 'weheyy!'.
Anyway I find myself dragged into the bosses office to discuss my commitment and not getting along with the team.
I pointed out we were more than hitting all our targets and deadlines which should be more important and she didn't really know what to say.
Fast forward I left about a year later, moved into a different industry. Found my crew with different colleagues and realised I actually did want to make some work friends, I was just in the absolutely wrong environment.
See if you can do partial home office perhaps, give it a while then move on and find your people!!