Constant criticism from people I manage about my management

[Teakake]

As per the title, I am finding myself receiving unsolicited feedback from staff. I am significantly younger than many of them and in the past they have been used to a manager who hangs around drinking tea and asking about your weekend plans, or getting caught up in tiny details and basically doing all the perceived ‘easy’ little jobs which other staff are already here to do.

Problem is, this was running the business down the drain, and the most important jobs were not getting done, so I am a business manager, here to get efficiencies. I am not answering the phones at reception because I employ people to do that and my time is spent on other areas of the business.

However do not get this wrong, I will gladly pitch in if help is needed and we are unexpectedly busy or understaffed, I do not think of myself as too good for any job and I know how everyone’s job works as I have learnt this from them directly.

I do not micromanage - I am here for support if it’s needed. I don’t work remotely, am on site all day full time. I am very busy so I am often whizzing around and will say hi quickly in passing, and I ask staff to give me a heads up about what they want to talk to me about so that I can prioritise if this is urgent or not, as some of my work is very time critical.

The staff feel I don’t spend enough time with them. I ask why they want this time, is it work related? If so, I will arrange training.

No it’s because they want to feel important and special to me.

They are constantly interrupting me, demanding my time and when I give it to them, they just use that time to complain. I try to help them get out of circular thinking they don’t want to, So I leave the discussion with no resolution.

Even if I tell them that I don’t have extra time, I am in meetings and I have deadlines, it’s never good enough. I am here all day but they say ‘we never see you’ or ‘you don’t show any interest in us’ and ‘you are cold and too professional’.

They are important as humans, and valued in the workplace so I ensure they all have a safe working environment, stable work patterns, adequate training, annual appraisals, work related meetings.

No this is not what they mean. They are offended I am not their FRIEND. I am not befriending them and sitting on their desk chit chatting.

I do not want to be their friend. I just want to be their manager.

I am going to be honest, the clingy neediness is not helping, it feels like I have a large group of ladies clinging to my arms like small children, dragging me down.

I have put in boundaries and they do not respond well.

I approached my managers and asked if they agreed with this feedback from staff. They said no, I am doing exactly what they want me to do. I asked if they wanted me to do anything differently. They said no, my performance was great. There is no issue. The issue is the staff who have bad attitudes. I have suggested sharing an overview of my diary with the whole team so they can see how busy I am. No, they just want me to performance manage these people - which I am, but as they are constantly criticising me, we just don’t make any progress.

My managers are not helping me here.

In order to get out of this rut I have the following options:

-Put them all on last warning/performance plans
-take a tribunal risk and start letting people go (not all that comfortable with this, because it’s started to concern me I am part of the issue)
-Leave myself and get a new job
-start faking friendliness to the detriment of my job and productivity (I can’t do this!)
-take out formal grievances on the ring leaders to force my managers to intervene

Big Girl knickers OP!

@Teakake said, "I am a business manager who is operational and business focused, I was not employed here for this role to manage ALL the staff I am sorry that this does not compute to those who are confused by it, "

So are you responsible for the employees in your department, the staff and line managers or are you not?

If you are responsible for them then you need to act.
If you are not responsible for them go to the manager who is responsible with the information you've given us.

I think you'll find it even harder to move from being a manager of a small team to a leadership role where not only will you need to lead by example, but you'll have to be a motivator, someone that people look up to and ultimately, recognise that your staff and team really are your most valuable assets. If you ever want to implement any transformation change, you're going to need your staff on board with your vision. I think some people management and change management training might help. Moving companies won't change anything - you'll face the same issues with a new set of people. Far better to learn new skills and face the situation with a positive outlook. There are also plenty of decent management books around that should help.

I have undertaken fairly big quality improvement projects and they have been successful. I have been continually promoted and head hunted for my skills. I think this organisation was the mistake but I didn’t know how bad it was when I started

I will admit I do not find these people to hold their value as time goes on. as their behaviour is so disruptive. They are helping themselves become dead wood and devaluing themselves. In pursuit of what exactly? If you want your manager to hold a high opinion of you, act like a grown up

No one is indispensable and that includes me. I don’t for a moment hold myself up to be the best I am not arrogant to think there is nothing to learn. I hold myself to a high standard - as anyone should at work.

I am going to pursue performance management and deal with the line managwe issues too but look for a new job. Life is too short to be surrounded by toxic people

This thread and the weaving and bobbing of the OP makes me so glad I am retired.

Frankly OP, this 5% sound as thick as mince (not to mention disrespectful). You have my sympathy - I've had to deal with with one or two of these subversive types at a time, but never a group (even a small group) of them who band together to flex their power (which they're clearly enjoying).
I'm guessing this group have been there at least two years so I think you do need to focus on their performance, but deal with them one at a time. Is there one staff member, in particular, who regularly fails to deliver good quality or on-time work and causes problems without good business-based reasons? Start with them. Working with their LM and your HR manager, initiate a factual, evidence-based disciplinary against this individual, hopefully resulting in a 3-month (no more) performance improvement plan. You may find that action against one of them will shake up the rest. They need to understand times have changed - businesses need employees who deliver and don't create issues just "because" - there are plenty of people out there who could replace them.
I know you feel like walking away OP, but think how much better you would feel if you grasped this nettle; how you would help the LMs of these difficult staff and improve the culture for everyone. It's worth considering - and doesn't stop you looking for a new job at the same time.

Improvement projects are one thing but culture change is really another. I think you should ( based on your updates) sit all the line managers under you down and decide what kind of team you want to build and then from there how you will manage the change for the people that are more challenging. What are
the communication channels. Do these work, what’s the feedback, has there been a staff survey, how do they actually feel ( when asked in an anonymous way) you just need to change your approach because it doesn’t sound like ‘what you always do then has made you a success and headhunted’ is going to work for you here.

Honestly I've been in management a long long time.
At the start of the day. Get in there early and make whoever is there a cup of tea .. ask about their weekend etc. 5 minutes well spent

Box of chocolatea or cakes in the staff room every now and again thanking everyone as you've noticed how busy everyone is and everyone is working so hard. A little thank you from me. Etc

You can be professional without being their friend as well as an approachable person

Happy staff perform well.

Re your last update why are you persuing performance management against the staff. You should be managing the line managers to peruse any performance issues of those staff including disruptive behaviour. It sounds bonkers being a manager of managers but not actually letting the managers make the changes needed.

Just read all your posts. If you’d have put in your OP that it was only 5% of staff and that you are not their direct line managers this thread would have been very different. You don’t like the way the thread has gone but all the advice was based on information you gave.

your communication skills may also need some work

It is ok there are a lot of managers on here that I am also incompatible with

it is very clear that a lot of people have an issue with mistaking rudeness with honesty. This is what creates a lot of issues in work places. The people who pride themselves with how ‘upfront’ they are, and mistake people who aren’t like this as weak and pathetic. I have to deliver information to staff that is sometimes not what they want to hear, I am always compassionate about this. Doesn’t mean I can stop just because they want me to

I spend time with them but they make this time horribly unpleasant and it’s now out of obligation rather than an enjoyable experience that I now hate. I do not want to drink tea with a verbally abusive person.

I am going to follow the procedures and try to detach some of my emotions that this has tapped into.

Thanks for the constructive feedback that has been valuable and I appreciate it. I will be taking on board some advice on handing this situation and trying to make some progress for all of us

I have been on leave today taking my mum to an appointment, this is still on my mind, because I do care. We have values and these people fall very short of them in all honesty so this needs to be addressed

@AngelicKaty yes - we are trying this solution to divide and conquer by splitting them up. This worked on one of them who is otherwise good at their job. I am going to be honest here, they have made assumptions and made up rumours that they will be replaced by Tech - which isn’t true, this is just what they assume based on my age and some is my other projects, but doesn’t matter what I say, they persist in their persecution complex. They are also doing this so that I do not delve into their work to see how inefficient they are - resisting all attempts for me to check in with this. It’s my job, the task I am here to do. If you have nothing to hide then you wouldn’t mind showing me, right?

I have tried to explain and I think I’ve been patient to a degree, so many assumptions flying around. A long OP is offputting, but yes it should have said some. It never said ‘all’

This.

Basically you are introducing a new culture at work, which a few people don't like, but management are supporting you.
You have to, in a nice way, manage them out if they don't want to adapt to the new culture. They sound a really unpleasant group of women.
They should not be dictating how appraisals are run, rather following the policy.
A degree of sociability with staff is fine but not at the risk of the business failing or people just wingeing. They are paid to do a job not stand around gossiping and drinking tea and bitching at you.

Are you very young op?
It sounds like you have some work to do on your people skills.
Part of managing a team is about team bonding & building relationships. It’s just as important as appraisals etc…
People aren’t robots. You can’t just sack everyone ffs.

Absolutely right OP. It seems like this group is taking the "attack is the best form of defence" approach. 🙄
I do hope you are able to stick it out and bring about cultural change as it sounds like staff at all levels of the organisation need it and would appreciate it - and it would be another feather in your cap too. 😊

I have so so much regret over this post, it hasn’t helped at all. All that’s happened is that I have been ripped apart by more people.

I do not want to drink tea with someone who shouts in my face when they don’t get their own way, or calls me a liar or other names, to my face would you?

example:

me: (arriving at work at 8.30am to find an angry lady standing outside my office - I still have my coat on) oh hello Denise how are you? Nice weekend?

Denise- Oh hello Teakake, I have been waiting for you go get in, I’ve been here for an hour already, I suppose you turn up when you want to?

Me: I start work at 8.30 every day. how can I help you

Denise: well you wasn’t here last week at 8.30 one day because I came here and you wasn’t in your office! I never know where you are to be honest

Me: how can I help is this important I need to be in a meeting at 9, sorry. You can always check my diary on outlook.

Denise: well I sent you an email this morning and I haven’t had a reply yet so I wanted to make sure in person you know I had emailed you as it’s important.

Me: thanks for letting me know. ok well I haven’t sat down yet, do you want to tell me what it is about?

Denise: what’s the point you never listen

Me: ok I am going to log on now I will read your mail after my meeting and let you know, ok?

Denise: whatever

Later that day

Enter a room to grab a quick drink - Denise and Linda are there. Immediately goes uncomfortably silent

Denise; so you hadn’t read my email then I take it?

Me: I had a meeting at 9am and I am just grabbing a water, I will go check now

Denise to Linda: see what I mean?

Me: is there something you want to say?

Denise: yes there is. Last Tuesday you told Belinda something but didn’t tell me

Me: sorry about that.. what was it about? I don’t know. I have explained to you that I haven’t had time as I had a meeting, I am going to go and look. You could just tell me as I’ve asked

Denise: READ THE EMAIL

I leave the room as I’m going round in circles

This then turned out to be gossip not even related to Denise.

a performance management meeting with Denise turns into gaslighting 101.. this didn’t happen, no one said that, I don’t know what you are talking about, I am never rude..

We then make a plan to rebuild working relationships and she complies for 2 months then decides to go back to her old behaviour

Op I did give you some good supportive advice from my own experience that wasn't about ripping you apart or about tea (or coffee) drinking as a management tool.

OP, among the sharper posts (which probably do include mine), there have been some really good ones offering very good advice on management techniques that you could try. Is there a reason you're ignoring them, and any suggestion that you might be able to make headway on this by changing your own behaviours? Yes, it's hard to do this with people who don't always reciprocate but that's why you're the manager and not them, and paid an accordingly higher salary.

Yup, the epitome of subversive behaviour - just vile and utterly exhausting to deal with - your ability to maintain your composure with this type of personality is remarkable OP. I hope you and HR are able to find some way of managing this character out of the business.

We did that in our job and now have an excel sheet anyone can add to with comment, complaints, ideas (not urgent stuff)
manager goes through it once a week and will reply with yes/no/see x/good idea/will get back to you etc etc

also means we don’t get ten people complaining about the same thing as everyone can see the questions and answers

Your HR manager is there to help with issues, to advise you - not to hold 121's with your staff

If it's so few people why don't you just make a plan to attack it, / them. I mean say the 3 people who are causing the problems. They are toxic? So your'll have to be very clever in the way you do it, but it's perfectly possible to put people like this in their place and get them to toe the line.

I said thank you for the good advice that I will read over, that isn’t ripping me apart. I am sorry I didn’t thank people individually it’s being a bit drowned out by the people who just like to tear others down unfortunately. I need to take the time to read in more detail to process a plan. I am grateful to you. I’m not ignoring you.

I think one problem you are having, both at work and on this thread, is spending too much time on people you don’t need to. Hard in person and in practice because it feels rude, but Denise should and could have been shut down much quicker. Looking back at that situation, do you think you could have done that in hindsight? It sounds like she needs treating like a toddler.