Is working full time harming my kids?

[Jraven]

Ok as if I don't feel guilty enough for working, there's a study out today published by the Joseph Rowntree Foundation which says that working full time while your kids are pre-school increases their chances of psychological stress, unemployment and doing less well at A level. What should we do - all pack it in? Where are these mythical part-time, flexi-hour jobs that we have be promised so long? Is the government's policy of getting mothers back to work all wrong?

Thanks scrummymummy you made me smile for the first time today, after dealing with the child from hell first thing and now the VAT inspector.
Then I read ASF's comments and now feel even worse having abandoned my child at nursery this morning. I guess I'm just feeling sorry for myself.
But the fact is we do all try and make the best decisions for our families as a whole. What to me is important is what environment will make our daughter a happy, secure and fulfilled child and I honestly believe that I am really lucky. I love having days at home with her when I can contribute more precisely because I have been to work on other days and feel refreshed and ready to make pirate ships out of old cereal boxes etc.
I'm not saying this is right for everyone but it is right for me, dh and dd and that at the end of the day is what is important.

I'll add my bit to this discussion! In response to ASF I would like to say this!

When we had our first ds my husband was fully employed and I was able to be a SAHM, and then when we decided the time was right for our second he was by the running his own company with everything going well.
So I became pregnant and everything going fine, have ds and find that we are having problems finding new work, and still are.....

Ds is now 7 weeks old and we have had no new work for 2 months and money is running out, so I'm faced with the prospect of having to leave my baby and find full or part time work to help us survive.

So ASF where do I fit in to your black and white world, I'm sure you have an answer!

Scummy mummy fab poem

loopy ann remember you are the mum and follow your instinct and the advice of the health visitor not those people in a race (sometimes you find they stretch the truth in their childrens abilities anyway). Or the older generation (think rose tinted spectacles). Often things pan out a bit by the time the children are 4 or 5.

ASF Nature and nurture counts in rearing. A good nursery or childminder will win hands down over a parent with no inclination to spend time or teach their child things. And there are those parents about that don't do the reading and stuff with their kids but their lack of parenting skills are through ignorance and apathy rather than being "bad" parents. Surely no one tries to be a bad parent?
BTW as a corporate cowpat what about SAHDads - any of them out there - or don't they count?

(Enid sighs wearily) Pamina, I didn't actually accuse you of calling SAHMS dull and frivolous. That's just how we are often portrayed. And you can't be naive about 'just letting off steam', 'cos whether you meant it or not, your post was pretty inflammatory, as the number of posts will testify!

Ok, I've calmed down now. You're probably right about me being paranoid too - maybe all mums are! Mind you, I don't think anyone that posts here should expect only positive responses, even Rosy got some dodgy ones after her very moving story about the termination.

Can't resist getting in on this one - I find the most criticism about SAHMs seems to be on Mumsnet! I am just so grateful to be able to have the choice to be a SAHM, & genuinely admire those who are able to work and run their home/family. I do hate the comments about day time TV etc - quite honestly I never watch TV day or night, am amused at other threads where people seem to have the time to watch & discuss TV programmes. Many SAHMs like myself are in the (fortunate) position of being able to contribute a lot to society in the way of voluntary work, without which many in our society would suffer greatly. My DS & I are out most days driving the elderly/meals on wheels (yes really), charity stuff, running Mothers & Toddler groups, youth clubs, church work etc.

I hope this doesn't make me sound too much like a 'do-gooder'!!

Most of all - let everyone make their own choices in life, who are we to criticise others?

Oh well, I guess nobody wants any peace on this site! Might as well join in then! I think ASF is entitled to her views, just as MrsHudson was (where is she now?) and was it Carrie in the post about refugees? If we all thought the same, life would be very boring indeed!

As for negative comments about SAHMs, well I get loads of them so if anyone is lacking on insults, just borrow a few of mine! Here are a sample of them... "Are you not going back to work yet?" "Don't you think as an only child she would benefit from a nursery?" "You're just a housewife" and last but not least "You must get bored all day doing nothing!" Now for all those who think that SAHMs watch daytime tv - have you ever tried watching any telly at all with a lively 18 month old? Oh, I could of course plonk her down in front of Tellytubbies whilst I read the paper or something, but that's not my way of childrearing and I cannot stand the bloody Tellytubbies!

Working mums work and then come home and work some more, SAHMs work too, just the same work all day. As to who gets it easier - well I often envy the coffee breaks and lunches that working mums get, but then I relish my walks in the park with dd and think myself lucky that I'm not stuck in an office with only a photograph of her stuck on my pc.

Pamina I know you didn't mean to upset anyone, and you didn't upset or offend me at all, but you must realise that we all get comments like that, whether we work or not. It's not just working mums who feel guilty and get a lot of flak, as this discussion proves!

Oh, and just to pick up on what Enid has said - I will question whether or not Rosy got any dodgy posts on her termination story, she certainly never said that she was offended so I don't think anyone has the right to be offended for her. A lot of those posts took courage to write, as it takes courage for anyone to air their views that might differ with the rest of society's. Just because you might not agree with them does not mean to say that they are "dodgy".

Thanks for your thoughts everyone. Just to say that I wasn't offended by anything anyone posted when I had little Rosy. Firstly, people are wary about saying things that might upset you. Also, paradoxically, because it was so important a subject, people like Lisav felt they couldn't stay silent. I don't think she should have said nothing, and I'm glad she posted what she did. Also, she posted a very supportive message later. (Smiley face).

I find these sorts of discussions very entertaining to read while I should be working (damn, I've given myself away!)

Hey Rozzy & Lindy, I think you'll find the criticism isn't exclusive to SAHMs. If you read the debate below, you'll see some people have fairly strong ideas about working mums too. I've been using the Mumsnet website for over 18 months now and have found it an invaluable source of information & support. Most of the threads are not controversial, they are about every day problems or amusing incidents.
Of course people are going to have strong opinions about the way they raise their children. I welcome this sort of debate. Surely a forum such as this gives people the opportunity to say what they feel. Naturally, that is going to stimulate views from other people and as long as they are not abusive, then it is a good way of finding out about how we are all perceived.
I wish there were more opportunities in day to day life to do this.

Here here pamina, from one person to another having a foul day, tommorrow can only be better and I'm looking forward to the hugs tonight when I pick up dd from nursery. Oh well back to the grindstone!

Right, I'm sick of this. I wasn't being 'offended for Rosy', I just meant that mumsnet has a wide ranging views on a variety of subjects and we should all expect that. What does get on my nerves is petty semantics and obsession with not saying anything that might offend. Its like that Monty Python sketch 'Yes, but he has the RIGHT to be a woman!'

And I agree with Lindy and Rozzy, I've just realised that the only people that criticise working mums ARE on mumsnet, and even worse, its more cliquey than any group of SAHMS could ever be!

Enid, etc, I'm sorry you find mumsnet to be more critical of parental choices than elsewhere. Isn't there one site, Babyworld? where SAHMs and mothers who are in paid work have separate discussion forums? Surely that's not the way to go? Isn't that a perfect setting for cliqueness to develop?

You're right when you say these sort of discussions rarely occur in real life. For one obvious reason at least: during the day, we are all in different places, some of us are at home and some of us are not. There are SAHMs who live in the same street as me, and our paths hardly ever cross.

As for cliques, some, like me, have been posting for a while, and you can't help but build up a mental picture of each other. When I first started posting, I was very aware that I was not a 'regular'. I'm sorry you feel that way, but unless I find a way of forgetting the past every time I post, I will naturally feel that I 'know' some people a little better than others.

Look at how many new people get replies to their postings. If we were really cliquey, all we'd do is chat amongst ourselves.

Viv - I'm a sometime VAT inspector too - I'm REALLY evil!

'Plonking children in front of Tellytubbies and reading the paper is not my idea of child rearing' - sadly, it is mine, hence why I'd be useless as a SAHM. And believe me, my job is so dire at the moment I dream of escaping the rat race.

ASF - curious as to why you assume there are 2 incomes per household. What if you become unintentionally pregnant whilst single? Compulsory abortion and a stern talking to about what a silly girl you've been?

Scummy - loved your poem, by the way. Where is Connie when you need her?

I think we should all just agree to disagree.
After all I couldn't care less if someone else's child is in nursery all day or not. I care about my child and my choices and at the end of the day it wouldn't bother me one jot if I was insulted on being a stay at home mum.
Yes I've given up work and feel lonely sometimes bored sometimes tired. We have less money and I do feel I have less status at dinner parties etc.
But as long we all feel deep down that we are doing the best for our OWN child it doesn't matter what other people think does it?
I for one don@t give a hoot what anyone thinks of my decision to give up my proffesion.
When I get the comments from friends or family or even strangers about daytime tv etc it really just goes over my head because Iam happy and immensly proud and fullfilled of my choice.

my two cents. i wonder where people (e.g. ASF) get the energy to be so judgmental about other people's choices. surely it is difficult enough to manage one's own family without trying to run others!

The tone of this discussion has put me right off checking the current details of the mumsnet meet-up. It sounds like there would be one self adoring group and another we-quite-accept-what-we-are-but-it's-hard-not-to-sound-chippy lot.

This seems to have been a polarising discussion rather than an informative one. I think the colours of the at work clique has already been set.

Bon chance to your inclusiveness.

message withdrawn

Take a look at the thread from that positive woman who discovered breast cancer whilst feeding her baby and check your priorities.

Life is so precious and too short to waste on this!