My boss reprimanded me and some of my other coworkers for avoiding a smelly coworker.

[joel666]

I am a 34 year old male and i work as a web developer. I am fairly good at it my work and get along with most other coworkers.

But there is this one coworker that started 2 months ago. I will refer to him as tom.

Tom is good at his job but there is problem with him.

Ever since i met him for the first time, he always had a strong stench to him. His odor is a mix of weed and unwashed body odor and on top of that, his breath smells really bad.

But i always tried being polite but me and some of my other coworkers who also noticed how bad he smells avoid him but we tried not to be rude about it.

For examples. When tom would sit near us, my coworkers and me would tell each other "why don't we go seat over there. This table is a lot cleaner. Why don't we use this computer instead. This one is kinda slow. When you come back from the bathroom, join us on that other table next to the window.

And when we would be in the lunch break room, we would stand there, wait and see where tom would sit and we would make sure not to sit next to him.

But on the bad luck that he would sit right in front of us, i would cover my nose with my hand. And my other coworkers would do the same.

But again we try not to show our disgusts. We don't gag or make any disgusted facial expressions.

But just a week ago, our bosse called me into his office and he tells me that tom feels excluded and me and the other coworkers are creating a toxic work environment and my clique attitude will nog be tolerated.

I admitted to my boss why we avoid him. I told him that i cannot stand the stench coming off tom.

My boss argued and said this is disrespectful and he could very well have a health condition that causes him to smell unpleasant.

My other coworkers later told me that they also got reprimanded.

How would you deal with this ? Health or not, i cannot stand smelly people. I try not to be rude but when someone smells bad my first instinct is to avoid them.

Nope, not ideology. It’s the law. It’s perfectly clear that you have no interest in laws constructed for the protection of disabled employees. Just as I have no interest in diluting those laws to the benefit of employers like you, at the expense of the people they’re supposed to protect.

No idea what DEI propaganda is - you’d have to explain that to me.

Well if I had someone like Tom as a colleague although I would be respectful and kind I would also make sure I am always sniffing essential oils and keeping the Windows open, and making sure I sit far from them as is possible . That way no discrimination or bullying is actually happening and everyone is happy. I think Tom would be silly to complain about someone wanting to be comfortable at work . If they reported me I would declare I had some medical condition that makes me sensitive to smells or something . Tom needs to grow a thicker skin unless actual abuse is going on e.g. people laughing at him or making unkind digs about his smell. Not sitting with someone at coffee break is not remotely in that league.

Suggesting that someone grow a thicker skin so that they are not offended by potentially discriminatory behaviour is discriminatory in itself !!

I haven't seen any DEI propaganda, unlike at my last job and the 80 something page manual we were supposed to read! I'm sure there was something useful in it somewhere but I didn't get past the first few pages

But none of the measures I have mentioned are even potentially discriminatory . They aren't about Tom . They are about putting the need of all colleagues to feel comfortable first . Tom isn't going to be offended by air freshener or people using oils etc. Unless he a snowflake type. Because it's not real discrimination to put your needs for comfort at the top priority. That's just being sensible and fair to everyone

Well fortunately for me; my employer, friends, family and partner don’t agree - they don’t even cover their noses!

You have a lovely evening.

i don't think it's B S either myself . There is certainly a kind way to deal with the problem which means everybody wins. I myself am someone who has suggested fair adjustments for the potentially or likely disabled person in this case . Not one thing I've suggested has been unkind or discriminatory, so I think it can be done. There is an polite and kind way to avoid the bad smells, without even needing to address the person themselves, which might embarrass them. Quietly avoiding the smells and masking them is one way that won't cause offence and nobody will feel discriminated against.

I travel a lot on public transport and sometimes a slightly whiffy person boards the train. I could be rude and unkind about it or I could move seats if possible, or if not, I could just hide my nose and put lots of perfume on a handkerchief and just crack on. Nobody offended, nobody discriminated against .

All it needs is a bit of tact.

I have autism. Being near someone with body odour would overwhelm me, possibly causing a meltdown and so on. Therefore, in OP's situation, I'd have to move from Tom for my own wellbeing.

In such a scenario, whose rights trumps whose?

No-one’s rights trump anyone elses’.That’s the short answer. The discussion has mostly centred around what would happen if Tom declared his odour to be as a result of a medical condition, but this could just as easily be a case of lazy personal hygiene.

Either way, this is not for Tom’s colleagues to deal with and as has been discussed, their actions so far could well be seen as discriminatory if Tom does have a disability. The manager has a responsibility to resolve the situation fairly and within the law. So if disability is the root cause, then the manager has to work with Tom to find reasonable adjustment so that everyone is accommodated. If no reasonable adjustment is possible, then sadly Tom can be let go. Disability employment law doesn’t allow for the disabled employee to be accommodated to the disadvantage or discomfort of anyone else affected by the situation.

If Tom is just neglecting himself, then that’s disciplinary and again down to the manager to tell Tom that it’s unacceptable, and to put procedures in place for him to improve within a defined timescale - offering help or advice where needed. If there’s no improvement as a result of disciplinary action then again, Tom can be let go.

it should also be noted that Tom is a new employee and if there are no protected characteristics such as disability, which give ‘day one’ rights, then the company can pretty much let him go for any reason.

This.

A couple of the Dad's at school pick up smoke weed and they stink of it if you stand next to them.

Tom may not know that he smells though, I used to smoke 30 cigarettes a day when I was younger and I never knew how bad I smelt until I gave up. Tom's boss needs to speak to him.

'Disability employment law doesn’t allow for the disabled employee to be accommodated to the disadvantage or discomfort of anyone else affected by the situation." sounds as if any employer can find grounds to throw you out just if youare considered bothersome!

They would need to be able to justify it and show that they have treated you reasonably or you’d have grounds for unfair dismissal.

But employers can require you to behave in a civil way to others and that includes not doing things that others find really annoying.

Nope. If that’s what you’ve taken away from this discussion then you’ve misunderstood. It’s there to protect them from discrimination and to make sure they have everything they need to participate to their full potential. Disability is a protected characteristic and if a problem in the workplace is disability related, the employer can’t just sack the employee - they have to try to find a reasonable adjustment to solve the issue. It’s only when there is genuinely no solution that they can look at letting the employee go.

The point l was making was that if there is a disability related problem that affects others in the workplace, reasonable adjustment needs to consider and involve them too. The disabled person can’t be prioritised to the disadvantage of others in the workplace, and where this results in dismissal the employer would have to show that they had acted fairly and within the law before letting the person go.

I fully understand the aim of the law - to protect any disabled person but I was talking about the potential misuse of the let-out clause that can be used indiscriminately by bad employers.

Ah, l see what you mean. An employer who wanted to fire a disabled employee would need to show that every effort had been made to find reasonable adjustment before doing so. Disability is a protected characteristic and disabled employees have the right to apply to tribunal for unfair/constructive dismissal from day one, so that would be another form of protection. It would be up to the tribunal to decide what constitutes unfair, based on the evidence presented by both sides. It’s a minefield and l’ve seen a few employers come unstuck when it becomes obvious they just wanted rid of what they saw as a problem employee.

Sorry Op, you and your colleagues are bullies.
Do better.

What about the living situation and conditions of your colleague? Maybe they are not in the best place to be able to wash and dry laundry? Do they have access to laundry facilities and can afford the energy bills?

Are they in living quarters where others are smoking weed? It’s actually secondhand smoke that you are smelling?
can they actually access hygiene products etc and showering or having a bath every day is possible?

How is any of that ops business or problem? And why are you reviving a zombie thread?

So everyone is forced to put up with the stink because his feelings can’t be hurt! It’s bullying?? What? To my mind, the colleagues are being bullied by being forced to put up with it. Why should they? In this day and age, there is no need to smell of body odour.

Oh ffs!!

FFS all you like. It doesn’t change the law.

Have you read the full thread ? He’s been to see the manager and possibly declared a disability as the source - and there are plenty of conditions that cause smells. The colleagues are not being bullied, they are just going about it in the wrong way. The manager has a responsibility to find reasonable adjustment if the employee has declared a disability. Working from home might solve the problem. But if not, everyone has to be accommodated and if there are no reasonable adjustments it’s not unfair to let the employee go.