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Constructive dismissal grounds

184 replies

Jobque · 23/01/2025 19:54

Hi I just want some advice on this.

I have worked for my company for a long time and I was promoted into my current job without interview by a previous manager (who doesn’t work there anymore).

The job has changed as the company has changed over the years and new management. I am a manager of a team and told my managers a year ago I felt swamped at work. My team constantly interrupt me all day asking questions and it’s irritating. I asked to drop my hours and they did eventually let me but this meant I had to let someone else train up in parts of my job for when I am not there. I don’t really get on with them, they think they are better than me at my job so I just let them do their thing on their day and I do mine on my day. I don’t really like other people being involved in my job, I don’t think they can do it as well as I can but it’s good to have someone to delegate all the bits of the job I don’t like to.

I think things are fine as they are, but there has been so many changes to how we work now and I feel pushed out. I’ve kept my head down and not really got too involved but it annoys me they don’t consult with me with the decisions.

work are doing a restructure and I’ve been told that they want me doing some different things at work. It’s a bit of a different job title but a lot of the same things I’ve been doing anyway, same pay, same hours etc. I can do the job but I don’t like these changes they seem boring. I get why they are doing it, they say it’s more efficient use of my time as I am experienced but ideally I want to work less hours (cut another day a week) and stay in the same role. It also means the person I don’t get on with is going to get more responsibility and take over some of the stuff I do. My manager says I am doing too many basic jobs and as a manager I need to be contributing more to making the place run better. I do a lot of the basic jobs when we are short staffed but I just don’t think they pay me enough to step up to this new level. They asked me to trial the job I said no.

I said I don’t want the job so said I would leave. They said there is no other job at my level, just the one they want me to do but if I resign I could still come back in a different job (that is also boring) on the less hours I want, less responsibilities but with less pay, and I don’t want that one either and doesn’t seem fair. I want to keep my current job and stay on my pay level.

I told them this sounds like constructive dismissal do you think I have a case?

[Note from MNHQ - OP confirmed later on that this is a reverse - while we don't exactly encourage this kind of thing, we appreciate that posters sometimes do things this way to gain a different perspective, which we could probably all do with from time to time.]

OP posts:
Lougle · 23/01/2025 20:12

I don't think you can claim constructive dismissal. They've given justification, they've offered you a trial, you've said no. You've said you want to do the same job but the same job isn't on offer.

Whydoeseveryonewanttoargue · 23/01/2025 20:15

No not even close.

devildeepbluesea · 23/01/2025 20:17

Based on what you’ve put here there’s not a cat’s chance in hell you’d win a UCD claim.

Dearover · 23/01/2025 20:21

It sounds as though management bent over backwards to meet your demands. Rather than managing your team and supporting them so they are less reliant on you, you cut your hours to avoid them. You gave the tasks you dislike to someone else, but seem to begrudge them your success. Your managers have offered you the same Ts & Cs whilst giving you less responsibility. If you don't want to be bored, but you also didn't want to manage your team, it sounds as though you need to start again elsewhere.

rookiemere · 23/01/2025 20:21

It's very hard to understand from your post exactly what is being offered. On the one hand you say the proposed job is boring, but on the other you wouldn't be paid enough for what they are asking you to do.

DaftyLass · 23/01/2025 20:21

This feels like a weird reverse

HermioneWeasley · 23/01/2025 20:23

No.

by all means resign from your job because you’re not happy but please do not think you have a claim.

Whyherewego · 23/01/2025 20:24

It's not constructive dismissal. They've accommodated your request to reduce hours. They have a suitable role for you on same pay and hours and your main objection to it is that it's boring. That's not a reason that an employment tribunal will entertain I'm afraid

KilkennyCats · 23/01/2025 20:29

No chance.
I’m pretty sure them training up someone to do the job when you’re not there was not intended to allow you to delegate “all the bits of the job you don’t like”, btw.
You sound like a bloody nightmare.

Doyoumind · 23/01/2025 20:32

They don't have to consult you about decisions made above your level, and you have to work around what the business needs, not what suits you. You seem have a bad attitude. They're paying you to do the job they need you to do, not the job you've decided you want to do.

Mrsttcno1 · 23/01/2025 20:34

You have absolutely not a single chance of a constructive dismissal case here.

StormingNorman · 23/01/2025 20:39

This isn’t constructive dismissal. They’ve given you two options to stay within the new company structure.

Keepingthingsinteresting · 23/01/2025 20:39

If this is serious then I’m not sure I’ve ever met someone in real life with so little ability to reflect and see beyond their own nose. They have bent over backwards to keep you happy and you can’t have it all your own way. But, for the avoidance of doubt, absolutely no grounds for constructive dismissal.

Dietingfool · 23/01/2025 20:44

Oh op, of course not, good grief, you come across like you don’t want to work, don’t want to do anything you don’t like and find everything boring, I’m surprised they still employ you.

is it constructive dismissal, only if you considered you dismissed yourself with your I’m bored and can’t be bothered attitude, your team even annoys you.

im genuinely stunned at your lack of personal insight.

Uricon2 · 23/01/2025 20:46

As an ex shop steward I had my head in my hands reading this.

You haven't got a cat in Hell's chance of a successful claim for constructive dismissal and TBH, if you resign, I imagine you will not be missed. However, this might be a reverse, IMO.

EmmaMaria · 23/01/2025 20:56

I told them this sounds like constructive dismissal do you think I have a case?

Not a chance. And you sound quite... erm... difficult, so I doubt they'll miss you much.

Jobque · 23/01/2025 20:58

@rookiemere The job they want me to do is more boring and I think offering more money would make it a better job offer. I don’t think they pay enough anyway but I wasn’t asking for more pay, I just want to stay what I am doing now. It works for me. In my title I manage people they want to move me to manage different things not related to managing people and it makes
me feel like it’s a demotion. The person I delegate my work to is always trying to change things as well and they are brown nosing with the management all the time. I feel like they are just trying to get rid of me.

If I wasn’t good at my job then why have I been doing it so long. Doesn’t make sense I hear what they say about making things more efficient but they could just get a new person to do that job and leave me in mine? They told me I had a lot of skills and experience but I’m not using them enough. They keep poking their noses in watching me asking me why I am doing the basic day to day jobs of my team but we are short staffed and I like to know what’s going on, and I’m faster than my team at getting the work done so why does this matter? I do forget to do some things the managers ask me to do but it’s not my fault I am always too busy and short staffed they don’t understand how much I get interrupted and keep telling me if I train other people to do it then it will be easier but I don’t have time to train anyone.

Can they really change my job description this much and it’s fair?

OP posts:
Whyherewego · 23/01/2025 21:04

You don't seem to like managing people. You don't do the things management are expecting and are doing the day job of the people you manage. They want to restructure the team and that is their right and they're offering you reasonable alternatives

BotDranning · 23/01/2025 21:04

This can not be real?
Are you one of yhe team members and this is a reverse type post?

RedHelenB · 23/01/2025 21:06

On paper, as an employer, I'd think your jobs share sounds like she deserves more responsibility Managers don't do the basic jobs, they look to improve the company.

Dearover · 23/01/2025 21:09

It's not a case of whether you are good at your current job (& it really does sound as though you cherry pick the bits you are willing to do) but whether that job exists any more. I'm not sure why you think it's acceptable to get paid for doing the job of a team member, but they have obviously worked out that there isn't enough of a management role for you any longer if you have enough capacity to do their tasks. You sound jealous of your colleague and have realised that their competence highlights your incompetence.

Jobque · 23/01/2025 21:22

I am trying to listen to what people are saying and maybe you have some points ok (not the mean ones) just that I have been doing this so long and it’s not been a problem before so why now? I like managing people and I tell my managers this is why I don’t want to move jobs but they won’t listen. I don’t stand for being taken the piss so it’s that’s difficult then fine. Yes it can be annoying being interrupted but I like to know everything that’s going on anyway so I said I would not complain about this anymore.

They just don’t like paying out for new staff so when someone leaves they tell me they won’t replace them as they want the team to be more efficient but I think the team are fine as they are. They seem to manage ok and don’t need me telling them what to do all the time everyone just gets on with it. We are all busy. They gave me the person to help with my work so surely I can give her whatever I choose? She likes doing all that stuff so I just leave her to get on with it.

What I am asking is can your employer change your job description this much and make your job not exist?

I didn’t think they would go through with this to be honest I know they have been talking about it for ages I thought they would just never get round to it so I didn’t pay it much attention or get involved.

OP posts:
HidingFromDD · 23/01/2025 21:53

Tbh I think they’re only offering you another option as it’s easier than performance managing you out. But based on what you e said here if you carry on in the same vein you may just piss them off enough they’d do it.

Whyherewego · 23/01/2025 22:02

OK to respond to your specific questions. yes they can change your job description. they need to consult with you and this can be done on an individual basis if it's just your job that's changing. generally it's acceptable to change a small portion of your Job description without much consultation eg 10/20pc. if more then they should formally consult ie explain rationale, listen to your points and so on. they don't have to change their minds though if that's what is needed from a business perspective.

they can make your job redundant ie say they don't need someone to do that job any more and consult with you on this. they can offer you suitable alternative employment and if you don't accept then you'd be made redundant

Shakeyourbaublesandsmile · 23/01/2025 22:08

You sound difficult

You don’t want the other person taking over and feel pushed out but delegate to them and want to drop a day

New role has many same tasks but is boring the other role is boring

You need to look for another job