Commonwealth Games website (re Caster Semanya)

[impossibletoday]

Noticed on the commonwealth games website. All the athletics events I looked at showed both the world record and the games record......

except the women's 800m.

Guess who holds that record from 2016.

Sorry, you mde a lot of good points and I didn't want it to get lost.

So many people that I know don't care as far as they are concerned is just sport, they don't realise just how much effort is put in to it and how much money is lost through this.
And the lost has a greater conseqeunce as the prize purse is so much less,
And there are cases in the USA coming up of girls/young women that are losing college places due to TIMs taking sponsership deals or having them removed during their courses.

For anyone who still believes that a male athlete with the condition known as 5ARD, should ever have been competing in female categories, please read through this thread linked below (please do not comment on that thread, though start a new thread to discuss anything you find interesting)

www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5142027-save-female-sports-evidence-thread?page=1

That ‘beauty standards’ argument has always been very weak and used to shame female people from raising awareness of the issues, hasn’t it?

It is frustrating to continue to see uninformed posters keep making it.

Every single one of them who does spectacularly misses the glaring misogyny of their choice to use that argument.

Black women are not your gotcha to defend a cheating man @MashaPav

They are mentally incapable of accepting that trans and intersex people exist. When looney bins were around they were the sort of people locked up (the transphobes) because they are mentally ill.

Just pasting this here in case Mash's post gets deleted, so any latecomers to the thread can see what the level of debate has descended to

“They are mentally incapable of accepting that trans and intersex people exist. When looney bins were around they were the sort of people locked up (the transphobes) because they are mentally ill.”

This is DARVO in action.

Not only is it gaslighting female people who are having legitimate discussions around fair sport for female people. It is also abusive to tell those female people that they are mentally ill for having those discussions.

Why do posters resort to this abuse rather than provide evidence to counter points raised? I think we can see a pattern of behaviour that comes from not having anything other than emotionally manipulative tactics and reasoning to support their position.

Dear old mash, truly the gift that keeps on giving. Operation #letthemspeak

There is significant evidence indicating that Semenya is a cynical man using an error on his birth certificate to win money and fame.

Similarly with the Algerian boxer.

The main reason these particular men are singled out is that enough evidence exists to suggest they are taking all the advantages being male gives in normal life, while simultaneously stealing medals and money from women when competing.

He was raised as male, was treated as male in school, wore boys uniform and was scouted precisely because he had a DSD and at that time men with the same DSD were allowed to compete in the female category. By doing so, he robbed women from his country of the opportunity to compete in his races.
In fact, three men took the medals in Rio 2016 800m, denying the opportunity for three women to win.

It’s not Mumsnetters that have decided Semenya is male, it’s his chromosomes.

He also came from a region that was known to have a cluster of that DSD. I think I even read that he had extended family with that same DSD, it was known about within the family and the community.

He definitely knew by 2009 and he still made a conscious and deliberate decision to take advantage of an unfair system. And then fought to retain his opportunities and I suggest, defend his reputation and decisions, in court.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/gordonfarquhar/2009/08/this_must_be_an_awful.html

..... and the really heartbreaking part of Schinegger's case is that his times were good enough for the men's team but they wouldn't let him on it out of prejudice.

No one denies DSD's here, but 5ARD which is the condition Semanya has only affects males.

Semanya should never have been in women's events, I feel terrible for all the women that missed out on medals and prize money.

Indeed. It's repulsively racist, when you think about it. A certain type of TRA seems to believe the experiences of black women are theirs to co-opt.

I’m not convinced it was intentional to leave Semenya out. Interestingly the WR is the oldest one in athletics and one that many have suspicions about due to possible testosterone use. Sharron Davies book is great if you are interested in the state sponsored doping in the 80s. With the great 800m around now likely it will hopefully be broken soon.

I have so much sympathy for all the women who missed out in South Africa and worldwide like Lynsey Sharp.

@MashaPav We are saying that we agree with the the Sports Arbitration councils decision to ban Castina Seminya from all female athletic events. And you saying we are mentally deficient bigots because they don't fit western standards of beauty? Is that the reason you think the court made it's decision? Seriously, wtf is wrong with you?

It isn't just Caster Semenya. In the 2016 Olympic Games in Rio, biological women lost out on Gold, Silver and Bronze in the women's 800m. The three runners on the podium - Caster Semenya, Francine Niyonsaba and Margaret Wambui, all had the same 48 XY 5 Ard DSD.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caster_Semenya

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Francine_Niyonsaba

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Margaret_Wambui

So you haven't seen the pictures from his autobiography of him topless in board shorts on the beach on a school trip in his teens? Or of him in a group of boys and girls wearing school uniform, with him in the boys' uniform? Or the more recent interviews where his sits on the sofa manspreading in a way that no-one who was socialised as a woman would ever do? Have you heard his voice? He's a rival for Leonard Cohen in lowest, gravelliest voice.

Not only is he male, he has very obviously known for a long time that he is male. Bollocks does he consider himself to be female.

Oh, and he has utter contempt for women, which also tells you something.

What female attributes?

Flo-Jo's CW record? If by this you mean Commonwealth record, Flo-Jo is American.

I think CS is a poor advertisement for ' her testes don't make her any less a woman' or 'she's just a different kind of woman' or 'we must expand our definition of 'woman' to include CS'.

Apart from the evidence that he was aware from an early age that he was not female - which I allow may not be the case with some other DSD males, unpopular though that opinion is on here..😒- CS has this cool dude public persona: the flashy cars, the sharp suits, the beautiful wife, the cute children, the gorgeous designer house overlooking whatever it is overlooking, which frankly seems even to me to be thumbing his nose at the world in general.

There's no need to go in to bat for poor, marginalised, misunderstood CS.
He does all right for himself.

As seen on XTwitter. Dr Dr P is a black woman. She has a strong opinion on that.

Dr. Dr. P: "I said what I said".

@Psychgirl211
·
Jul 22

So "black girls" look like men? Fuck this racist shit!!

Caster Semenya interviewed on a SA TV programme The Link. Perhaps it was because it's local TV he was very unguarded. Notice how her refers to women as 'they', not 'we'. He has no fellow-feeling for women.

Whatever the unfortunate circumstances of his appearance at birth, there's evidence he did not grow up socialised as a girl and he knew definitively for some years before winning his medals that he was not female, and the nature of his Disorder of Sexual Development.

Edited for Typos

No I mean exactly what I said which is that Flo Jo's word record is shown, because the CW Games website is showing the WR for each event, usually alongside the Commonwealth Games Record. For the women's 200m, only the WR is shown. So it's not just the 800m (which incidentally has a European WR holder) where the WR is shown and no CW Games record is shown. Hence my opinion that it's just the website with incomplete data rather than any deliberate decision to exclude any particular athlete.

female pronouns...????? Proof if ever it were needed, surely???