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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Another victory! For Women Scotland v Scottish Ministers in prisons case

198 replies

TheNoWord · Yesterday 12:04

It’s just been on the news in Scotland. More to follow….

OP posts:
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singthing · Today 10:34

MrsOvertonsWindow · Today 09:42

😂
There's nothing desperate transactivists won't use to try to get their own way.

I'm still taking pleasure from seeing the comprehensive dismantling of the "but mothers with male toddlers in changing rooms mean middle aged men must be allowed in" whine. 😁

The Gish Galloping is in doubleplusungood overtime right now.

"What about..." has never done so much heavy lifting in such a short space of time.

CompleteGinasaur · Today 10:55

I looked over on Reddit only half an hour ago, and they were already up to "Government sponsored rape culture" and "willing and knowing genocide". Rowling alone knows where they've gotten to by now..

BiologicalRobot · Today 12:01

Rightsraptor · Today 10:23

I'm sure there was one TiF in a men's prison in Scotland who refused to move out. But time has passed now, so maybe she's on the outside.

@Wishesandhorses - are your comments about ScotGov & incompetence tongue in cheek? Because I will readily believe that level of arrogance/incompetence from them.
I read the other day about the achingly progressive new Scottish primary school in court for failing to provide proper sanitary facilities for girls and which had, along the way, created menstrual huts for them. Their defence was that they were following the guidance (to which the judge said 'guidance is not law'). So - the can follow guidance when it suits them but not when it doesn't (EHRC guidance following FWS/Scottish Ministers). Other examples are available: Peter Murrell - I rest my case.

And how curious that the poor TW can't be housed in a separate unit away from a main prison estate because their families wouldn't be able to visit, when all female Welsh prisoners have to be housed in England due to lack of a women's prison in Wales.

But, y'know - they're only women.

I never knew that, is there not even an open prison? Do you know how many men's prisons there are in comparison?

Update - bloody hell there are FIVE 😮 That is a hell of a lot of male criminality considering most sexual violence against women and children is practically ignored by courts.

Thank you, once again, FWS. You rock ❤

SidewaysOtter · Today 13:14

“We strategized that by working intensively with the Scottish Prison Service to support them to include trans women as women on a self-declaration basis within very challenging circumstances, we would be able to ensure that all other public services should be able to do likewise.”

James Morton, Former Scottish Trans Director in ‘Trans Britain’ (2018) ed. C. Burns

There is little that can surprise me these days about the trans rights movement but this is off the scale. They deliberately got an authority on their side then targeted not only vulnerable women with little or no agency, but those whom they suspected (not incorrectly) that society would care less about what happened to them. By the time the movement affected women society did care about or who did have the ability to speak up, the ideology was already entrenched. Actually, less 'entrenched' and more 'full planning permission granted, concreted into the ground, and surrounded by land mines'.

What utter cunts these activists are.

SidewaysOtter · Today 13:18

Oh, and a google search suggests 'James' is a trans-identified female. Yet another woman who hates her sex so much she'd throw every single other woman and her rights under the ideological bus.

TwoLoonsAndASprout · Today 13:23

SidewaysOtter · Today 13:18

Oh, and a google search suggests 'James' is a trans-identified female. Yet another woman who hates her sex so much she'd throw every single other woman and her rights under the ideological bus.

“James” and “Stephen” can get tae fuck. So much nasty, misogynistic damage the both of them have done, just so they can run away from the burden of being female.

Wishesandhorses · Today 14:40

The adopted misogyny is painful. And I always wryly note that these women, without threats of sexual violence, peeing everywhere, waving swords, assaulting anyone, have quietly got on with causing a hell of a lot more successful damage than many others.

sohard · Today 14:55

TwoLoonsAndASprout · Today 13:23

“James” and “Stephen” can get tae fuck. So much nasty, misogynistic damage the both of them have done, just so they can run away from the burden of being female.

They have caused so much damage. It’s all crumbling down around them now though. Good.

impossibletoday · Today 15:08

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Another victory! For Women Scotland v Scottish Ministers in prisons case
impossibletoday · Today 15:21

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Another victory! For Women Scotland v Scottish Ministers in prisons case
ArabellaScott · Today 15:24

Seethlaw · Today 09:52

Aren't transmen already in women's prisons? (Please say they are. Lie if you have to. The alternative is unthinkable.) And not causing any kind of problems there?

Well, here are the prison numbers for Scotland:

https://www.gov.scot/publications/scottish-prison-population-statistics-2024-25/pages/people-in-prison/

average daily prison population (ADP) in 2024-25 was 8,216
average daily prison population of women in Scotland in 2025: 345

'women still comprised just 4% of the prison population in 2024-25'

So, for a start there are far, far fewer women in prison.

Of these 300 odd women, there are generally a handful of trans identifying females.

There was a record at one point showing a female in the male estate, but as it was just one, it was hard to know if it was just a misprint.

The SPS no longer publishes data on gender identity of prisoners. So we no longer can check these things.

https://www.holyrood.com/news/view,new-restrictions-on-transgender-prisoner-data-will-protect-inmates-jails-chief-says

'Information on transgender prisoners will not be published because releasing data on a small number of offenders could put them at risk, MSPs have been told.
The head of the Scottish Prison Service (SPS) said information on the jails used for transgender women and transgender men would not be released unless more than five such inmates are in custody at any one time.'

Scottish Prison Population Statistics 2024-25

The latest longitudinal statistics on prison populations and flows into and out of prison. Includes information about the demographics of people in prison, the time they spend there, their sentences and offences.

https://www.gov.scot/publications/scottish-prison-population-statistics-2024-25/pages/people-in-prison/

ArabellaScott · Today 15:25

Sorry, that was a long winded way of saying that, as far as anyone knows, there are no women placed in men's prisons in Scotland.

ArabellaScott · Today 15:39

I do think these numbers should be instructive.

Average daily prison population (men): 8000
Average daily prison population (women): 300

That is to say,

There are 2,567% more men than women in prison.
Or in plainer ratio terms: about 27 men for every 1 woman.

ArabellaScott · Today 15:39

'In Q1 25/26, 96% of the people in our care were recorded as men and another 4% were recorded as women. Trans men, trans women and non-binary/gender-fluid combined accounted for less than 1% of the total population. In total, there were 19 transgender people in custody at the end of Q1 25/26'

SPS figures.

ArabellaScott · Today 15:39

'SPS defines affirmed gender as the gender in which a person lives their day-to-day life. It may differ from the gender assigned at birth, which is the gender a person was originally registered as on their birth certificate. Non-binary individuals identify themselves as having no gender or as being on a gender spectrum2 between man and woman. Gender-fluid is defined3 by “not having only one gender or moving freely between genders.”'

ArabellaScott · Today 15:41

They appear to be classing people by 'social gender'.

No numbers given, so we can't see the breakdown of how many males or females, but a thin red line showing under 'trans women'.

https://www.sps.gov.uk/sites/default/files/2026-01/Public%20Information%20Page%20%28PIP%29%20Quarter%201%202025%20%281%29.pdf

Another victory! For Women Scotland v Scottish Ministers in prisons case
Ereshkigalangcleg · Today 16:42

impossibletoday · Today 15:21

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She’s just amazing 😻

EmpressaurusKitty · Today 16:59

This is the Reddit bit that struck me.

First, ‘but transmen in women’s prisons!’ Is meant to be one of their big gotchas & second, if TMAM & there’s no difference, why on earth would Reddit think they shouldn’t be with all the other men?

Naturally the thread goes on to talk about how much more vulnerable the TWs are.

Another victory! For Women Scotland v Scottish Ministers in prisons case
Seethlaw · Today 17:07

Thanks for all the info, @ArabellaScott !

ArabellaScott · Today 17:20

Seethlaw · Today 17:07

Thanks for all the info, @ArabellaScott !

Oh, I can bore on for years, I assure you! 😂

Ereshkigalangcleg · Today 17:20

EmpressaurusKitty · Today 16:59

This is the Reddit bit that struck me.

First, ‘but transmen in women’s prisons!’ Is meant to be one of their big gotchas & second, if TMAM & there’s no difference, why on earth would Reddit think they shouldn’t be with all the other men?

Naturally the thread goes on to talk about how much more vulnerable the TWs are.

Good point.

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