Boxer Lin Yu-ting cleared to return after gender eligibility ruling

[Wonderknicks]

Boxer Lin Yu-ting cleared to box
https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2026/mar/21/olympic-champion-boxer-lin-yu-ting-cleared-to-return-to-ring-after-gender-ruling?CMP=Share_AndroidApp_Other
Interesting last paragraph
Along with its appeal process, World Boxing said it offers additional analysis and evaluation for athletes with Y chromosome genetic material who wish to compete in the women’s categories, including genetic screening, hormonal profiles, anatomical examination and further evaluation of endocrine profiles by medical specialists.
Apologies if there is another thread, I couldn't see one.

Wrong about Khelif. Growth of the penis during puberty can be significant with 5-ard.

I may be wrong but I thought there was something about this in one of the early leaked reports?
It's certainly not something I'm going to debate about😬
he shouldn't be in women's boxing in any case!

Re puffyisgood's point about Lin's voice -
Khelif does not have a deep voice either. He sounds like a woman.
He doesn't do the cool dude thing Semenya does, and I think it's correct to say that he is completely accepted as a woman by the Algerian public - as a national heroine and an example for young Algerian and Arab women, in fact.
I think his self-awareness, and any possibility of acceptance that he is a man, is curtailed by his high profile as a female national icon.

I disagree that Khelif's voice sounds like a woman. Maybe it is my hearing, but to me Khelif's voice carries the same timbre as most male people's. Perhaps that comes from me listening to so many audio books and listening where men do female parts.

Lin Yu-Ting has that same undertone and timbre. Perhaps I because I watch TV in the native language with sub titles, I can pick his voice as being male. It is certainly more a young man's voice but it is male that I hear.

I think Khelif's voice is quite soft, deepish but not strikingly so. It could plausibly be either a voice that hasn't broken or one where the speaker is deliberately moderating the depth.

By way of an example, here are two African players from the US women's soccer league.

Tthe first one is 'out' as 'intersex' [though probably regrets having ever admitting this so will only ever now refer to it in a very roundabout way], i.e. having a male DSD. The voice isn't super-deep but there's no attempt to spften it.

The second is merely suspected as having a male DSD and either has a midrange voice or makes an effort to lighten a deeper voice. Khelif's voice is to me much more like this second speaker.

As I say. I listen to men's voices all the time where they do female speaking parts. I also listen to female narrators doing male parts, including women with deep voices. I no longer read but listen to these books being read every day.

I notice no difference in Khelif's voice when I am listening and not looking to male voices. It is a voice of a male who is sounding 'feminine' in my opinion (it may be deliberate, it may be an ingrained habit or it might be natural). I have listened to him quite a few times and he never sounds like a female person.

Sorry, the point I am making is that I am sure that to some people Yu Ting and Khelif have voices that some people might find ambiguous to categorise. However, this is not universal.

Wrong about Khelif. Growth of the penis during puberty can be significant with 5-ard.

Agreed. Otherwise the colloquial term for 5-ARD would not be, "Penis at 12".

Given their track record, I do not trust the BBC one bit on this. Both reports talk about a successful appeal after documentation was submitted, but only the BBC talks about a test.
Is there any evidence Lin was tested again?

I understand this is colloquially referred to as 'penis at 12'. ( Sorry, just spotted someone else has already mentioned this)

I am interested in the statistics of probability that both boxers with a Y chromosome were able to get gold medals in the Olympics when competing against women if there was no significant advantage.

What about the statistical probablility of gold, silver and bronze medal winners in the women's 800m at the Rio 2016 Olympics, all having a Y chromosome, or that the silver medalist in that event, Francine Niyonsaba from Burundi, currently holds every national track record from 400m to 10,000m.

I know that both Khelif and Yu-ting were tested by the IBA in two labs in India and that it was revealed that both athletes had the same 46 XY DSD, something later confirmed by Khelif in an interview earlier this year. The IOC and the BBC have absolutely no credibility, when they report on this case.

https://www.france24.com/en/live-news/20260204-boxer-khelif-reveals-hormone-treatments-before-paris-olympics?fbclid=IwdGRzaAPx6cpjbGNrA_HpnGV4dG4DYWVtAjExAHNydGMGYXBwX2lkDDM1MDY4NTUzMTcyOAABHmDU3flpr6TJm0IDKx8-deTRch_y35a_HypLqtMxmMc_ZtSNOcODpHMg0NZL_aem_yZ2OOucrnoSj57H09A9mPA

Yes, I remember that, but now it's being said that Lin has CAIS, and hence not the same as Khelif? And female, in fact? Thoroughly confused.

It has not been ‘proven’ that Yu Ting is CAIS.

It is possible that he is PAIS and that someone has been convinced he has not had enough masculinisation to have an advantage. There is something gong on here that is inconsistent. IBC declared he had masculinised, now we are being told he has not.

As they can't be proved to be female they have no business in the female category.

End of.

Where did you read that Yu Ting is female?

It is possible that someone can have XX chromosomes but be male, eg. if they have an SRY gene attached to one of the X chromosomes.

It is the SRY gene, rather than an Y chromosome, that drives masculinisation.

I'm not saying that this is the case with Yu Ting, unless you have read that he has XX chromosomes with an SRY gene, which would still make him male.

If so, he would have 46,XX testicular DSD

Full details here:
https://rarediseases.info.nih.gov/diseases/399/46xx-testicular-disorder-of-sex-development

46,XX DSD - all types

Testicular DSD (46,XX)
"The gonade of a baby in the womb develop as testes, often because of the 'translocation' of the SRY gene from the Y to the X chromosome. This means that, prior to fertilisation, the SRY gene in the one fertilising sperm 'breaks off' the Y chromosome and 'attaches' itself to another chromosome (usually the X). And the presence of the SRY gene then kickstarrs the development of the gonads as testes."

1 / 20,000 men
https://www.dsdfamilies.org/parents/what-dsd/brief-overview/46xx-dsd

Wonder how the ioc ruling will influence this?

Yes I saw that today, hopefully it will have an effect

Some university "expert" on the ten o'clock news rn was against the ruling, and said the IOC was "using a sledgehammer to crack a nut"

I just have no words.

What an arsehole.

Professor Alun Williams, Sport and Exercise Genomics, Manchester Metropolitan University: "I am not surprised [by the decision] but I am disappointed. You're using a sledge hammer to crack a nut - in terms of the problem. You do not need genetic tests to regulate the participation of transgender women athletes. You can do that through other means. This new policy can only be interpreted of targeting those that are recorded as female at birth with a Difference of Sex Development (DSD) but that have some elements of male-like characteristics perhaps in their genetics or in their biology."

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/olympics/articles/cdj7dgvlj0no

🤦🏽‍♀️ Where do you even begin.

Tbh, he's not necessarily wrong. He seems though to be actually agreeing with what the IOC are doing. Perhaps if he takes a moment to think about it?

I get the impression that he thinks the IOC are doing this to target MtF transitioners and are accidentally excluding men with DSDs.

All the recent furore and by far the biggest problem to date, has been caused by men with DSDs.

The problems have been massively exacerbated by the greed of those who have deliberately sought out those men. If men with DSDs were cropping up only at an accidental level, in line with their prevalence in the general population, their inclusion in the women’s category would, quite possibly, never have had enough of a negative impact on women’s sports to have raised the objections that have led to this change.

It’s all about greed and the ultimate irony is that the reporting is all filled with fury about “trans” when there is very little impact on them, if you consider how few have competed until now. That’s likely because until 2015, such men had to have had orchiectomy, but transactivism never lets reality get in the way of a tantrum.

The whole thing is skewed.

Always with the “it’s just a few athletes” sympathy argument. Never flipping it and asking why the entire concept of sport being segregated by the sexes needs to be eroded for the benefit of “just a few athletes”.

I'm not saying they they shouldn't compete, I'm saying they need their own category.

A trans weight lifter won 1st place because they have a male body and the rest of the competitors are lifting with a female body.

Not equivalent, not equal.