How do navigate things with older/adult dc who are pro-trans ideology if you are not?

[Fancycrab]

Just wondering those of you who are GC and have teenagers or young adult dc who strongly support trans ideology, how do you navigate this? Do you just agree not to discuss it? Does it ever interfere with your relationship? My DD is still little but her dad, who I’m separated from is very pro trans rights and believes the whole gender ideology bollocks. I worry that he will brainwash DD into believing it too when she’s older and she’ll end up seeing me as the uncool, unprogressive one who just “doesn’t get it” 🙄

@onepostwonder

The villains, so to speak, are the people trying crowbar men into women’s toilets and changing rooms. It doesn’t matter what sex they are, or claim to be.

Men aren't and can never be women. The truth is that simple.

Some countries, representative of an accepting inclusive culture, passed laws extending protection for gender identity and expression as 'trans acceptance.' In those countries gender non-conforming people are provided special accommodation so that they may participate wholly in public spaces as their acquired gender. Even with these laws, a significant portion of trans people seek out third spaces so that their non-conformance doesn't attract undue attention or in some extreme cases, violence.

'Trans acceptance' is supported by more people than not: trans women are women and trans men are men. No one is trying to crowbar men into women's spaces. Trans people are not responsible for men that pretend to be trans to criminally target women and girls. These men would be criminally targeting women and girls without trans acceptance.

Why can't you accept, that most women do not want men, irrespective of how they identify, in their safe spaces. They simply do not want you there.
Why don't you go and live in one of these accepting, inclusive countries if it makes you feel better, but, I feel sorry for the women in those countries, because they probably feel the same as the majority of women in the UK, that their rights have been eroded, simply to make a tiny minority of men feel better.

'Trans acceptance' is supported by more people than not: trans women are women and trans men are men. No one is trying to crowbar men into women's spaces. Trans people are not responsible for men that pretend to be trans to criminally target women and girls. These men would be criminally targeting women and girls without trans acceptance.

It's just so much easier for them to target women and girls thanks to the lie that transwomen are women. Lucky for them, eh.

“'Trans acceptance' is supported by more people than not: trans women are women and trans men are men.”

And yet, even in those countries that have legislated that if a man says they are a woman. The majority of the population doesn’t actually believe “trans women are women and trans men are men.”

When polled, the majority of the population reject male people being included in female sports categories. That is, after all, the ultimate test. Because if a man can really be a female person, they would of course be naturally included in female sports categories.

It is almost like people repeat mantras to make others feel good but they don’t believe the mantras they repeat. Or they will say they agree with something in theory but when the reality is described will show that they really don’t agree.

“Trans people are not responsible for men that pretend to be trans to criminally target women and girls. These men would be criminally targeting women and girls without trans acceptance.”

When groups supporting male people accessing female single sex provisions reduced or removed safeguarding for those female people, they were indeed responsible for removing some of measures that protected female people. This cannot be denied. The responsibility for safeguarding failings is with those who demanded access to single sex provisions they should not be accessing.

Because sex realists do not speak on behalf of women. They speak on behalf of sex realists.

This is your belief.

"The ultimate test," if there is or should be one is whether a culture is supportive and inclusive of all people. Countries are very good at demonising groups of people.

They speak on behalf of women's legal rights

Jeeez. I’m sorry, that must be difficult. It’s sad when families can fall out so badly about politics. I think it needs to be put into perspective sometimes, no matter how strongly each person feels. None of it is personal to either side. Life is too short to fall out over differing political opinions. I just hope this is all over by the time my DD is a teenager! I think it can sometimes be a generational thing but I’m mid-30s and most of my friends my age believe in GI, at least to a certain extent. I actually don’t know anyone IRL (that I know of) who is strongly anti-GI. I know some who just don’t get it/don’t really care but no one that has thought critically about it and strongly disagrees

@oldtiredcyclist
Why don't you go and live in one of these accepting, inclusive countries if it makes you feel better...

I've lived in some of those countries. I've also had to visit some of the least hospitable countries for women. Countries where trans people are routinely tortured and put to death because they are trans. I liked this country, though we may move should it become any more conservative. I'm currently enjoying Italy.

I've never been questioned in women's spaces. I am not in need of special accommodation. I am not gender incongruent. My own personal use of women's spaces; toilets, locker rooms, etc. began when adults required discussions about the men's I entered and children shouted loud questions and comments at their parents. I am a woman. I am phenotypically female based on the interaction between my medically-affected genotype and social and cultural relationships affected by my body. I use the correct space. If I were to ever use men's spaces, it would probably be as an act of malicious compliance.

A common misunderstanding, but inclusivity doesn't mean allowing everybody into everything they want all the time.

Trans identifying people are not being excluded from anything. The provision, based on their sex, is there.

Women need single sex spaces to facilitate their own inclusion. Women of certain orthodox religions need space away from men. Women who've been abused by men need space away from men. Single sex facilities facilitate inclusion for women.

TLDR: This isn't all about what men want. Women have rights and needs.

Lots of groups speak of rights. They do not control or police public space.

It's a good thing trans women aren't men then. Women's rights are trans women's rights.

This is your belief.

This is your belief.

Of course they are men. You know that. Why do you keep lying about it?

The SCJ has clarified that women's rights to their own spaces are sex based. HTH.

Because it is onepost’s belief.

Apparently, that is just our belief too.

@onepostwonder while i don’t agree with with trans women having access to women’s spaces, i do have respect for you for coming on here (which i’m sure you know is one of the most anti-trans sites on the internet!) and trying to explain your point of view and staying calm throughout all the backlash. It’s something I wish more trans people could do. It’s really important to speak about issues like this rather than shutting people down and cancelling them when they don’t agree with you. I think healthy debate could make this issue less toxic but most trans people refuse to engage with anyone who doesn’t agree with them, instead just labelling them transphobic, which is unfair imo.

They issued a decision based on a question brought to them. They are not responsible for the direction groups have metastasised meaning into the decision. In the larger picture, this is hopefully a brief blip that will be smoothed out by clearer inclusive law and policy. If not, then external human rights oriented avenues exist.

Well I'm not living in a world that's just based on @onepostwonder beliefs.

No offence Onepost 😂