Isn’t AGP also what every woman experiences when they get dressed up & feel good about themselves?

[Theboredpanda]

I have no agenda here. I’ve always just been interested in exploring other perspectives of debates…although I’m sure this particular thought will get flamed on here and end up very one-sided indeed 🤣
I don’t believe every trans woman has AGP, but I believe a significant proportion do. And I’ve always considered that proportion to be creepy, I feel anger at the fact these men get to walk around, at least in some circles, socially accepted as women, just so they can satisfy a sexual fetish. However, I was thinking about how I feel as a woman who’s comfortable and happy about being a woman when I get dressed up in my favourite sexy outfit and put on some makeup. It makes me feel sexy. Not sexually aroused but I do feel sexy. Is that vastly different to what a trans woman feels like when they get dressed up and look (at least in their eyes) like a woman? Could it be that it’s either not AGP and we all feel sexy when we know we look good as the gender we are or want to be…or everyone’s a bit AGP when they think they look sexy because they therefore feel sexy? Or is this a totally unoriginal thought that’s already been troped out by TRAs and actually there is a huge difference??

"I have no agenda here" suuuuure.

Autogynephilia (AGP) refers to a male's (not womans) sexual arousal from the thought or image of themselves as a female, a concept often linked to some male-to-female (MtF) transsexuals, transvestites, and gender dysphoric male individuals. Not women. Not sure why you think clearly defined male paraphilia applies to women.

The experts on something they've never experienced. Ace.

THIS!

Have you got the 'satisfaction' you were seeking, OP?

'No' was one response. It was immediately added to with the explanation that you were conflating two things - feeling good about how you look, and AGP.

You ignored all the other responses. It's almost as if you had this 'Lol' post already typed and ready to go, so it didn't matter that posters actually engaged with the issue and gave you answers which were longer than 'No'.

But that would imply that you are not here in good faith to discuss the nuances of AGP vs. 'Hey I look good!'... surely not!

Sorry?

Wasn't it?
One could suggest spending some time checking out Dr Haz Akeem but the reading comprehension skills don't appear to be up to it.

Ok I suppose my agenda, if you want to call it that, is to see if it’s possible to have a reasonable discussion about trans people without being shouted down, flamed or totally shut down. I know pro-trans people have an inability to have any kind of reasonable discussion about it, hence cancelling people, labelling anyone who questions the ideology as transphobic etc but isn’t that what anti-trans people are always moaning about? “Why can’t we have a reasonable discussion about it?” Etc. You’re just as bad! This is why the debate is so toxic. No side has the ability to consider any perspective that might threaten their beliefs. It’s ignorance IMO. Ah it’s lonely being open-minded sometimes. But I’ve proved my point or “agenda” so I’ll go now.

One can only assume that the OP was hoping for lots of 'ooh yes, I regularly rub one out when I catch a fleeting glimpse of myself in the mirror!!!' responses from the women here.

I haven’t read the thread yet OP, but there is a difference between getting sexually aroused pretending to be the opposite sex to what you materially are and dressing in a way that you feel consider sexy but where you are not pretending to be the opposite sex for arousal purposes.

The two are not in any way similar

Open minded...right.

I know, right!

MyThreeWords Lots of men (not just AGP men) do seem to have the grotesque fantasy that women are aroused by their own bodies. Hence all the crap novel writing that has women fixating on their own breasts etc. But that is because men keep forgetting the difference between being an actual person and being a projection of their own desires.

That's an interesting point, and may explain the mystery of why 'girl-on-girl action' is interesting to men, when technically they should be feeling left out.
A woman fixating on another woman's breasts is obviously even more exciting that a woman fixating on her own..🙄

I know pro-trans people have an inability to have any kind of reasonable discussion about it, hence cancelling people, labelling anyone who questions the ideology as transphobic etc

Well, you were right about this at least, @Theboredpanda

Oh, come on, that's daft. I think it is you who are saying "No. Just no," to all of the posts disagreeing with you. And if you want 'nuance' and 'incredible complexity', why did you base your OP on making, and at the same time obscuring, the distinction between 'feeling sexy' and feeling sexually aroused?

Many posters have longed out that actually, you have misunderstood what AGP is. So it’s a bit daft throwing your toys out of the pram. And your last sentence in this post shows that in fact, it’s you that doesn’t want to debate.

You have had many posts explaining the difference clearly and reasonably. What are you wanting beyond that? You have immediately switched to the behaviour that you apparently dislike, which is name calling and attacking rather than having a reasoned debate.

You come across as a man hoping to have a discussion about sex rather than someone with a genuine question. It might just be the way you write of course.

I think @Theboredpanda must just be very bored.

Imagine if women did get intensely sexually aroused when dressing ourselves, or catching a glimpse of our beauteous selves, fully clothed, in a mirror.

Children would go unfed, jobs unperformed, houses untidied, as we frotted away in front of our mirrors.

This does not happen.

Because we are not men with fetishes.

We are women.

The question I want answered is do pandas experience AGP?

I think that pandas look in the mirror and think they are sexy, and then they look at their contrarian posts and think that they are insightful.

Ok I suppose my agenda, if you want to call it that, is to see if it’s possible to have a reasonable discussion about trans people without being shouted down, flamed or totally shut down.
Well you got that - lots of reasonable points about the nature of AGP etc. - even a reference to Greek mythology, for heaven's sake, what more do you want?😄

Being told 'No' is not being shouted down - but I understand that being told 'No' may come as a shock to some people..

And then the predictable 'I've proved that you're all bigots' and they've gone!

I know the theory is that these 'ploppers' come on here to harvest bigoted transphobic posts to tut tut over on Reddit, but they keep coming away without having found any, because we don't do bigoted transphobic posts, so why do they bother?
Unless they edit our posts of course so they fit their requirements.

The confusion arises from an unacknowledged mental slither between two different meanings of "feeling sexy":

1. Feeling confident of one's likely sexual attractiveness to others, and pleased about it.
2. Feeling physically aroused (in the case of AGP, by contemplating oneself).

Somebody could feel only 1. or only 2. or both. They're not the same thing.

So if you really want a debate, would you respond to my point about the distinction you yourself made between feeling sexy and feeling sexually aroused. Would you consider unpicking what you mean by 'feeling sexy' and see if it matches the meaning I gave to it in my post? Why aren't you actually engaging in debate?

Well, you know what pandas are like - eats, shoots and leaves...