Page 7 | Government announces 10 Million pound boost to protect Muslim communities

happydappy2 · 2025-10-23T11:58:02+00:00

[[https://x.com/DadRogd/status/1981327249870569889 https://x.com/DadRogd/status/1981327249870569889]] this money will go towards CCTV, alarms and fencing round mosques…. Meanwhile there are SO MANY other areas of the country that are desperate for a financial boost….Why is this one religion put on a pedestal? This particular religion that doesn’t treat women as equals.

Underthecoffeetable · 23/10/2025 23:16

I suppose you could question why religious groups in particular are eligible for funding from the government for these security measures - but not other organisations.

Especially as many I presume do have the money to pay for these measures (fences, CCTV) themselves because people value their religious buildings and often donate to it.

Unfortunately vandalism is common across a wide range of community assets. Had it happen to those I am involved with.

And there are many public places that could do with more or better CCTV. Saying this have been assaulted in an area where apparently that was pretty common (!), but no CCTV.

Bringemout · 23/10/2025 23:23

RawBloomers · 23/10/2025 19:20

For most women in the UK, of all the religions it is Christianity that has had the most misogynistic impact on their lives. E.g. the culture around unmarried mothers was absolutely brutal before the 60s and not great after, still isn’t fair. And that is largely down to Christian morality shaping social attitudes. Rape in marriage not being criminal until the 90s was down to Christian attitudes to women. The history of denying women education and leadership positions and appropriate careers that we have still not fully overcome - down to Christian attitudes to women’s “place”. And less explosive but more all encompassing things like the attitudes what women wear, Etc. all shaped by the Christian Church.

All of this has affected me. From the impact on my grandmother of being illegitimate, to the abysmal situation my mother was in as a single mother in the 70s and 80s. The school curriculum, and uniform. Sexist expectations about what we should do in Church, Guides, School, etc. Career availability. Attitudes to sexuality. And on. It’s only really the last few decades that it has become not okay for people to say “Well it’s not very Christian” to back up sexist social pressure. And there;s still some pressure there, it’s just no longer as popular with the majority.

And the Chruches themselves have not become bastions of equality. The Catholic Church is still chockingly sexist. The Church of England is finally allowing women an almost equal opportunity at leadership, but they are committed to TWAW, so still plenty of misogyny there. The Churches that don’t have great hierarchies have tended not to have such obvious stands against women’s equality, but they still tend to have a fair number of social attitudes that are pretty sexist.

So when people say - “look at the awful, sexist Muslims”, those of us who say “Hold a minute, they are people like Christians.” aren’t necessarily thinking “No, they’re wonderful!” (I’m certainly not). We’re just giving you the side eye thinking, “Right, cause Christians are so great. </sarcasm>”

(Edited as realised had made assumption about poster’s faith).

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I think you are minimising the experience of non conforming minorities. How many girls have been honour killed by Christians. We have examples in the muslim, hindu and sikh communities. Forced marriage is still an issue, FGM etc.

I’m sorry your family have had a tough time but to think that the church in the Uk is as bad as what some religious minority women face is just not true. How many female preachers do you think there are in mosques? Do you think if you are Muslim you can be out and proud gay? i’ve had gay friends who literally had to move to the other side of the country because they are terrified of their own families, they were all men, how do you think the lesbians fare?

It’s a comforting lie that white people tell themselves so they don’t have to look too closely at minorities and say “hang on a second…” you get woke points while ignoring injustice.

Bringemout · 23/10/2025 23:25

Sorry that had nothing to do with the thread, but seriously. The church of england isn’t doing chats on the appropriate way to stone women.

Underthecoffeetable · 23/10/2025 23:30

Bringemout · 23/10/2025 23:25

Sorry that had nothing to do with the thread, but seriously. The church of england isn’t doing chats on the appropriate way to stone women.

I have been told by a "Christian" (though not CofE) that in their country I would be killed for being gay. In a manner that suggested approvingly. No Muslims however.

Underthecoffeetable · 23/10/2025 23:36

Oh no a bit of googling and the Church of Uganda, which supported Uganda’s Anti-Homosexuality Act is part of the Anglican Communion. Huh. The Act calls for the death penalty for homosexuality.

Allisnotlost1 · 23/10/2025 23:44

ThatZanyFatball · 23/10/2025 22:39

By definition, Orthodox anything is not mainstream. I agree that most organized religions and their historical doctrine doesn't align with modern feminist values, but to jump from "orthodox" practices to "mainstream" of the 3 main religions is a big stretch. Mainstream judiasm and Christianity, while also flawed, don't come close to oppressive nature of mainstream Islam. I don't know too many average, mainstream Christian or Jewish women who aren't allowed to drive a car, be alone in a room who isn't her husband, or put on a headscarf whenever she leaves the house. Your argument is ingenuine.

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And I don’t know any Muslim women who are prevented from driving, or being in a room with a man, or forced to wear hijab. Of course some Muslim women in the UK experience these behaviours, which I consider as abhorrent as Jewish women being ostracised while menstruating, or Catholic women being prevented from accessing contraception or abortion. I still don’t think those women, or the men who impose these rules on them, deserve to be the victims of hate crime. Because that’s often who do bear the brunt of these things. Women who are visibly Muslim, or Jewish. What kind of feminist are you?

Allisnotlost1 · 23/10/2025 23:58

Bringemout · 23/10/2025 23:23

I think you are minimising the experience of non conforming minorities. How many girls have been honour killed by Christians. We have examples in the muslim, hindu and sikh communities. Forced marriage is still an issue, FGM etc.

I’m sorry your family have had a tough time but to think that the church in the Uk is as bad as what some religious minority women face is just not true. How many female preachers do you think there are in mosques? Do you think if you are Muslim you can be out and proud gay? i’ve had gay friends who literally had to move to the other side of the country because they are terrified of their own families, they were all men, how do you think the lesbians fare?

It’s a comforting lie that white people tell themselves so they don’t have to look too closely at minorities and say “hang on a second…” you get woke points while ignoring injustice.

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How many female preachers do you think there are in mosques?

The answer is, no-one knows across the board. But there are women in some senior positions in Islam, and efforts by women to found women led prayers, mosques etc. the fact is, women have only been ordained in the church since 1994 and still only make up about 30% of the clergy. All religions have created a barrier for women, lucky us that we live in a country where legislative and cultural changes have eventually allowed women to force change.

RawBloomers · 24/10/2025 00:17

Bringemout · 23/10/2025 23:23

I think you are minimising the experience of non conforming minorities. How many girls have been honour killed by Christians. We have examples in the muslim, hindu and sikh communities. Forced marriage is still an issue, FGM etc.

I’m sorry your family have had a tough time but to think that the church in the Uk is as bad as what some religious minority women face is just not true. How many female preachers do you think there are in mosques? Do you think if you are Muslim you can be out and proud gay? i’ve had gay friends who literally had to move to the other side of the country because they are terrified of their own families, they were all men, how do you think the lesbians fare?

It’s a comforting lie that white people tell themselves so they don’t have to look too closely at minorities and say “hang on a second…” you get woke points while ignoring injustice.

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How do you think the Muslim women who are poorly treated by their families are helped by allowing criminals to terrorize mosques?

I would love to see the legal exemptions for sex discrimination on the basis of religion got rid of. I’d love to see religious preaching that marginalized women or proscribed what they could do curtailed. And considered not catered to.

But I’m not fighting for it to be applied to a minority religion while Christianity gets a free pass. If it applied to the Christian church it would have a positive impact on a lot more women. (Lets not forget, the CofE’s homophobia and disregard for women drove the creation of the GRC legislation. There’s nothing woke about complaining about that.)

I’m no fan of Islam. I talk out about the impact of the Christian Churches because they are a far bigger influence on women in the UK. So yes, despite the abysmal treatment some Muslim women suffer in the UK, I find it highly hypocritical to use the sexism in Islam as an excuse to decry public money on crime prevention for Muslim buildings when it is also spent on Christian ones.

Ryvitaandmarmite · 24/10/2025 00:19

It’s not a huge amount of money. I hope it will contribute to Muslim community feeling safer .

MarthaBeach · 24/10/2025 00:27

Don't start threads with an OP based on something you read on X.

That's the equivalent of hearing someone shouting in a pub.

Read intelligent sources, on websites that have some accountability for fact-checking and verifying.

HTH

Livelovebehappy · 24/10/2025 00:58

Agree with you OP. I live in a region with a high number of mosques. All of which already have CCTV and robust security. So I can’t see what this money is going to be used for. Probably mis-used and mis-appropriated, like a lot of this Governments pet projects.

Livelovebehappy · 24/10/2025 01:02

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ThatZanyFatball · 24/10/2025 04:14

Allisnotlost1 · 23/10/2025 23:44

And I don’t know any Muslim women who are prevented from driving, or being in a room with a man, or forced to wear hijab. Of course some Muslim women in the UK experience these behaviours, which I consider as abhorrent as Jewish women being ostracised while menstruating, or Catholic women being prevented from accessing contraception or abortion. I still don’t think those women, or the men who impose these rules on them, deserve to be the victims of hate crime. Because that’s often who do bear the brunt of these things. Women who are visibly Muslim, or Jewish. What kind of feminist are you?

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No where did I say Muslims or anyone deserves to be victims of hate crimes. My post was intended to point out your blatently manipulative straw man argument equating present practices in Islam with present, mainstream Judaism and Christianity - which has nothing to do with the funding or lack thereof of security measures or hate crimes. This is why frankly I, like others, believe this whole thread was started by a fake post just to drum up a bunch of troll comments.

ThatZanyFatball · 24/10/2025 04:27

OverDram · 23/10/2025 22:43

So your saying in mainstream Islam you can’t drive cars as a women?! Since when. And remember you said mainstream

Noted and edited. I came across a situation where I was working with a Muslim female client who didn't drive due to religious factors, and others in the office said they had more than one client like that, so made the assumption based on personal experience but you're right, i cannot claim it is mainstream practice based on that experience alone.

NumbersGuy · 24/10/2025 04:42

So according to the UK 2021 census, there was just under 4 million Muslims, so breaking down the 10 million pounds that is an average of 2.5 pounds per person, which is of course less since that number has increased in the last 4 years. This is only 6-6.5% of the total population. However for religious hate crime, Muslims accounted for 44% for the year ending in March 2025 according to police statistics. So how is this putting anyone on a "pedestal" and just trying to keep people safe? People who pay taxes, like everyone else, but only 2 pounds of their total annual taxes will go towards their safety so it would be nice if people actually did some research before speaking out of turn first.

GaIadriel · 24/10/2025 04:57

Underthecoffeetable · 23/10/2025 23:30

I have been told by a "Christian" (though not CofE) that in their country I would be killed for being gay. In a manner that suggested approvingly. No Muslims however.

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And yet no other religion sees it's followers sexually assaulting 1200 European women in a single night. There are no other comparable examples in recent western history aside from those perpetrated by Muslim men. It's tied in with the view that women who aren't modest deserve it.

Unless you can tell me when Christian men assaulted over a thousand women in one night in modern Europe?

NCReceptor · 24/10/2025 06:03

It’s absolutely ludicrous to pretend you can equate present day Islam and present day Christianity in terms of their treatment of women as some have tried to do on this thread.

To ignore the separation of secular law from religious doctrine that is seen in Christianity and stands in opposition to Islam’s unified rule based sharia is absurd.

Howseitgoin · 24/10/2025 06:04

The attackers were alleged to be specifically from North Africa where the Cologne police chief suggested that the perpetrators had come from countries where such sexual assaults by groups of men against women are common. So to blame this purely on religion & not crime ridden specific countries where it isn't policed properly is false.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2015%E2%80%9316_New_Year%27s_Eve_sexual_assaults

2015–16 New Year's Eve sexual assaults - Wikipedia

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2015%E2%80%9316_New_Year's_Eve_sexual_assaults

TakeMe2Insanity · 24/10/2025 06:10

GCAcademic · 23/10/2025 13:23

Churches are mouldering because they are not being used. They aren’t routinely being vandalised and their congregations attacked by people hostile to their faith.

It’s like there’s been an invasion of the Tommy Robinson fanclub on here.

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Agree, Tommy Robinson fans have found mumsnet.

Bringemout · 24/10/2025 06:15

RawBloomers · 24/10/2025 00:17

How do you think the Muslim women who are poorly treated by their families are helped by allowing criminals to terrorize mosques?

I would love to see the legal exemptions for sex discrimination on the basis of religion got rid of. I’d love to see religious preaching that marginalized women or proscribed what they could do curtailed. And considered not catered to.

But I’m not fighting for it to be applied to a minority religion while Christianity gets a free pass. If it applied to the Christian church it would have a positive impact on a lot more women. (Lets not forget, the CofE’s homophobia and disregard for women drove the creation of the GRC legislation. There’s nothing woke about complaining about that.)

I’m no fan of Islam. I talk out about the impact of the Christian Churches because they are a far bigger influence on women in the UK. So yes, despite the abysmal treatment some Muslim women suffer in the UK, I find it highly hypocritical to use the sexism in Islam as an excuse to decry public money on crime prevention for Muslim buildings when it is also spent on Christian ones.

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I’ve said on this thread I have no problem with mosques receiving additional funding so I don’t know how you got that from my post. The point is that pretending that Christianity has a larger negative impact than Islam on women is just not true as practiced today is just not true. There was a case of a woman having to buy herself out of her marriage

https://www.thetimes.com/uk/society/article/sharia-law-women-marriage-wedding-3gtt6xk8v

I’m an atheist, I don’t have much truck with anyone’s religion but I’m seriously surprised that there are people on this thread trying to claim that theres less misogyny and homophobia in Islam. In the texts I’m sure theres not much difference. But how it’s practiced is vastly different.

Bringemout · 24/10/2025 06:16

Underthecoffeetable · 23/10/2025 23:30

I have been told by a "Christian" (though not CofE) that in their country I would be killed for being gay. In a manner that suggested approvingly. No Muslims however.

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My friend is terrified his cousins are going to beat the shit out of him. Thats not “if this was a Christian country you’d be dead”. Thats a “if they find out I’m gay I’m going to end up in a hospital bed”. Obviously thats not every family but don’t try to minimise someone else fear,

chocolatesauceisfab · 24/10/2025 06:46

MrsBennetsPoorNervesAreBack · 23/10/2025 14:30

Exactly. The Bible is full of misogyny, and conservative Christian churches continue to perpetuate this, but somehow it is only Islam that is the problem?

I don't like any religion imposing misogynistic views on its followers, but i don't think that means that the followers should be subjected to hate crime.

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"The Bible is full of misogyny, and conservative Christian churches continue to perpetuate this,"

I'm not sure what you mean by "conservative" ?

Westboro Baptist Church ?

WarriorN · 24/10/2025 06:55

The government announce things like this all the time.

some makes the news and some doesn’t.

some people make sure it makes the news in order to shape certain narratives in the news.

EasternStandard · 24/10/2025 07:16

NCReceptor · 24/10/2025 06:03

It’s absolutely ludicrous to pretend you can equate present day Islam and present day Christianity in terms of their treatment of women as some have tried to do on this thread.

To ignore the separation of secular law from religious doctrine that is seen in Christianity and stands in opposition to Islam’s unified rule based sharia is absurd.

Edited

It really is. The funding question aside those posts are not correct.

ContentedAlpaca · 24/10/2025 07:21

Our local mosque does not need it. They do a massive amount for charity including donating tens of thousands of meals via a local church. They can fund their own CCTV.